Hebrews 8:1 - 2; 1 Corinthians 3:9, 16, 17; 1 Corinthians 12:13, 16 - 18; 2 Timothy 2:22
G.R.C. I thought we might dwell on three things, the system, the position, and the path. The verses in Hebrews refer to the divine system, that is the true tabernacle which the Lord has pitched and not man. It is apprehended by faith, but that does not mean that it is not substantial and real. Indeed it is eternal in character, the tabernacle of God, and the Lord has pitched it; and if He is upholding all things physically by the word of His power, it is quite certain that He is upholding the spiritual system by the word of His power; it cannot break down. He is the great High Priest, and the Minister of the holy places.
The scriptures read in Corinthians refer to the position, that is something established in a concrete way down here, namely the body of Christ and the house of God. The body of Christ is of course the house of God, it comprises the same persons, every Christian who has the Spirit. It is suitable to be the house of God because it is the body of Christ, and this position is established by the presence of the Spirit. Therefore, on the divine side, the position never breaks down. But then there is the path; this involves fellowship, as it says, "Shall two walk together except they be agreed?" Amos 3:3 -- that is the path. As to the fellowship, we are in it if we are; we are called into it by God. We are called out of the world, but we may not be out of it. We are
called into this path that is pleasing to God, but the fact that we are called into it, does not mean that we are in it; that depends on how far we have answered to the call. Similarly we are also called, for instance, to eternal life, "Lay hold of eternal life to which thou hast been called", but that does not mean we are in the gain of it, though called to it. The idea that every Christian is in fellowship is false. They are called into it, but it involves a path and 1 Corinthians 10, speaking of communion or fellowship, says, "Are not they who eat the sacrifices in communion [or fellowship] with the altar?" this refers to the path, and in 2 Timothy 2 it is the path in a day such as this. I thought we might get help on these thoughts. Commonly when we speak of the system nowadays we mean a system gradually built up over the years and in which we have moved, and which we have had to leave. It helps us, however, to look at the divine system.
F.A.B. Would you say that although the tabernacle that was set up has ceased to exist, what it represented goes through?
G.R.C. Yes, what it represented is the true tabernacle, the other is only a type and a shadow, but we belong to the real thing, the true tabernacle which the Lord has pitched and not man. We have discovered that the system we have left has become man-made.
Ques. Do I understand that every believer belongs to the body?
G.R.C. Everyone who has the Spirit, yes.
A.W. Was the tabernacle pitched in Acts 2?
G.R.C. Yes, the Lord pitched it then. In fact, He had already put it together, as it were, because the
disciples were all together with one accord in one place; they were set together; and the Spirit came upon a company already set together by Christ and pleasing to the Spirit, but the coming of the Spirit set the whole system in life.
F.A.B. Would you say in regard to Acts 2, whether the Spirit given consequent on the Lord's ascension, involved the economy?
G.R.C. Yes, I suppose it required the Spirit to be given to enable us vitally to enter into the gain of the economy, but the economy was seen at the Lord's baptism, for instance. Objectively the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit were on that occasion all in evidence. Then there are other allusions to the three Divine Persons in the gospels, especially John. In the commission in Matthew 28 there was a formal setting out of the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. That Name conveyed two truths -- one, the truth of the economy, the manifestation of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, the Persons being brought before us objectively in their relative places in the economy; and then as that Name is one, it means that the Persons thus known in the economy are co-equal in the oneness of Deity, commanding our worship. It is a wonderful Name!
T.F. Would it be right as to Hebrews 8 to say that the Lord is the One distinguished in this system, having in mind the verse, "We have such a one high priest"?
G.R.C. Well, there is what we have and what God has. From our side "we have such a one high priest". What God has, that the One who is High Priest is the Minister of the holy places, assuring that God will be served because the whole system centres in God.
Ques. Is it stabilising to see that our apprehension of God's thoughts may vary, but His thoughts never fail, "Thou canst be hindered in no thought of thine"?
G.R.C. That is right. Our apprehension may vary, and does; and gifts are given with a view to our arriving at the unity of the faith. The unity of the faith is not a test of fellowship, because none of us can say we have got there yet, to the fulness of the faith. But we are moving on, and the more we take in divine thoughts, the more there will be the unity of the faith amongst us. But we need patience, because persons are being converted and coming in whose apprehension is small, and ministry is needed all the time in that great work to bring us all to the unity of the faith. The system is not measured by the extent of our apprehension of it. The system exists.
H.B. Is that suggested in the note to the word "summary" -- in chapter 8: 1 -- in the reference to the substance of what is in the speaker's mind?
