Page 1 - 83, "Divine Wisdom Operating Against Apostasy". Belfast, 1928. (Volume 90).
2 Samuel 14:1 - 33
J.T. I was thinking of the working of wisdom as seen in 2 Samuel, so that we might understand how it comes in, in meeting the apostasy at the present time. Beginning with chapter 14 the subject runs on to chapter 20. I understand it is a question of the development of wisdom, in view, typically, of the antichristian uprising typified in Absalom. I thought this would be a suitable chapter to introduce the subject, because it lays bare the motives underlying the return of Absalom. The initiative lay with Joab; it was not that he cared for Absalom -- he did not. His thought was to ingratiate himself with the king, to enhance his own importance. It helps to see that in this section David generally represents what is of God in the Christian profession, rather than Christ Himself. At times he appears as a type of Christ, of course.
Rem. Joab did not really care for Absalom.
J.T. He cared about no one but himself; he was thinking of his own reputation and distinction. He wanted to be in the favour of the king as long as the king was in power. I think that he is a type of those influences that have opened the door to antichristian agents in Christendom, especially in the Protestant area.
Ques. Would you say that they all had themselves and their own glory before them?
J.T. That is right; they did not know what the result would be, that is, the burning of the barley field.
Rem. The food for the people of God would be destroyed on those principles.
J.T. More than that; it has reference to the Lord -- to the Person of Christ. That is what these antichristian principles are dealing with; that is what they are really at. Joab did not bargain for it; he represents the 'orthodox', but out of selfish motives he opens the door for the admittance of these agents of evil.
Ques. Would the barley field suggest Christ in resurrection?
J.T. Barley implies the firstfruits. I think that in Joab's field it would not represent the whole thought; it would not go beyond Christ as He was here. As cut down and presented as a sheaf (Leviticus 23) it would be Christ in resurrection.
Ques. Would it be what came out here in the Lord's person?
J.T. It was Joab's growing, typically; he was orthodox.
Ques. Would you give us a word as to what is antichristian?
J.T. Well, you can see in Absalom indications of it. He was a very attractive man. He is described here as very fine in appearance; such a man as would appeal to the young -- to the natural mind. There was no one in Israel so much praised for his beauty -- he was praised. Much is made of his head and the hair he grew -- the weight of it.
Rem. It says there was not a blemish in him, he was so comely.
J.T. That would be an indication of the antichrist. He will be a very wonderful man; people will wonder after him. But it was not that he (Absalom) had any attraction for Joab -- he had not. Absalom, however, represents the features of antichrist as they appear now, rather than the person himself.
Ques. Would you say it was a question with Joab of getting Absalom back without touching the sin question?
J.T. That is the point; the sin question is not dealt with at all in Joab's reckoning. And what you will notice is that he hires an agent, and that a woman having a reputation for wisdom, and he puts words into her mouth. I suppose he typifies those who are in a position today to bring in such men. The woman has no liberty as to what she is to say; he puts the words in her mouth (verse 3).
Rem. In the New Testament language, she is a vessel "to dishonour", 2 Timothy 2:20.
Ques. Had you in your mind the thought of a system -- a religious system that would work on that line?
J.T. What the woman says (verse 14) was intended to be orthodox, what David could accept. Indeed, it is often used as a gospel text.
Rem. True things are not always the truth.
J.T. They get a twist in the mouths of persons who are governed by wrong motives. Paul speaks about serving God in the glad tidings in his spirit. It is not simply in word or doctrine, but in spirit; but that is not in this chapter. The spirit of Joab is ambition, and the spirit of the woman is that of an hireling, and the result is the bringing in of a murderer without repentance.
Ques. In speaking of what is antichristian, is there a certain weakening on the part of David that makes room for it?
J.T. The breakdown of David is the antecedent to this. He is never again what he was before, he is weak -- right in his motives, but weak. I suppose he represents those who are seeking to be for God at the present time.
Ques. Would you connect that with the government of God?
