Hosea 11:1; Revelation 18:4, 5; 1 Corinthians 1:9; Philippians 3:7 - 15

G.R.C. I thought we might be helped in conversing on these four items, connected with the call of God. Firstly, the call out of Egypt, then the call out of Babylon, and then the call into the fellowship of His Son Jesus Christ our Lord, and finally the calling on high. The calling of God, because it is the calling of God, is of supreme importance. It says in Psalm 50, "God, Elohim -- Jehovah, hath spoken, and called the earth from the rising of the sun unto the going down thereof". His voice carries an authority which no other voice could, and that Psalm connects it with the shining forth of God. "Out of Zion, the perfection of beauty, God hath shined forth". The calling has what is wonderfully positive behind it; the shining forth of God in the face of a glorified Man, the Man Christ Jesus. And the perfection of beauty is in Him; that is, that not only is God shining forth radiantly in Jesus glorified in His presence, but we see in Christ also the perfect answer to the call. The perfection of beauty -- not only the Urim but the Thummim, not only the perfection of light, that is God shining forth in Jesus, but in the same Person is the perfect answer to the brilliant light that is now shining. It is in the light of all that that the call reaches us. It is a wonderful call because it is a call to glory -- the calling on high. The One who is there, the One who established God's glory on the cross and

who is therefore now glorified, and God's glory shining in His face -- which we ought to be acquainted with: the face of Jesus -- He is our righteousness, He is our claim; and having Him as our righteousness we have a divine title to be where He is. And the calling calls us there, it calls us to where Jesus is, the calling on high.

But, that being so, it must be a call out, because God's glory is not shining in Egypt, and God's glory is not shining in Babylon. All that is in Egypt and in Babylon would obscure the glory from our gaze. But the whole thing is most attractive. Even in the first scripture we read, the attractiveness of it is emphasised -- "Out of Egypt have I called my son". The calling involves sonship -- many sons to glory. And for the many sons that God foreknew, what a place he has prepared! He has given us Christ as our righteousness, so that where Christ is we can be.

H.P. Would the first scripture link on with the Epistle to the Romans in chapter 1: 7, "beloved of God, called saints"? And then in chapter 8 it is also those whom He has called, that is in view of sonship.

G.R.C. Yes. And it goes on, these also He justified and glorified. Romans might well be studied from that angle -- the call of God and what He has done for the subjects of His call.

J.L.W. Is there any better glad tidings than that?

G.R.C. I am sure you do not know of any.

J.L.W. There is no need to dilute the gospel, to make it popular; but to present these precious and rich thoughts of divine grace into the gospel according to God.

G.R.C. Well, nothing that man could add to it can improve it. It can only detract, because the

gospel is so wonderful. It is a call from the glory to the glory. And if that is apprehended by the soul, what is involved in it in the way of negative things is incidental. We have heard a voice from glory which called us to the glory. Before we ever moved or thought of Him we were sons in purpose. Out of Egypt have I called my son.

Ques. Did not Peter say they heard a voice "by the excellent glory"?

G.R.C. Yes, and Hebrews suggests that that voice is still being heard because it says, "See that ye refuse not him that speaks". He speaks from heaven.

P.H. Does not this shew intense feelings on the part of God, because right at the outset God calls to man, does He not? He says, Where art thou? God calls to Adam after the distance had been brought in. And is it not this that gives us a real sense of the urge in God's heart towards His creature man?