G.R.C. Yes, because however young we are in the faith, if we once apprehend the Person who upholds the system -- He inaugurated it as the Apostle and upholds it as the Priest -- we are on the road to understanding the whole system; whereas anyone who does not apprehend Christ as the High Priest and as the Minister of the holy places, may fail to apprehend the system at all. But once you apprehend the One who is the great active Administrator of the system both Godward and man ward, then the way is open for you, as held in faith in Him, to apprehend the system more and more clearly. We have not, any of us, fully apprehended the true tabernacle yet, have we?
W.B.F. Does a person give character to a system? At the outset Nimrod gave his character to a system of things.
G.R.C. Yes, and what is so precious is that the Person who gives character to this system is a Divine Person in whom dwells all the fulness of the Godhead bodily, so that it must be in every way in accord with God.
A.F. Is that why it is stated that He is Minister of it?
A.F. I was thinking that if He is the One who inaugurated it, He is the One capable of being the Minister of it.
G.R.C. That is just it. He is the Inaugurator in chapter 1; we see that He inaugurated the physical creation too -- "By whom also he made the worlds". Then you have Him as the Centre of this system, because it says that He is the effulgence of God's glory. This system is for God and His glory, and He is the effulgence of God's glory, and the expression of His substance; and He has made the purification of sins, so that there might be an unchallengeable moral basis for the establishment of this system. But then it is also stated that He upholds all things by the word of His power. As Apostle He inaugurated, and as High Priest He upholds, and as Minister He is active in this divine system, that it might all be according to God.
F.A.B. So you would say that it enhances the dignity of the saints to take account of the glorious Person who is the Head of it all.
G.R.C. It does. Some days ago I was thinking of that beautiful hymn:
and I thought, a thousand thousand, that is a million, and we know there are many more than that, and I said to myself, however can I be sure of being maintained in God's system; I am only a little speck, among thousands upon thousands, and thousands of thousands. Then I thought of the One who upholds all things by the word of His power. Astronomers now say that there are probably a trillion galaxies of which even the Milky Way is but one; and I thought of Jesus upholding all these physical galaxies, with their countless myriads of suns, and then I said, 'Well, He will uphold me. How glorious is the One who is the Centre of the spiritual system; He can uphold even me among the myriads that are His'.
F.A.B. It has been a great comfort to me to consider the dignity that attaches to having any part at all in this glorious system, in which God is served.
G.R.C. And that would stimulate us to attend to the priestly office. It says in Numbers, "And Aaron and his sons shalt thou appoint that they may attend to their priest's office", Numbers 3:10. They were appointed. Well now, God has appointed everyone here, you and me, brothers and sisters, to attend to the priestly office; and there is this glorious Person, the Minister of the holy places, and the High Priest is there to uphold us in attending to the priestly office every day. Our first thought every morning should be that we are priests; the priests encamped before the tabernacle eastward, toward the sunrising so that when a priest awoke in the morning the first thing he would notice would be the sun rising. So
when we awake in the morning, we think, 'Well, the Lord may come today'. Then, the priest would look the other way and see the cloud over the tabernacle and the smoke ascending from the brazen altar, for the fire never went out, and he might say, 'Well, there is the opportunity today to attend to the priestly office'; and with what energy he would go and offer the morning incense and the morning lamb. We need to fulfil that every day, the priest's office, because we belong to this system, and it is to work in practice. It is not only that the Lord Jesus is there by divine appointment as Hebrews 8 shews, but we too are moving by divine appointment and filling out our function as priests. And we have liberty, we have His support, to enter the holy of holies, that is our place in the system. We serve at the altar too. We offer sacrifices, the sacrifice of praise and of doing good, "for with such sacrifices God is well pleased". All that is priestly work, and fills out the day, but the first thing to do is to go right in to the holy of holies, because all our service springs from Christ having gone into the holy of holies, which is thus the true Christian place in the system.
A.F. Are you thinking of chapter 10 now?
G.R.C. Yes, chapter 10 is our going in, and chapter 13 our coming out to the altar, "We have an altar", and by Him offering the sacrifice of praise to God.
Rem. What you say encourages us to see that each one of us has the right and the privilege to go in.
G.R.C. Well, let us enter into the holiest far more often than we have ever done. It is the true Christian place to be there in the presence of the glorified Man who is before God.
A.F. In virtue of His precious blood -- how blessed!