J.T. Oh, surely. After the breakdown of the church it never, even in the remnant, regains its former greatness or power. What marks the whole position here is David's weakness. It is unaccountable that such a man should be so wanting in watchfulness that all this terrible uprising should occur, he being there with his mighty men. But in the light of the antitype it is intelligible enough.
Rem. I suppose that at the beginning things were held by the apostles in the power of the Spirit.
J.T. John says, "they went out from among us"; 1 John 2:19 instead of coming in they are seen going out.
Rem. Certain crept in unawares.
J.T. Yes, but they were met by apostolic energy; they were not unchallenged, as in later days.
Rem. This line of things leads up to the burning of the barley field.
J.T. Yes; it is very solemn. David is increasingly encumbered, but his weakness was apparent, and Joab saw that his leanings were toward Absalom.
Ques. Would it be natural affection that Joab worked on with David?
J.T. No doubt it was. He went to all this trouble with the woman; he knew how to get at David. There was an absence of righteousness. It was quite right, of course, that the banished should be brought back, and that means should be devised; God does that, but what kind of means does He use? not such as we get here, it must be on the ground of righteousness. Any leanings towards Absalom must be on the ground of righteousness. David, above all men, should have known this.
Ques. Does David represent that which is supposed to stand for God -- the church?
J.T. He does here. We shall see in the following chapters that he acts wisely; he has recourse to the wisdom of God in which he fails here. He fails in
common righteousness in allowing Absalom to return unrepentant.
Rem. It says in 2 Timothy 2:22, "pursue righteousness".
J.T. That is the first thing to be followed. Whatever feelings you may have, the wise course is to follow righteousness first, but it is coupled with faith and love and peace -- four things.
Rem. These qualities were absent in Joab because he had himself before him.
Rem. He was allowed to continue until Solomon's reign, when judgment was meted out to him, the immediate occasion of it being that he turned after Adonijah.
J.T. Yes; he represents cleverness in the things of God -- orthodox cleverness. This is sure to be coupled with unrighteousness.
Rem. It was a humbling thing in the case of David that he gave way here.
J.T. Very humbling, especially in view of what he represents -- what exists today -- as we have been saying. The very fact that Joab was behind the woman's speech ought to have condemned it in the eyes of a man like David. We are reminded here of our exposure to damaging influence through clever flattery.
Ques. Does this indicate that David had not got right with God?
J.T. Well, it appears that he had not regained the spiritual perception that he had. There is evident a peculiar combination of weaknesses. As already said, this is intelligible in view of what marks the people of God today.
Ques. Looking at it in connection with the government of God, does it go back to Uriah?
J.T. It does, but if we view David as an individual believer, that does not account for his weakness here; he ought to have been stronger, as having judged
himself. The facts given, particularly Psalm 51, would show that he did. So that while David's personal state has to be taken into account, the true explanation is in what exists at the present time, which is pictured in what is before us in these chapters.
Rem. Psalm 51 seems to indicate that he had judged things, but there must have been some hidden motives, otherwise we can hardly conceive that in full restoration he would have made a mistake like this.
J.T. The explanation is in the antitype, the history of the assembly.
Ques. Would not the original defeat have been "at the time when kings go forth [to battle]"? 2 Samuel 11:1
J.T. Quite so; he should have gone, but stayed at home; hence the breakdown. What we have before us is the moral consequence; but the result of David's sin from the standpoint of grace is Solomon. Solomon is out of view in these chapters; he exists, but he is not in view. What is in view in connection with the work of God is the working out of the thing he represents. Solomon represents the wisdom of God, but the wisdom of God in public display. In the meantime, there is the working out of wisdom in other connections; that is, at the present time, in the face of the awful breakdown in the testimony, God has come in, as we shall see in the later chapters, and He meets the antichristian uprising by wisdom.
As this proceeds we have to accept the solemn fact that He allows the introduction of such men as Absalom, and that this has come about through orthodox persons -- persons holding the truth ostensibly -- those who are professedly true to David, but only in order to enhance their own position. In our weakness true Christians, being governed by natural feelings, give way to them.
Ques. Would you say that these upheavals worked out the desire in David's heart to build God an house?