G.R.C. And at that early date, having discovered in some degree to man the distance into which he had got, God shows how He is going to justify him, by making the coats of skin. Now, we know that God not only justifies but glorifies. The voice now comes from the glory and calls to the glory those who are entirely fitted for glory by the work of Christ and by Divine workmanship in the soul through the gift of the Spirit. It is a most wonderful thing to be called of God. But not everybody answers to the call. In fact who of us has fully answered to the call? My own impression is that as the call reaches us through the gospel. God would give us at the outset a touch of the highest things. If anyone here feels they have not had much impression as to this call, today is the time. If any young people here feel they have not

had much touch as to the heights to which God has called them, now is the time, because I believe God would have us enter into that. You see, Paul at the close of his life in prison is still pursuing towards the call; it does not mean that he had not been pursuing it from the day he was converted. He had a wonderful impression of it at his conversion because he preached Jesus that He is the Son of God. God calls us from that place where Jesus is, glorified in His presence. He calls us from there and He calls us to there. So that should become our home even now; the holiest is open to us all. He calls us from glory to glory and the glorified Man in whom we see God's glory shining is our righteousness, so that we can go there with all boldness. That is open to the new believers we may say, the ones just begotten again by the living and abiding word of God. And so if we get a sense of that, and I believe God would give it, it will help us much with the negative side.

Ques. Is your thought that from one view point we should be occupied with the blessings which are ours -- that is the way God occupies us with His thoughts?

G.R.C. Yes. Quite so. From the point of view of which we are speaking He has called us into the highest things, the calling on high of God in Christ Jesus; something far beyond that which angels or any other creatures, as far as we know, are called into. We are called into the very highest things, the highest level. As far as we can see from scripture, no other creature will have such a call -- to such bliss and nearness to God -- God to be our everlasting portion as being immediately near to Him, as far as the creature can be. Well, it is a wonderful calling; and

then down here in the light of that to serve Him as sons. Out of Egypt have I called my son.

J.L.W. You are linking that with the word we get in Exodus, "Let my son go that he may serve me".

G.R.C. Yes. How wonderful are the thoughts of God. "Israel is my son, my firstborn". Although Israel is the firstborn of earthly families, it was written typically primarily for us. Think of that, that God should be calling out of a state of nature's darkness and degradation in which man was at the time of the cross, both Jew and Gentile, that God should be calling us out of similar degradation today -- He is indeed calling us out of everything here as His firstborn sons, no other thought in His mind.

Rem. You are thinking of that as over against what it might have been, had He said, 'I have called my people'? You are thinking of the dignity of the position -- sonship.

G.R.C. "My son, my firstborn". And all that would draw out our affections to serve God with whole hearts, with firstborn affections -- the service of the firstborn. The priests were of the same family. The firstborn were called upon to undertake exalted services down here -- the priests of God and of Christ down here in this world in the nearness of our blessed place of relationship -- to take up intercession on behalf of rulers as well as men generally, intercession and thanksgiving; what a place we have! It is the firstborn sons of God whom He is listening to. I have listened to thee, He says, in a well accepted time. It is quite right to apply that in the gospel; but primarily it refers to Christ, as we know, in the prophet where it is quoted from. But in the time in which Paul was writing it would have a special

application to him -- the ministry he was carrying as a Levite, as a priest. God is listening to His priests, even in His ordering the government of the world; and in His care for all men: "He is the preserver of all men". In our supplications, we can supplicate God in relation to every aspect in which He is presented to us. We can supplicate Him as Creator; there may be famine and shortages. We can supplicate Him as preserver in government, the preserver of all men, saving them from destroying themselves. We have, rightly, some fears of the atom bomb and the hydrogen bomb and things like that; that fear enters into our hearts sometimes; but we are here as representing God as the preserver of all men. He has His firstborn ones here who are making intercession to Him in the priest's office and praying for these men who have these powers in their hands, praying that they may be held in His hand, that His creatures might be preserved. And above all, as to men, we can approach Him as the Saviour. Think of how He has saved us, not only a negative salvation, saved us from wrath, from sins, from Egypt; but what a salvation -- how great salvation -- that our place should be in the holiest of all.

J.L.W. Does all that help, in the experience of our souls, in getting rid of Egypt, getting free of it?