G.R.C. Yes, it is His sacrifice and service that takes us into the holiest; His offering of Himself on the altar; we can go straight in. Our service at the altar flows from our having gone in. We cannot work our way in by ourselves -- His service takes us in.
P.S. Is that suggested in that He has sat down on the right hand of the throne of the greatness in the heavens? He is in the place of power.
G.R.C. His work is done; the way is open for us.
H.B. Is that why Peter sets out the holy priesthood first, and then the royal priesthood? You go in to God before you go out to men.
G.R.C. Yes, that is the point. Our place is in the holy of holies; that is true Christian ground; it belongs to only the Christian company.
H.V. Does all this come as a challenge to us? One feels for oneself the sense of failure to maintain that outlook.
G.R.C. Well, I wish I had more of a heart for Christ and for God, because I cannot say much about it. But truly it should be our first waking thought. Our highest duty is the priest's office.
W.L.M. Would that link with what you were saying on Thursday night about the props being taken away. Have we not really been leaning on a man-made system?
G.R.C. That is just it. The system we have relied on has gone, but the divine system stands and will stand, in all its grandeur.
Rem. Daniel's practice was not altered by the props being removed.
G.R.C. And we have often thought about the
refugees from Jerusalem in Acts 8; saints were scattered through the persecution by Saul. They not only left their homes but they left the apostles. Think of what it meant to them to feel they might never see the apostles again. Then they left the big meetings, five to ten thousand strong; they had been having wonderful times in Jerusalem. All those things were providential spiritual mercies, and, when they had to leave them all, I have no doubt those refugees began to discover what they really possessed; what they really had as belonging to the divine system must have become to them more real and substantial, when all the providential spiritual mercies were removed. They had not the twelve apostles, but they had the great High Priest with the Urim and the Thummim.
F.A.B. Does what you say help us to appreciate something of the wonderful things we have come to at the end of chapter 12, things that go through? So that the tabernacle, the system, is even referred to in Revelation -- these things go right through.
G.R.C. That is right; the true tabernacle goes through into the eternal state.
P.S. I was thinking of the reference "which the Lord has pitched, and not man". We need to seek divine help and discernment in relation to that.
G.R.C. We do not want to start again pitching any tent. It seems clear in the Acts that there was no human organisation. The twelve were never deluded into thinking they must set up anything in the way of a human organisation, although they were apostles. The Holy Spirit was the great Organiser in the Acts. The persecution arose -- allowed in divine wisdom -- and the scattered ones fled abroad. God did not wait for the apostles to say, 'We will organise a
missionary effort; we have been told to evangelise the nations, and so Peter and John ought to go there, and two more elsewhere'; but, as we see, God organised it. Through Saul of Tarsus the disciples were scattered abroad, and they went everywhere evangelising the word; and this was much more effective through refugees who exulted with joy unspeakable and filled with the glory -- they arrested people's attention more than two apostles going through would have done; and so it prospered and the gospel went out.
The Holy Spirit said to Philip, "Approach and join this chariot" -- He told persons what to do at the moment. The Lord gives general directions to each, and all that is necessary; and it would seem that the Holy Spirit tells you what to do at the moment. To Philip, "Join this chariot", Acts 8; and to Peter, "Three men seek thee ... go with them nothing doubting because I have sent them", Acts 10; and to the assembly at Antioch, "Separate me now Barnabas and Saul", Acts 13. I wonder whether God may help us to get back to that, really relying on the Holy Spirit for any organisation of divine service, and to be ready to obey His directions at a moment's notice, wherever He may send us, and however strange it may appear to us the directions are. The tendency always is, as soon as a movement begins, to get organised. We must appoint this man to do that and so forth. Mr. P.H. has now taken up for instance the work of publishing ministry -- nobody told him to, it was his personal exercise -- and I should think the Spirit of God was in that; but the human mind might say. 'Oh, that will not do, we must organise it'; and then when something is organised by
man's ability, the enemy comes to take it over. That is seen all round in Christendom. Of course the distinction is between what is fleshly and what is spiritual.
W.L.M. I was just going to refer to that, having in mind particularly Mr. C.S. You will remember his movements amongst the brethren in his evangelical service and what specially marked him was that day by day he took his instructions. He had some remarkable experiences in this area as to where he would go and when and how.
G.R.C. And I suppose that in those days that principle marked all; because nobody directed J.N.D. At different times in his life he went to various European countries, to Canada, the United States, Jamaica, British Guiana, New Zealand and Australia. The same principle was followed by G.V.W. They evidently received their guidance direct.
A.W. What would help us to be in the state whereby we could be available to the Spirit at a moment's notice?