J.T. They did; he had the desire to build for God before, but the result is reached in Solomon, who came in on God's part, in grace. In Chronicles we see how David reached the thought of God through discipline occasioned by his failures. But on the other hand we see here how the enemy works on what is natural in us.
Ques. Do you also suggest that the weakness was in regard to natural relationships?
J.T. Yes. Joab succeeded on that line here. Thus we are warned as to the danger of allowing natural feelings in the things of God; through this the door is opened to the enemy. This woman's speech may be taken to represent what is orthodox -- what any person might accept, for it is true that we "are as water spilt on the ground, which cannot be gathered up again". It is true, but it is not the whole truth. In the first book of Samuel we read that the children of Israel drew water and poured it out before Jehovah (1 Samuel 7:6); this represented the people in self-judgment. Samuel offered up a sucking lamb. That involves the gospel. This woman speaks about water being spilt, this is man's state, but pouring it out before the Lord is owning it -- repentance. Christ (the sucking lamb) is the answer, which God accepts. The rights of God are thus maintained. Popular evangelisation, to a large extent, brings back man without repentance. You hear of people being brought back in thousands, but what about the rights of God? What about repentance?
Ques. Does the woman represent that, as one who is supposed to be mourning for the dead, and not anointed with oil (verse 2)?
J.T. Quite so; popular service makes much of appearance, but God is not looking at this. He is looking at man's heart -- what the motives are. The
whole atmosphere of popular ministry makes room for the man who does not judge himself. Thus material is brought in that Satan can use against Christ.
Rem. God is not fully represented in popular preaching.
J.T. I suppose Joab's field of barley does not go beyond what is orthodox. It is Christ, but not Christ cut down in death and risen. It was Joab's field, and it was near Absalom's.
Ques. Would you not say that one of the great causes of weakness in the professing church is the way in which it has pandered to popular tastes and pleasures, all sorts of music, and even dancing?
J.T. Quite so; this woman represents that sort of thing, I mean popularity in the way of preaching. It is orthodox, but admitting of persons without repentance, without genuinely judging the man that sinned. God will not have this.
Rem. What one feels about the preaching in our days is that it has not got the assembly in view.
J.T. In a true conversion there is joy in heaven. There is joy in heaven over one sinner that repents, and then there is joy among the saints in his reception; there is joy in the house for others as well as for himself. How many come into fellowship? Unless the converts come into fellowship the result is not complete.
Rem. Joy in the house would be the result of being sympathetic with heaven.
J.T. The joy begins in heaven, and then it has its reflection in the house where the music and dancing are; Luke 15. Take a man like Absalom coming in; look what he does. In the first place there is distance. There he was for two years, he had no communion with David; and then he goes and burns the barley field. He is no product of the gospel; he is the result of the manoeuvres of selfish men, such as Joab, who
ought to know better. There was no affinity there really. Joab was not thinking a bit of Absalom, he was only thinking of his own aggrandisement. There is no fellowship -- nothing but distance. For two whole years Absalom does not see the king's face, and then he burns the field of barley. Joab is now at his mercy. That is another thing; these orthodox men allow evil-doers, and then they are at their mercy. What can they do today in Christendom? Nothing; they are powerless, and the barley field is being burnt.
Rem. If you have any light regarding the assembly, you will eschew all this kind of thing.
Ques. What are we to do to keep clear?
J.T. We are to see how the wisdom of God works. David is brought to it. As an exile, fleeing from his capital, he is brought to it. We shall see, I hope, how he rises to the mind of God; we shall see how true believers are brought through discipline back to the wisdom of God.
Rem. I was thinking that what should be in view is what God is seeking.
J.T. Exactly. So that the apostle enlarges on the gospel that he preached; he says, "not in wisdom of word", @1 Corinthians 1:17. I think Joab here depends on the wisdom of words. He gave the woman a form of words. "we preach Christ crucified" 1 Corinthians 1:23 that is the preaching that will shut out the man after the flesh. It is not simply the man who repents once; repenting sinners are spoken of (Luke 15); it is continued.
Ques. Do I understand from what you have been saying that in our gospel preachings we want to beware of mere popularity?