G.R.C. Yes, for how can we take up this service of the firstborn unless we are free of Egypt? Taking thee out of the people, He says to Paul, and from among the nations to whom I have sent thee. He could not be sent to them unless he was taken out. And therefore the Lord Jesus called His own when He was here on earth and took them out of the world, and then sent them into the world; not to

fraternise, not to be friends with the world but to represent God in it, and serve Him in it as the firstborn.

Ques. Were you thinking of the words of Jesus when He said, I have chosen you out of the world?

G.R.C. Yes. We are no use to God in the world unless we are out of it. The call takes you out of it; and if we answer to that call God says, Now I will send you into it to be for Me in it. And what a privilege!

Rem. It would help if we could see the way the Holy Spirit would give us to appreciate the glory so that we could look upon men from God's side.

G.R.C. Well, He brings Divine feelings into our souls, does He not? Our thoughts and our feelings as well as our actions and words should flow from the Holy Spirit. He is the source of all within. The word says, My Spirit shall not always plead with man. But whom is the pleading coming through? It is coming from men in whom the feelings of the Spirit are wrought.

Rem. Now, do you not get an illustration in Acts 7, where Stephen, a man full of the Holy Spirit, says to the council, "The God of glory appeared to our father Abraham ... and said to him, go out of thy land"?

G.R.C. That is the point. Abraham was the great example. The God of glory appeared to him; so it was a call to glory, because he looked on to see Christ's day; he looked for a city. But the call was a call out, "Go out". We cannot be available to God unless we go out, not in the literal sense, physically. And as to the Spirit and the gospel, which have been referred to; I would like to be more available for the

Spirit in the preaching -- to express Divine feelings instead of being occupied with a good subject.

Ques. Is it not all secured for God by being in the current of the Spirit?

G.R.C. Yes, because there is nothing outside of Him.

Rem. The glad tidings were preached by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven.

G.R.C. I find it has been a special danger with me to want to be occupied with the subject. But "My Spirit shall not always plead with man". If only we could be available for the Spirit in His service as pleading with men, getting alongside of men. We must not limit the gospel to one hour a week on Sunday.

Rem. I am sure it is essential that we do not do that.

G.R.C. The living water should be flowing all the time. "He that believes on me, as the scripture has said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water". We need to keep on coming to Jesus glorified. All those comings to Him in the gospel refer to coming to a glorified Jesus now. Therefore, "If anyone thirst, let him come to me and drink", He said. What do we thirst about? We thirst for our own need of course. In human matters we get thirsty several times a day, and so we ought to come to Jesus several times a day just for drink; and we ought to come to Him more than once a day for food -- "He that comes to me shall never hunger", John 6. We keep on coming to Jesus. That is what living by faith means. We are continually entering the presence of God and finding our heart's satisfaction in the glorified Man. Then you begin to thirst for other things. You begin to

thirst from the Divine standpoint, not from your own. You want men to be saved -- "For this is good and acceptable before our Saviour God, who desires that all men should be saved", 1 Timothy 2. And so you see the living water begins to flow out -- Divine feelings towards men. That ought to be going on day by day.

Rem. Philip was so in touch with the Spirit that he could be ready immediately to go and join himself to the eunuch's chariot, and starting at that same scripture he preached unto him Jesus.

G.R.C. Well, it has been interesting to me just lately to see that in the book of Acts it appears as if the Spirit gives the immediate directions; the Lord gives the long term directions. The Lord gives a long term direction as to Paul, all that he would do; He gives a fairly long term direction as to Corinth -- "I have much people in this city", Acts 18; it was quite a big thing in view. And so elsewhere, that Paul must testify in Rome, and so on. The Lord tells him those things. But when it comes to the hour by hour action, you get the direction of the Holy Spirit. The sudden word to Philip, "approach and join this chariot", Acts 8. Then a sudden word to Peter, "Go down, and go with them, nothing doubting, because I have sent them". The word at Antioch, "Separate me now, Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them". Then Paul in Acts 16 was forbidden to go there, and so on. There are other passages, the brethren telling Paul by the Spirit not to go to Jerusalem -- the immediate direction for the next step. You do not get much of that once Paul is in prison, but the beginning of Acts seems to show what is normal; and I am sure we all desire to get back

to what is normal and to have daily and hourly direction by the Spirit for divine service of any form.