G.R.C. Well, just to accept the injunction, "Be filled with the Spirit". It is put on me and you; the Spirit is here wanting to fill everyone, so it says in effect, The Spirit is here, and we should just be filled!
T.D. You would say the difficulty lies sometimes in wanting to organise, but, if we were living simply, relying on the Spirit, it would be a different matter altogether as regards activity.
G.R.C. Yes, there would not be too much or too little.
A.F. Have we to have the sense in our souls as it reminds us in 1 Corinthians 3 that, "We are God's
fellow-workmen", involving control and communion?
G.R.C. I am glad you have brought us to that; it is the second part of our subject, that is, the thought of the position. We have referred to the divine system, but when people talk of 'the position', they customarily refer to something down here which they think has been established from J.N.D. onwards. J.N.D. did not establish any position at all. And most certainly F.E.R. did not. The only position down here that scripture -- indicates, the only position which Christians have, is that they are members of the body of Christ and belong to the house of God. And when we speak of the house of God we must remember 1 Corinthians is a wilderness epistle, and in the wilderness the tabernacle was the house of God. Also the house that Solomon built was the house of God; there are different aspects of it; and in Hebrews 3 it says, "whose house are we" as to the true tabernacle. The true tabernacle which the Lord has pitched is God's house; and it says, "whose house are we, if we hold fast the boldness and the boast of hope firm to the end". Well now the divinely established 'position' for everyone who has the Spirit is that they are members of the body of Christ and therefore belong to the house of God.
F.A.B. Is it a comfort to get hold of the light of the position, so as to be practically in it? You said earlier that 'we are, if we are'.
G.R.C. Yes, but I was referring to being in the fellowship -- we are, if we are.
F.A.B. What you are bringing before us now are positive statements.
G.R.C. Yes, God has made me a member of the body of Christ, and that is true of every Christian
who has the Spirit, whether he understands it or not -- "God has set the members, each one of them in the body, according as it has pleased him", 1 Corinthians 12:18 -- and therefore he belongs to the house of God, and it is God who has put him there.
H.B. Is not the reference to God's activities very touching in that connection? "God's husbandry, God's building" -- what can shake that?
G.R.C. Quite so. And he says later, "For also in the power of one Spirit we have all been baptised into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether bondmen or free". And then he says to that particular company, the Corinthians, in chapter 12, "Now ye are Christ's body, and members in particular". That is the grand position, established by God, not by J.N.D. Now in chapter 3 and elsewhere he raises certain questions with them as to how far they understand the position. He says, "Do ye not know that ye are temple of God?" They were that; that was the divinely established position. Thus we belong to the innermost part of the house, the temple, the shrine itself, where every whit says "glory". That is the Christian's part of the house particularly, "the temple of God", the very shrine. Here we are, we are in a wonderful position, being members of Christ's body, and forming part of God's temple, and maybe we do not know it, but that does not alter our position. The position is a fact. So he says, "Do you not know that?" Then in chapter 6 he brings the matter down to the practical working out of it. He says, "Do ye not know that your bodies are members of Christ?" It comes down to the matter of our bodies. "Do ye not know that your body is temple of the Holy Spirit which is in
you?" You see, that we are temple of God and baptised into one body is the general position in which all Christians are, and we ought to know it; but it comes down in a very practical way as to how I am using my body. As Paul would ask, Do you not know that your body is a member of Christ? You ought to be in keeping with such membership; your body ought to be in keeping with it. And as he would emphasise -- "your body is temple of the Holy Spirit", and ought to be held relative to what you are as belonging to God's temple.
P.S. So we are besought in Romans 12, "Present your bodies a living sacrifice".
G.R.C. Yes. We have been put in a wonderful position by God. But, do we know it? Does it have its effect on our bodies?
Rem. On the one hand, if we held our bodies in that way we would be sensitive to the Spirit's leading.
Rem. On the other hand, because we are not always in our right state or condition, we do not use our bodies rightly.
G.R.C. That is it, and you see that brings in the thought of fellowship and the path. We want to get this point clear as to the position, so that we no longer think that J.N.D. set up a position, or that in moving out to the Lord we have left a position. That would be all wrong. The position God has given us we cannot leave. We are members of the body of Christ and belong to the house of God, and through God's mercy we cannot leave it. We may not understand it, but the path, as J.N.D. set out, which involves true fellowship, means, if we are in it, that we are set to be true to that position. That
is the path that we walk here together in a way consistent with our position as members of the body of Christ and belonging to the house of God; and that path involves fellowship. God has called us into that path, the fellowship of His Son. That is a thing we may not be in -- it is not a fixed position God has put us in and which we cannot leave -- even though God has called us into it; many Christians never respond, and we may not.