J.T. Quite so; and then having right motives in the service; renouncing "the hidden things of shame, not walking in deceit, nor falsifying the word of God, but by manifestation of the
truth commending ourselves to every conscience of men before God", @2 Corinthians 4:2.
Ques. What do you mean by continual repentance?
J.T. Well, that is the attitude of your soul. It is a habit that becomes more and more effective. The more you get into the presence of God, the more there is to repent of. We do not know the true meanness of the natural heart; there are thirteen things that proceed out of it (Mark 7:20 - 23), and you have got to judge every one of them. Not only because the Lord says they are there, but because you find out they are there; they are not all found out at once, as a rule.
Rem. The sense of it grew with Paul; he speaks of being chief of sinners.
J.T. Yes; he comes to that. He was then chief of sinners, it is in the present tense "of whom I am [the] first", @1 Timothy 1:15.
Rem. "sinners, of whom I am the first" 1 Timothy 1:15 "least of the apostles" 1 Corinthians 15:9 and "less than the least of all saints" Ephesians 3:8 -- that is not boastful talking! I wonder, if one may put it so, how far we have travelled on that line.
J.T. I suppose the apostle Paul was the greatest lover of Christ; no one had sinned so much in his reckoning. As forgiven much he loved much, according to the Lord's words; Luke 7:47.
Rem. A man like that would have a wonderful influence for good; would you not say that others would feel it?
J.T. I think he would convey the idea of repentance and forgiveness when preaching; it would be in his own spirit at the time. It is not simply the words you use; the wise woman of Tekoah used right words to a point, but she would not convey the true idea. Paul said that he served God in his spirit in the gospel of His Son (Romans 1:9); he would convey the thing fully to you if you heard him speak.
Ques. Would you say that Paul in speaking had the oil? This woman had no oil.
J.T. Quite so; Joab directed her not to anoint herself with oil. The true preacher or other representative of God is anointed, and not only with oil, but with fresh oil.
J.T. You do not use the same sermon over and over again. It is very practical; there is always freshness. You may, of course, use the same scripture or subject more than once, but there are new features presented, and in freshness.
Ques. Does not the oil stand connected with another Man, that is, with Christ?
J.T. I think that is what Paul would convey. If you heard him preach he would convey the idea; so that the glad tidings were "on the principle of faith, to faith" Romans 1:17, and the result would be, in some sense, a man after himself. The anointing is for representation of God, and for this Christ must be in evidence, not only in word, but also in spirit.
Ques. Would the fresh oil depend upon fresh experiences which one would have with God? You were speaking of repentance being kept up.
J.T. In Matthew the Lord directs that the disciples were to see Him in Galilee; that would be a long way to go. In Luke He does not ask them to go that way. You may take a book down from your shelf, read a sermon, and commit it to memory; that is not going to Galilee to get it. You get your commission in Galilee. Galilee is the place of reproach; it is not the university. The university is the place of honour. Luke says, "do ye remain in the city till ye be clothed with power from on high" Luke 24:49; he uses the word 'clothed'; that is to say, your habiliments are heavenly. I think that John's ministry applied to the servant would make him forgiving: "whose soever sins ye remit" John 20:23 Luke would say to you, You must
have the right tone; tarry in the city until you are clothed with power from on high. That is the external appearance you present in your ministry, you are heavenly. And Mark says, Be sure that you believe what you preach. If you do not believe it, how can you expect other people to believe it? Therefore he insists on faith in the things preached; Mark 16. In the end of his gospel he shows how unbelieving the apostles were. He says, Be sure you believe; and so Paul says, "we also believe, therefore also we speak" 2 Corinthians 4:13. But Matthew says, You must go to Galilee; you must get your commission from the place of reproach. You have got to go where the Lord is, and finding Him as rejected you can never hope to be a popular man in the world if you minister Christ. You never seek to maintain a place of distinction among the brethren; you just carry on your work and leave all distinctions to the Lord.
Ques. Do you think that this woman represents an appeal to natural feelings, which often appear in local difficulties?