H.P. The close of the book shows the availability of the Spirit. One word as to Paul in Acts 28:25 -- Paul having spoken one word -- "Well spoke the Holy Spirit through Esaias the prophet". He actually gets the word for the moment.

G.R.C. Yes, he does not say there that Esaias spoke by the Spirit, but the Spirit spoke by Esaias.

Rem. That is how it should be, should it not? He spoke in relation to ordinary matters, "you are not the speakers but the Spirit of your Father".

G.R.C. Yes, we want to get back to the beginning, as far as we can; and I have felt, as to that, how we should avoid human organisation. It comes natural to us, immediately something gets going, to think 'We had better organise'. But you do not find that in Acts. The Spirit of God -- if we might speak of any organisation -- organises things by these immediate directions, and each servant stood responsible to Him and to the Lord. It is true, Paul had one or two younger men given to him -- God can do that -- and he would direct Timothy and direct Titus. Generally speaking, that was all part of Paul's service, they were assisting him. But, normally, the Spirit raises up who is needed to do certain work; and it is much better to leave them to do it than for us to try to appoint somebody. We have seen the effect of organisation in other things. Now it seems to me if we begin to organise with our human minds, even if we are capable organisers in ordinary matters of life, we shall find Satan a better organiser than we are and he will take it out of our hands. It rejoices my heart to see in the last year or two how the Spirit of God

has raised up this one here and that one there all over the earth. Certain men have come to light. We wouldn't have chosen them but they have come to light and they are giving a spiritual lead.

Rem. And yet there is order is there not? Under the guidance of the Spirit there must be order.

G.R.C. Certainly; God is not the Author of confusion.

H.P. Actually, what was seen in Egypt and Babylon was the acme of order according to man, was it not?

G.R.C. Yes, Egypt is one aspect of the world, as well ordered and organised as men would speak; and Babylon is another aspect; but we have to come out of them.

J.L.W. I enjoyed the touch as to access, because it is not only a question of coming out but of coming in, is it not?

G.R.C. That is right, I am sure. God has not only called us out but has called us in to the fellowship of His Son, and that is something that is down here. We have spoken of the calling on high. He has called us up, and the Holiest is always open to us; but we are called into something down here. What do you say about that?

J.L.W. I was thinking of what God said to Abraham: "In the land that I will shew thee" -- a land of waterbrooks which is described in Deuteronomy.

G.R.C. Yes, as you proceed in the scriptures you learn what a good land it was in Deuteronomy.

Ques. Is not that a similar thought to Philip being directed to go to Gaza in the desert where the Spirit was and where He would initiate the service?

G.R.C. That is right, and although it was a desert

place, living waters were flowing through Philip; and, you know, according to the Lord's suggestion, rivers of living water can flow from one man. One living believer -- believing as a state of soul, that is believing all the time, and always coming to Him -- could water the whole earth. There is no shortage of water however desert-like the earth is. So before he found the water for baptism, which is more the negative side, there was living water flowing out of Philip. I believe if we made more room for the Spirit arranging things, we should find more living water everywhere, as you were saying, "A land of waterbrooks, of springs, and of deep waters, that gush forth in the valleys and hills", Deuteronomy 8:7.

Ques. Could you help us as to how to make way for the Spirit?

G.R.C. Well, the continual thing is the conflict between flesh and Spirit, is it not? It is humbling when you have been on the road for forty, fifty, sixty or more years to find that has still to go on. That is Romans 7 and 8. The flesh lusts against the Spirit and the Spirit against the flesh. That is a daily matter.