H.R.A. Is that where the breakdown comes in?
G.R.C. Yes, the position is a matter of God's grace; the path is a matter of our responsibility; but if we are to enjoy the position, we must be in the path.
A.W. You are suggesting that not every Christian is in the fellowship of God's Son?
G.R.C. No, but he is called into it. The things God has put us in by His own grace are one thing, and the things to which we are called are another. God has called me into the fellowship of His Son, but the question is, am I in it? That depends on my path. Have I responded to the call? because it is just as true that God has called me out of the world, and yet I may still be hand and glove in it.
H.B. We need God's word as a lamp unto our path.
G.R.C. Yes, we do; God's word illuminates the path.
T.F. Does verse 11 of chapter 3 show how stable the system is fundamentally? "For other foundation can no man lay besides that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ". Then it becomes a question of what we build.
G.R.C. The foundation is impregnable. What we build is going to be tested and some of it may be
burned up, but all that is of God will stand on that foundation.
Ques. "Shall two walk together except they be agreed?" How is it that there has been such disagreement?
G.R.C. It all comes down to natural minds working instead of giving place to the Spirit. If we were really led by the Spirit -- and the Lord is the great Example, He was led by the Spirit in the wilderness -- according to our measure and apprehension we should be agreed. We might have different measures of apprehension, but Paul says, "But whereto we have attained, let us walk in the same steps", Philippians 16:3. In a human family the youngest child may be very young and does not understand much, but the older ones understand more, and the parents understand most. That does not bring in disagreement. "Whereto we have attained, let us walk in the same steps".
F.A.B. Going back to your thought of the temple, I was wondering whether, visualising the tabernacle system, it helps to see that the lamps were shining not only over against the candlestick but, according to Leviticus 24, shining on the table with the loaves. Does it not involve the anointed system and the activity of the Spirit? Would that help us to find our path, and be maintained in it?
G.R.C. I am sure it would. The manifestations of the Spirit in 1 Corinthians 12 are like the lamps shining. It says, "But to each the manifestation of the Spirit is given for profit". You come to a meeting, and as the brethren give place to the Spirit. He manifests Himself through what is contributed. You hear something said, and it moves you. It is the
Spirit, and it brings fresh light into your soul, and that is like the lamps shining out. As they trimmed the lamps -- that is making way for the Spirit -- they shone out afresh in the holy place, suggesting manifestations of the Spirit. When the priest trimmed the lamps, so that the light revived, he then put incense on the altar; so that the moment you get a fresh ray of light brought in by the Spirit, there is worship to God.
A.F. So the Spirit never moves except in relation to God, does He? Whatever He says or does, it is for the heart of God Himself.
A.F. Any contribution has as its objective what is for God's glory, and the Spirit's movements are to that end.
G.R.C. You get in Corinthians the thought of worship by the simple person, something secured for God as the manifestation of the Spirit takes place.
A.M. The simple person would be encouraged though not rooted and founded in knowledge and intelligence. He would however be rooted and founded in love.
G.R.C. Yes; we ought to remember that all through our lives. After all, what really gives us intelligence, is love, not in the working of our brains. It is as being rooted and founded in love that we are fully able to apprehend with all the saints what is the breadth and length and depth and height -- Ephesians 3. Divine thoughts proceed from love, and only love can take them in. The natural mind however clever cannot take in what divine love has conceived.
F.A.B. Have we been making too much of truth
being the bond, instead of love -- both are needed?
G.R.C. Well, love is the bond of perfectness.
F.A.B. And faith works through love, does it not?
G.R.C. I think we need to get these things clear in our minds. First, the system; secondly, the position, what we are down here, our position as members of the body of Christ and belonging to the house of God; then thirdly, the question is as to the path suited to those in that position; and unless we tread the path suited to the position, we shall not enjoy the position.
Ques. There can be no suggestion of ecclesiastical pretension, can there?
G.R.C. No. The position is set out; you do not need to presume or pretend to anything. You could not be greater than a member of the body of Christ and as belonging to the house of God. All believers that have the Spirit have equally been put into the greatest position that men have ever been put in, so there is no need or room for ecclesiastical pretension. But the point then is, are you honest and real, and treading the path consistent with that position? There is no room for pretension there, for you are either real or not; you are either doing it or not. In the measure in which we are truly in the path, a divinely ordered path, in that measure we enjoy the position. What is proper to the position is that we should know the Lord's presence, know His Headship of the body, and know the privileges of the house. We can make out we are enjoying these things but there is no use in pretence or being hypocritical. We know if we are enjoying them, and God is no respecter of persons. The only way to enjoy the position is to be in the path proper to it.