J.T. There has been a great deal of that, there is a great deal of it. Natural affections, as entering into assembly matters, are sure to make way for unrighteousness.
Rem. That is the way the enemy seems to work in family matters.
J.T. The whole point here is that recovery must be on the wound of righteousness; the want of this was the great failure seen in this chapter.
Rem. I was thinking of that verse, "But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who has been made to us wisdom from God, and righteousness, and holiness, and redemption" 1 Corinthians 1:30. Everything is found in Him.
Rem. There are a good many here this morning who were not here yesterday afternoon. An outline of what we had before us might be helpful.
J.T. We read in chapter 14 yesterday; the thought being to show how the door has been opened, in the history of the assembly, to the agents of evil as represented in Absalom; the bringing back of Absalom being the result of Joab's desire to advance himself, to ingratiate himself with the king. So that he hires a woman from Tekoah, having the reputation of being wise, and puts words in her mouth to say to the king; all calculated to work on his natural feelings and affections.
The thought was that we might see that in the assembly having been weakened under the general breakdown -- as in David's own personal history -- the sense of the presence of God being weakened, natural feelings obtained largely. These natural feelings were appealed to by those who were in power (such as Joab), with the result that the door has been opened to persons who are antagonistic to Christ, persons who are known to be guilty, as Absalom was, but received back without self-judgment. So that the woman's speech to David was marked by a certain amount of truth; but what truth was there was so presented that it was deceptive. It was accompanied by fulsome flattery of David, because she accredited him with the wisdom of an angel of God. She says twice over that he was as an angel of God, knowing good from evil, etc.; so that we are to be warned against natural feelings and flattery in dealing with evil. If persons seek to gain admission amongst us,
unrepentant, they are sure to appeal to our natural feelings and flatter us. They will probably tell us that the truth is with us, and the ministry is with us, but we shall have to be sure that righteousness exists, or we shall be deceived. The woman's saying, "God ... devises means that the banished one be not expelled from him" 2 Samuel 14:14 was in itself right, but then she said something which shows she had not the light of God: "and God has not taken away his life" 2 Samuel 14:14, that is to say, God did not require atonement. He would bring His banished back without death; that is not true. There must be shedding of blood: "Without blood-shedding there is no remission" Hebrews 9:22. It is well to notice this in her speech, because it helps us as to the kind of thing the enemy introduces. While the truth may be there, there is something which nullifies it. She says, "For we must needs die, and are as water spilt on the ground, which cannot be gathered up again; and God has not taken away his life, but devises means that the banished one be not expelled from him", @2 Samuel 14:14. She says nothing about the need of repentance in the banished one, or that his life was forfeited. But that life has to go; it either goes in the death of Christ or in the judgment of God by-and-by. And so it has to be applied now in regard to those who are to walk with us. The woman says, "we must needs die" 2 Samuel 14:14 but this is not dealing with the special guilt of the one in question.
Rem. The Authorised Version does not show that very clearly. It is J.N.D.'s translation that helps us. It is, "God has not taken away his life", @2 Samuel 14:14.
J.T. The authorised Revised Version has, "Neither doth God take away life", 2 Samuel 14:14. What Joab put into her mouth was, in this respect, not true; and then she adds: "And now that I am come to speak of this thing to my lord the king, it is because the people have made me afraid", @2 Samuel 14:15. She insinuates that there is
a movement in the people that David had to reckon with, to act on his fear. She says further on: "for as an angel of God, so is my lord the king to discern good and bad; and Jehovah thy God will be with thee", @2 Samuel 14:17. And then she discloses that it was Joab's suggestion; but all the time David is receiving her thoughts and being deceived by her.
Rem. It seems to be a case of telling the truth to hide the truth, and on the other hand, flattery. They are two very great evils.
J.T. I think they are evils that have to be faced now, for the enemy, as using what is deceptive, is sure to flatter you. It will be conveyed to you that you are a wise man; yet all the time you are receiving what is wrong.
Rem. "Keep thy heart more than anything that is guarded; for out of it are the issues of life" Proverbs 4:23.