Rem. In Acts 13, as they were ministering to the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said; that is like the conditions in which the Spirit's direction is known?

G.R.C. I think that is the line on which you get the gain of the Spirit collectively. I was just referring to the individual side and our impressions years ago; and I believe they were right. But what overshadows those impressions is that when we come together, for what has come to be called a 'ministry meeting', we should come together as ministering to the Lord and fasting; and then the Holy Spirit will speak. That is

how we began -- ministry meetings -- years ago, before they became so general. But, you see, we have dropped into a habit of a hymn and a prayer and then we have waited for two or three words, however long we had to wait, and then we have had a hymn and a prayer. If that has become an automatic matter, I cannot see much that is of the Spirit of God in it; it is just a kind of routine, and some of the words may have been forced on that account -- something had got to be done. Whereas if we come buoyantly together to minister to the Lord -- we are expecting Him to speak; but we come together to minister to Him first. There need not be any forcing, because if a word is not coming immediately you can still sing another hymn to the Lord and praise His name, and the Spirit of God would, I believe, be in that and it would be a buoyant occasion; and when the word came it would be refreshing.

Rem. We raised an exercise some while ago and I judge we were helped, and I suppose it is right. We seemed to get help on that line.

G.R.C. Well, I do not remember any other specific occasion in Acts as an example of a meeting convened where the actual words the Spirit said are stated -- a definite word from the Spirit. I have always felt this was a guide; and I am only submitting it to the brethren. We come together to minister to the Lord, not just thinking I am going to get something or there will be some words tonight; but we are priests and we are ministering to the Lord. He knows that we have come together hoping and expecting a word from Him and He will give it by the Spirit. We have come together expecting manifestations of the Spirit but on our side we are ministering to the Lord.

J.L.W. It speaks of Moses going in to speak to Him, and when he was there God spoke to him.

G.R.C. That is a very interesting scripture in that connection. He went in to speak to God.

Rem. So it could be that the actual word given could be very brief, and the greater part of the time be given up to ministering to the Lord's heart.

G.R.C. Well, the word in Acts 13 was very brief. I do not suppose they expected that at all. What had they come together for? Probably they expected a word or two in ministry but the word that is given is "Separate me now Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them"; and you can imagine the rest of the meeting being a prayer meeting, with all that that implied -- getting a definite word like that from the Spirit, and the saints thoroughly in line. They laid their hands on them.

J.L.W. It does say, "then having fasted and prayed, they laid their hands on them". So they continued, did they not?

G.R.C. I think one aspect of the fasting means that you have no favourite brothers. You fast in that sense, you deny all natural proclivities -- preferences. We think we would like to hear Mr. So and So every time and if he does not get up we are a bit disappointed. But that won't do at all; that is not fasting. And the choice, too, of the Holy Spirit! Why Barnabas and Saul -- Saul at the bottom of the list! We could have well argued, I think, that Barnabas should take one of those others with him; 'I don't think Saul should come into it; why, he has only just recently come to Antioch and he used to persecute us; I think one of these who have been in the faith longer should go with Barnabas'. But you see, all

that was shut out. Just the will of the Lord be done. That was the thing.

Rem. You are thinking that every feature of human intelligence should be set aside in order to get the Spirit's mind.

G.R.C. That is what I thought, because we may have special affection, rightly may be, for a brother. He may have helped us in particular, may have helped me in particular, and I may think, 'well, I think the Spirit ought to have chosen him'. But you see, it is His sovereign will.

Rem. That helps. I think one's own thoughts have been rather limited, and what you are saying gives one a wider view of what is implied by the Spirit acting.

G.R.C. I think physical fasting also may be included, for if we indulge in physical matters it no doubt beclouds the mind; but I think fasting takes in a lot more than that. It is the denial of self in every form. Whatever you would have chosen or you would have liked, all must go.

Rem. So where the flesh is judged the Spirit is free.