A.F. And the Spirit is here to help you.
P.S. So that the matter of the mind to which you have referred is challenged in 1 Corinthians 3. "Let no one deceive himself; if anyone thin k himself to be wise among you". So it is a question of the renewed mind is it not? The natural mind has no place in the things of God.
G.R.C. No, no place at all. It is through our having the Spirit that we have the mind of Christ. It is not a question of natural ability.
F.A.B. Are you free to go on to your later thought?
G.R.C. That involves the question of the true path consistent with the position. The true path is really the path of fellowship, walking together, and it is called the fellowship of God's Son, and in 2 Corinthians 13 the fellowship of the Holy Spirit; but then in chapter 10 of the first epistle it is said to be fellowship with the altar. "Are not they who eat the sacrifices in fellowship" -- or communion -- "with the altar?" That indicates the path we are to tread. Grace has put us in our great position on the basis of God's glory, the claims of His righteousness and holiness having been met at the altar, and therefore we are to move in communion with the altar.
F.A.B. So would our maintenance of the instruction in chapter 10, which is the table in the wilderness and the responsible side, help us to enter into the enjoyment of the privileges of the fellowship as enunciated in chapter 11?
G.R.C. That is just it. In chapter 11, if things are right, we enjoy the reality of being members of the body of Christ, and we enjoy the service and privileges of the house of God as following the Supper. But the measure in which we enjoy them is
the measure in which we are in fellowship with the altar. You cannot bypass that.
A.W. Was Paul in fellowship with the altar when in Galatians 6 he said God forbid that he should glory save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ by which the world was crucified to him and he to the world? Was that fellowship with the altar?
G.R.C. Yes, the altar means we are determined to have nothing to do with the old man who was crucified. Our old man is crucified with Christ -- we do not want him back at all. We do not want him to intrude into our walk together -- nothing of the old man -- my old man. We are so fond of him, but he has been crucified with Christ, and anyone hanged on a tree had to be buried the same day, and Jesus was hanged upon a tree for my sake, for I ought to have been there -- my old man -- and He was buried the same day. We have to leave our old man there. Instead of being urgent in getting our old man buried the same day, we are apt to revive him at the least opportunity.
T.D. Paul said too, "I am crucified with Christ", Galatians 2.
G.R.C. All that Paul was that could be described as the old man was crucified with Christ. He recognised that, so that he did not live any longer, but Christ lived in him. Then in Galatians, it is the world as well. You are finished with the world. I believe those scriptures indicate what communion with the altar means. The only basis on which God could put me in the position of a member of the body of Christ, and as belonging to the house of God, was because everything relative to His glory was settled at the altar when the Lord Jesus, by the
Eternal Spirit, offered Himself spotless to God. Well, if God has put me in that position at such a cost and on such a basis, is He going to allow me to enjoy that position if I in my life and walk am giving place to what was put out of His sight at the Cross?
A.F. Have we to get a sense of the price? Paul says, "Ye have been bought with a price"; he says, "ye are not your own", 1 Corinthians 6:20.
G.R.C. Yes; "with a price". What it has cost God to constitute this position, and to put us in it through His grace!
F.A.B. So it is remarkable that in regard of the legal position dealt with in Galatians, the cross comes in so forcibly in chapters 2 and 3, and then powerfully at the end, to which our brother referred, whilst in Corinthians, dealing with the fleshly ecclesiastical position, the cross comes in forcibly from the beginning. The only way to deal with those false positions is by the cross, is it not?
G.R.C. Yes. The way the enemy works is to revive our old man and seek to make him acceptable and appear all right by putting on legal dress. You find him in rules and regulations and the way they are enforced -- all contrary to Christ -- in the effort to bring the old man back into fellowship, as you might say. But you are really bringing back what was condemned at the cross, and moreover in the form that is so objectionable to God. The publican going up to the temple called forth, rather than the Pharisee, the notice of God. If you try to dress up the old man as a respectable religious person, you are bringing him before God in the most objectionable form.
H.B. Paul says, "Then the scandal of the cross has been done away", Galatians 5:11.