Rem. I suppose we are all in danger of the same thing; we are easily turned to the side of natural feelings.
J.T. David acts on the suggestion, and Absalom is brought back; and now in Jerusalem they have an unrepentant murderer, and he soon shows his hand in violence in burning the field of barley. This chapter gives us a life-size picture of Absalom. It is not now the woman, but Absalom's own actions, to bring about his enthronement. And all this is in the presence of David, so that we are reminded of the weakness there is -- David, representative of what is of God, but even so, liable to be deceived. We are exposed thus, for we are still in the flesh.
Ques. Would you say that it is only the truth that can preserve any of us?
J.T. Someone has just remarked, "Keep thy heart more than anything that is guarded" Proverbs 4:23 you have got to watch that, because your natural feelings would be appealed to, if you are to be deceived.
Ques. Do you not feel that the enemy is trying to bring in these principles of Absalom among the saints?
J.T. Yes; that is what he has been at since the apostles' time. They had been going out -- the antichrists -- but since then they have been coming in; the door has been opened to them. So that, in Rome we have the cage of every foul bird, but in Protestantism we have a tree in which the birds of heaven roost. All is to bring about the great apostasy.
Rem. The serious thing was that Joab helped to bring this about.
J.T. That is the serious thing; he represents the orthodox, but selfish. He may be regarded as representing the great clerical system. Generally the clergy are not free to speak about the Lord as they wish; in principle, words are put into their mouths; words which are more or less true, but each denomination has its own peculiar tenets, which have to be observed. Thank God, there are exceptions, but generally repentance toward God is not pressed, and so the door is opened for persons who do not judge themselves. Thus the enemy acquires agents whom he uses against Christ.
But when God allows crises to come about, what is of Him begins to awaken, and comes into evidence. So that David sends the ark back to the city; he shows that he is not governed by personal motives, he is thinking of what is of God. And in sending back the ark through Zadok and Abiathar, he established in the city a secret system which meant the overthrow of Absalom's system. That is what I think we ought to see in the awakening which has occurred in the assembly. In the ark's presence with the priests and Hushai and those young men, David had a system under his hand, by means of which the whole apostate system should be overthrown. That is to say, the wisdom of God is now beginning to act,
and that is one of the most interesting things I know of.
Rem. Hushai was characterised by love for David.
J.T. Yes; he was David's friend. David now has, in the very midst of Absalom's system, what will be the means of its overthrow. I think that when an awakening to what is of God comes to light, it is no longer a question of numbers. It is like that which you get in Ecclesiastes, the poor wise man delivered the city. It is a question now of wisdom.
Ques. How would you apply that today?
J.T. Well, it is the wisdom that God works out in His people. They have no public position; they are not known. These priests were not known in Absalom's system as relating to David. They were secret, as it were, but they knew what to do. They were governed by the wisdom of God.
Ques. Was the ark the nucleus around which the system was to revolve.
J.T. That is right; David would place it where it belonged. You place Christ where He belongs, so to speak; He stands in relation to all. And in relation to the ark there were Zadok and Abiathar, Hushai and those young men, so that presently things begin to move. Hushai's wisdom is against Ahithophel, and it prevails.
Ques. Do you mean that this system exists at the present moment amongst the people of God?
J.T. The wisdom of God is at work, and the principles that are going on mean the overthrow of the antichristian world. What is going on today means the overthrow of the antichristian system and the setting up of what is of God.
Rem. "greater is he that is in you" 1 John 4:4; what is of God will prevail.
J.T. That is right, but it prevails in a secret or unseen way. These men were true to David; and they are governed by divine wisdom.
Ques. Do you think that Hushai would represent the unofficial element? I was thinking of Luke in relation to Paul. He was his friend; he was sympathetic with all that God was doing to His servant and he moved on in an unobtrusive way.
J.T. Just so. Hushai would be governed by his friendship for David in all that he did.
Ques. I was wondering if provision was made for all this in John's gospel, from chapter 13.