G.R.C. Where we get favourites in a meeting it quenches the Spirit, because brothers get frightened to get up. They may think, 'I don't think they will want to hear me'. And yet there may be an urge with the Spirit for such a brother to get up.

H.P. We were occupied last week in Gardenstown with chapter 11 as laying the basis for chapter 13 -- the matter of Barnabas being sent to Antioch, and what was said there as to his being a good man and full of the Holy Spirit, and many believed on the Lord, and how he exhorted them to cleave to the

Lord; and then that many were added to the Lord. If we were all actually under the Lordship of Christ the Spirit would have His liberty.

G.R.C. And what a sovereign move it was that those refugees came to Antioch at all! The work did not begin through any organisation from Jerusalem. There was no organisation in the spread of it. And so, what could happen in one of our ministry meetings? Are we ready for such a thing, that the Spirit would nominate someone whom He wishes to go to look after some companies far afield that may be already separated to the Lord and needing help? I am not suggesting that we should try to bring these things about, but surely we should be open to them. What might the Spirit do in these days? "The wind blows where it will"; and who knows where the wind is blowing?

Ques. Can all this only be experienced as we are increasingly in the good of our calling? If that gets dimmed with us, as alas it so often does, we are dull as to the Spirit speaking.

G.R.C. The Spirit is grieved to begin with if we do not answer the call. And I would not pretend to say that I fully answer to the call. And we are apt to think that we are where God has called us to, but I do not think the calling means that. There are certain things that are fixed positions. One is that every believer as having the Spirit is a member of the body of Christ; and every believer who has the Spirit belongs to the house of God. Now you cannot alter that; but the calling is that you might be in keeping with that. If you remain in Egypt you will not be an active member of the body of Christ, nor will you fulfil your function in the house of God. Therefore,

because I have been called into the fellowship of God's Son it does not mean I am in it. I have been called into it.

H.P. Your early remark, as to all that God had in mind as being perfectly set out in Jesus, would help.

G.R.C. The Urim and the Thummim shine in Him. They are on the breastplate. Perfect light is there and the perfect answer to the light is there. It was as to the Lord Himself that it was said in Matthew "Out of Egypt have I called my Son". Who of us can say they are completely free of Egypt? God has called us out. Who of us can say we are completely free of Babylon? But let us be exercised about it, to be free. "That ye have not fellowship in her sins", Revelation 18.

If I maintain my links with the Babylonish system, which is more the religious aspect, in God's sight I have fellowship with her sins. The elect lady, if she greeted the man not abiding in the doctrine, had fellowship with his wicked works. So that we need to take account of the callings out and how far we have answered to them; and then the callings in and how far we have answered to them. Called into the fellowship of His Son. Now I have found that the idea, in some minds, is that because we have been called into the fellowship of His Son every Christian is in it. But you might as well say that because we have been called out of the world, every Christian is out of the world; because we have been called out of Babylon, every Christian is out of Babylon. That is not so. There are many Christians in the Roman Catholic Church, but they have not come out and they still have fellowship in her sins. Well, if that is so on the negative side it is so on the positive. All Christians

have been called into the fellowship of God's Son, but the question to ask each one is are we really in it? Have we answered the call? Have we come right in? The measure in which we have come right out and right in is the measure in which we shall enjoy our membership of the body of Christ and our place in the house of God. They are fixed things. But because you are in that fixed position before God it does not mean you are enjoying it.

Rem. So immediately Paul spoke of the fixed position of 1 Corinthians 1, he exhorts the brethren to be of one mind, does he not? It shews that they were not in it.

G.R.C. They were not in it practically.

Rem. They were called to it.

G.R.C. They had been called to it, it was their right position before God, but as to the calling it is a matter of what is practical, it seems to me. We have been called out, but are we out? We have been called in, but are we in?

P.H. In 2 Corinthians itself, where is says, "Come out from the midst of them, and be separated", it is not only coming out, as you say, but be separated. That is the next thing, is it not? Many have come out in their hearts but they are not quite separated.