G.R.C. Yes. And, you know, fellowship with the altar is a matter of affection, as everything is in Christianity. After saying, "I am crucified with Christ", Paul said, "I live by faith, the faith of the Son of God, who has loved me and given himself for me". Paul as much as says, 'When Jesus was on the cross He was thinking of me and taking my place, and I am not going to do anything displeasing to Him'.
P.S. Would what you are now saying bear on our High Priest being able to sympathise with our infirmities, and feeling with us in relation to our desires to be pleasing to Him, though ofttimes failing?
G.R.C. Yes. He feels everything; He is a tender High Priest. You think of Peter -- a worldly employer would have sacked Peter long before, but when the Lord is going to appear to His own after His resurrection, He takes care to appear first to Simon Peter. Peter had thought he was the best, and in certain respects he was really the worst, but Jesus appears to Peter first. Otherwise, when the Lord came in and said to the eleven, "Peace be unto you", Peter might well have thought, 'Well, He cannot mean me anyway; it must be the other ten: I have been such a constant failure'. But He assured Peter first. They were all bad; they had all forsaken the Lord and fled; but Jesus had said, "I leave peace with you; I give my peace to you: not as the world gives do I give to you", John 14:27. Because any worldly master would have given them all the sack, to speak in ordinary language. He would have said, 'You failed me, just in the crisis'. But He had said, "Not as the world gives do I give unto you". And so He comes amongst them. To those who had failed
Him, He says, "Peace be unto you", and to make sure Peter was not troubled, He saw him first. What do you think of that?
A.F. Yes; the Lord knew their affection for Him, underneath all the failure. Peter said, "Lord, thou knowest all things, thou knowest that I love thee".
G.R.C. Quite so. Was not the difficulty that he thought he loved Him most, that he loved Him more than the others?
A.F. "And likewise said they all too". The fact is we all fail.
Ques. Does this bring us to "the communion of the blood of the Christ"? Is that an appeal to our affections?
G.R.C. It is an appeal to our affections. As Paul says, "is it not the communion of the blood of the Christ?" referring to the cup of blessing which we bless, founded in His blood, at such a cost, and blessing brought to us, in spite of what we are.
H.B. "Which we bless", is that characteristic, and not necessarily at the Supper? Is it an attitude of mind?
G.R.C. Well, that is what it should be. Every day of the week we are thinking of it. "To him who loves us and has washed us from our sins in his blood".
P.S. So that what we do during the week takes character from the altar?
G.R.C. Yes, it does. The altar makes its tremendous appeal to our affections, and so we would love to be in communion with the altar. That is, Christ went to the extreme length to glorify God and to satisfy all the claims of God's holiness and righteousness on our behalf, and the only suited answer from us is, as it says in chapter ten, "Whether
ye eat, or drink, or whatever ye do, do all things to God's glory". That is being in communion with the altar.
F.A.B. I was thinking that. It is being said that we may only eat with those with whom we can eat the Lord's Supper. But is not the point that we should definitely be regulated by the Lord's Supper in everything we do?
G.R.C. Yes, "whatever ye do", you have in mind communion with the altar. Colossians says, "And everything, whatever ye may do in word or in deed, do all things in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father by him". That is the same idea; and here in chapter 10, "Whether ye eat, or drink, or whatever ye do, do all things to God's glory", and that is just what Jesus went to the altar for. His whole path was for the glory of God, culminating in that great act of sacrifice at the altar of God. Well now, if we are in communion with the altar, we do everything for the glory of God, and from no other motive.
F.A.B. That would maintain us in the joy and blessedness of what you earlier referred to, would it not?
G.R.C. Yes, if we are walking in this way, if this is governing us, you have the liberty of the house -- the house was morally based, as it were, on the altar. So if you answer to the altar you belong to the house, and its every privilege is open to you as moving in communion with the altar.
F.A.B. You cannot vitally get into the house save by way of the altar -- you cannot bypass the altar, can you?
G.R.C. No, and you would not have liberty in
the house even though belonging to it, if you ignored the altar.
Ques. We have to be regulated during the week according to the Supper, have we not?
G.R.C. I think that is the point here, "Are not they who eat the sacrifices"; that for us is like eating the Lord's Supper -- if we do it in reality, in the light of the spiritual meaning of the eating and drinking; we really are partaking of the sacrifice, the great sacrifice of Christ, getting the gain of it. All clean persons in Israel could eat of the peace offerings, they were sacrificed at the altar, so, Paul says, "Are not they who eat the sacrifices in communion with the altar?" We eat of the sacrifices in that way, partaking of the benefits, particularly at the Lord's Supper and all that follows. Well, the due answer during the week is "communion with the altar".