G.R.C. Well, that is the line to be on, separated to God. Mr. Darby speaks in the Synopsis, on the Nazarite's vow, that the Lord Jesus was so separated in heart to God as a Man down here that He was the most accessible of men. It is separation of heart to God that is wanted, and if you are really thoroughly separate in heart to God you can afford to eat with publicans and sinners; you won't be defiled.

H.P. Is not that the importance of the line of the

hymn, "Thy glory Lord this living waste". If we knew more of the glory, separation would be just normal.

G.R.C. And then you could be very near to men in their need without coming down to their level at all. We are often afraid to get near to men because we are so uncertain of ourselves lest we should drop to their level; and rather than risk it we turn away, and it may be safer if we are in that state of soul. But if we were more filled with the glory and knowing our home in the glory, we would not need to turn away.

Rem. Is that not where the first part of the verse fits, "God is faithful". Whatever trial we may have to face through being true to the fellowship we can rely on God.

G.R.C. I am sure that is right. If we are set to come into what He has called us into He will stand by us.

Ques. Is that the thought in John 17 where the Lord speaks to His Father? He says, "They are not of the world, as I am not of the world". Is the idea that He associates us with Himself in that condition?

G.R.C. Well, you know, Christianity is a beautiful thing; it appeals to every renewed mind and heart, because Christianity is just Christ; Christ Himself here and in glory, and Christ in the saints. That is Christianity and nothing that is not Christ is Christianity. And therefore, the fellowship of God's Son means that it is Christ continued here in persons who are here; they are following in the footsteps of Jesus. That is the fellowship -- walking 'as He walked'. Well, who would want to do anything else but walk as He walked? To say we cannot eat with needy souls is not Christian, because it is not Christ.

He did it. And if we were in the gain of the calling, answering to the call out and answering to the call in, we should be in the Spirit, able to walk as He walked. Our weakness lies in that we are not thoroughly out and not thoroughly in. If I am not thoroughly out I shall soon come down to the level of those I am trying to save. And if I am not thoroughly out I am not thoroughly in.

H.P. So that it was the disciples that were first called Christians. If we were disciples we should be called Christians. It is not that we call ourselves Christians, but other people called them that.

G.R.C. That is a continuation of Christ. That is Christianity, what the Bible calls the new man, that is Christ reproduced in the saints, that is a new creation, created after God, Christ everything and in all.

Ques. Would that be a test, if we were right, if men acknowledged that we were with Christ? When we are in their company we would be following Him, would we not? We never find in scripture that the publicans and sinners ever thought that the Lord Jesus would become a publican and sinner. He was always marked out here as being in the power of the Spirit.

G.R.C. He was holy, harmless, undefiled and separated from sinners, even though He was, in grace, communicating the glad tidings to them and going in to their circumstances to communicate it. He was still holy, harmless, undefiled and separated from them and they knew it.

P.H. In 2 Timothy 2, the one who is separated is said to be fully fitted for every good work.

G.R.C. And you will notice there that it says fully fitted for every good work; that is the aim. I do not

think it means that I can do just what every other brother does, because there are various gifts and we have got to allow for that -- a variety of gifts -- there is no such thought as one gift dominating the whole situation, even if it is a good gift and a right gift and really of God. God works in unity in variety. Peter speaks of the various graces of God, and we suffer tremendously if we don't seek to get the help of all. Scripture speaks of "the all-various wisdom of God". There is no thought of sameness; that is human leadership, everybody saying the same thing in that sense. We are saying the same thing but in a great variety. You cannot find anywhere in scripture where you could say that Paul and John contradict one another; nor can you find anywhere that Peter contradicts either Paul or John; and yet they never use the same language. If you want to know anything about the body you don't go to Peter, you must go to Paul and so on. And yet there is no contradiction; there is unity in variety. So that I do not think that every good work means that I am trying to do everybody's job, but that I can serve Godward, saint ward, and manward. I am not specialising on service manward, and perhaps sacrificing certain principles of the fellowship by bringing in human ideas which I think might help in propagating the gospel. But fitted for every good work means that you are an all round man in that way. You can serve acceptably Godward in prayer and praise and worship and intercession. According to the grace of God given to you, you can serve the saints in whatever way you have been appointed by the Lord to do, and you can serve men even though you have not the gift of an evangelist.

Ques. Would a practical illustration of what you

have been saying be that the colours in the rainbow do not clash, they blend, do they not?

G.R.C. They blend in the pure golden light, what we call the white light; it is really gold, is it not? Like the expression of God Himself -- golden.

Rem. So the Lord says in John 17 in relation to sending them into the world, "Sanctify them by the truth, thy word is truth". And then He sends them forth at that point.

G.R.C. Yes, it must be sanctified people that are really fit for service in the world. "Sanctify" does not mean that you go out of the world; as the Lord says, I do not pray that thou shouldest take them out of the world. To sanctify people does not mean that you go into a monastery or that you build walls round yourselves, but true sanctification fits you to go into the world for God and to undertake every good work in it, is that right? And it is the truth that gives intelligence. From God's side we are sanctified by the offering of the body of Jesus Christ, it fits us for His presence. As to power we are sanctified in the Spirit, but to be intelligently in it we need the truth. Thy word is truth.

Rem. Paul was a living example of our last scripture. He counted all things but loss in view of the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord. He gave up everything else that he might win Christ.

G.R.C. Paul is the great model for us. Of course Christ is the great Model, Peter says so, but as to a man of like passion with ourselves, Paul says in that chapter, "Be imitators all together of me, brethren, and fix your eyes on those walking thus as you have us for a model". We are apt to fix our eyes on other objects, but it is good to get your eyes fixed, first on

Christ in glory as the Object and the goal, and then on others like Paul walking thus. Paul's walk was governed by the fact that he was doing one thing in life. As to his inward energies, he was pursuing one thing, and every Christian should be a man of one thing. "But one thing -- forgetting the things behind, and stretching out to the things before, I pursue, looking towards the goal, for the prize" -- Christ is the goal and Christ is the prize -- "of the calling on high of God in Christ Jesus". We all should seek to be persons of one thing; as to our inward longings and ambitions and yearnings, they should all be transferred from Egypt, transferred from Babylon and set wholly on Christ -- all our energies -- to knowing Him and the power of His resurrection. And then He brings in the highest level of fellowship, perhaps -- the fellowship of His sufferings. Paul was in fellowship in other ways; we may be in fellowship in other ways; but who is qualified for fellowship of His sufferings?

P.H. Peter in Acts 3 said, what I have I give unto thee. He knew what He had. He had one thing which was far better than silver and gold. He said silver and gold have I none but what I have.

G.R.C. As poor yet making many rich. We want to go in for those paradoxes.

P.H. He was not afraid to say, "Look on us".

G.R.C. What a thing it would be if we could say that: "Look on us". It is a marvellous thing that there were men who could say that without any presumption. They could say just look on us, we have nothing in this world we have come out of; we are out of Egypt, we are out of Babylon, but we can make you rich with eternal riches: "What I have".

H.P. Now as to the fellowship of His sufferings,

do we not get some of the choicest notes of worship out of prison from Paul?

G.R.C. We certainly do; and it may have been just lately that we have understood His sufferings better by touching them a little ourselves. It is a great privilege that. And as you say, there is something secured for God out of that.

Rem. One in prison speaking for the saints and telling them he bows his knees to the Father.

G.R.C. And one in prison saying, "Rejoice in the Lord always: again I say rejoice". Think of that!

Watford -- 2nd December, 1961, G. R. Cowell, Reading, Haddad Books, The Call of God, 10: 1 - 24