Rem. The Psalmist says, "I will wash my hands in innocency, and will encompass thine altar, O Jehovah", Psalm 26:6.
G.R.C. Well, you see, the priest always started at the laver. Whatever service he had to do, the priest did not begin at the altar. The laver was between the tent of meeting and the altar and Aaron and his sons, the priests, were required to wash their hands and also their feet at the laver. Then, if we read carefully, in relation to the regular services, that is the morning and evening lamb, the priest went into the tent of meeting and trimmed the lamps and put on fresh incense; then he came out and washed again and went to the altar and offered the lamb. In Exodus chapters 30 and 40 you will find that was the order of the service. So the laver was the
point of commencement whichever way he went, and that is so with us. "Let a man prove himself, and so let him eat". That is, we approach everything by way of the laver. We are already washed all over; through the gospel and the work of Christ we are washed all over, and we only have need, as the Lord says, to wash our feet. But then the proving ourselves involves washing our hands, that is we review matters as to whether we have engaged in that which was not for the glory of God.
A.M. In Matthew 5, in approaching the altar, we would be sensitive, "and there shouldest remember".
G.R.C. That is a simple matter, it is not a thing to be fearful of. If I discover -- and we all do -- that there are things not really entirely for the glory of God, that were not done with a pure heart, it can all be quickly settled. There is plenty of water in the laver -- especially if we have given up our mirrors. The size of the laver in the wilderness depended on how many mirrors were given up -- Exodus 38:8.
Ques. Do we all need constant cleansing as passing through this evil world -- there is not a special class that is clean and exempt?
G.R.C. We all need to see that we have got clean hands and a pure heart, but we can and are under obligation to wash one another's feet. We do not need, in Christianity, to be occupied unduly with our feet because the brethren will see to that for us. In the very fact of being amongst them -- how important to be amongst them! -- and their love flowing, and hearing what they have to say, we find that our feet get washed. But I have to see how far I walk with a pure heart, doing everything for
God's glory, and so far as I experience failure, there is full provision -- plenty of water in the laver -- and there is the throne of grace. There is no need to be hindered if we are set in the right direction. Grace has met every question. The laver was there all the time. God did not expect the priests to come to serve Him as those who would need no washing; and the Lord did not expect us to be as those who would need no washing. He said, "He that is washed all over needs not to wash save his feet", John 13; as much as to say, as thinking of His own who were in the world, that we cannot be in the world without contracting some defilement. Love has made every provision.
W.B.F. Do you think that in seeking to wash one another's feet, we would seek to refresh one another as sympathetically appreciating that each one is tested by the wilderness path?
G.R.C. That is it. Our hearts go out to the brethren -- all of them -- just as the Lord's did, "Having loved his own who were in the world". We feel for them, they are in a world like this and not of it, and there is everything against them. So we would like to wash one another's feet.
F.A.B. It has been said that the most effective way to wash one another's feet is not by setting out to do it but by a ministry of Christ, and thus you do it unconsciously.
G.R.C. You are set to help the saints all you can, your mind is always that way.
Ques. Is there a moral way to it?
G.R.C. Well, as we have said, in the measure in which we are in the path we can enjoy the position. The position belongs to all, every Christian, and from
the divine side we have been washed all over, otherwise we could not be in the position. It is only those who have been washed all over through the work of Christ - "He that is washed all over" -- who are members of the body of Christ and have part in the house of God. But then, with such persons, while from the divine side they are washed all over, there is the responsible side, the practical path of separation to God, and 2 Timothy shows the way it applies at the present time, that we pursue righteousness, faith, love, peace, and maintain a pure heart. 'Christ the unmingled Object of the heart'; that is the test all the time. Is Christ my only Object and only motive?
P.S. We are to flee certain things and pursue others.
G.R.C. It really involves first love. A pure heart involves, in some degree, recovery to first love. Christ is the unmingled Object of the heart; no mixed motives.
A.F. We are to be a sweet savour of Christ to God, are we not?
G.R.C. That is helpful. It is wonderful to think of Paul's part, on the one hand a sweet savour of Christ to God, and on the other hand it says he made manifest the odour of God's knowledge in every place, so there was the portion for God and the portion for men. This will be so all the time if we are in the true path.
A.W. Is Paul's pure heart emphasised in Philippians 3, "I count also all things to be loss on account of the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord"?
G.R.C. Yes, what a pure heart Paul had! He could say, "For me to live is Christ".
'Thousand thousand saints attending
Swell the triumph of His train'