J.T. Yes. The disciples are all under commandment; they are not acting for themselves. So that in that section in John's gospel they have His commandments and keep them. There is to be no deviation from the commandments, otherwise everything is sure to fail. The keeping of His commandments would be the proof of their love for Christ. There was also the keeping of His word, which would imply wisdom.
Ques. Is there any point for the present day in David's friend proposing to act for the enemy?
J.T. Of course we have to make allowance for the dispensation. We could not think of anything like dissimulation now. It was to defeat the counsel of Ahithophel. David knew that Ahithophel had wisdom according to man.
Rem. Ittai represents attachment to David in death or in life; it is true discipleship.
J.T. Yes; so that David's challenge to him would bring out the attachment that should mark disciples. David controls everything as to his followers now -- as in rejection.
Rem. He would not be like the woman in the previous chapter, who recognised that death was not necessary.
J.T. He recognised that it was necessary. The brook Kidron represented it. Everything hinges on Christ in type here; so that Ittai and his little ones pass over. David was going out of Jerusalem, and
passing over the brook was crucial; then there was the weeping and bare feet. Mark, he was going up; there was moral ascent. All these things enter into the position of recovery. Thus we see that the faith which was dormant when David was at ease, shines in adversity.
Ques. Those sent back represent another position. Together do they present the full picture?
J.T. They are two phases of the same thing. Those that are sent back refer to the same people, only in their secret relations with David, but unknown in the apostate world; that is, it is not known that they are related to David. They are in relation to David rejected; so that their position would be regarded as treason. That is our position, if the world knew. Hence the persecution of early Christians, and later by the Romish system.
Ques. How are simple souls to be preserved from being carried away when the enemy approaches through a man like Absalom?
J.T. Well, that is one of the solemn features. The two hundred men in verse 11, who went out with Absalom, went out in their simplicity, but they went out. They are on the side of antichrist.
Ques. Would you say that it is real affection for the rejected king that preserves us from coming under such a rebellious head?
J.T. Ittai represents that side, those who love the Lord Jesus Christ. And John 14 shows that they keep His commandments, as having them.
Ques. Did not those who went out ignore the ark?
Ques. Someone referred to John's gospel, would you say that the great preservative would be what we have in John's writings?
J.T. Yes. "the king went forth, and all his household after him" (verse 16); then it says, "the king went forth, and all the people after him, and
stayed at the remote house" verse 17. The remote house would point to moral distance between Jerusalem, as coming under the domination of Absalom, and David's encampment. David's encampment is the remote house, which I think points to moral distance between Absalom's sphere and David's. And then it says, "All his servants passed on beside him" so that you have his household, his people, and his servants; and in verse 18, "all the Cherethites, and all the Pelethites, and all the Gittites, six hundred men that came after him from Gath, passed over before the king". These all represent certain elements in the position corresponding with Christ's rejection. It is a question in the history of the assembly -- the antitype. David is rejected here, but his companions represent what we have now. We go back to the beginning and see that the Lord has a system here, but in result this system becomes obscured, and is outwardly in the very midst of the apostasy; but as governed by the commands of Christ, divine wisdom begins to act so that you see the overthrow of what is against Christ. All that gives the position a wonderful importance, and it should be an incentive to us to adhere to the commands of Christ, and not to be governed by our own feelings at all.
Rem. "Ye are my friends if ye practise whatever I command you" John 15:14.
Rem. Every one who would be added to this system would be tested like Ittai. Ittai answers to the test.
J.T. He represents, as was said, the affection side. It is divinely ordered that we should be tested. In what spirit are you going forth? "Why dost thou also go with us?" (verse 19) that is the challenge.
Rem. Just like Ruth, "Do not intreat me to leave thee", @Ruth 1:16.
Rem. These Gittites came from Gath. They are rescued from the enemy's stronghold.
J.T. Yes; a remarkable picture of us all. Ittai had no claim; we have no natural claim on Christ. It was grace that met Ittai. And then we read, "And Ittai ... passed over, and all his men, and all the little ones that were with him". He is like a prince, that is, a spiritual man who influences others; it says, "and all his men". And then "the little ones" also go with him.
Rem. What underlies such an action is love for the Lord and His people.
J.T. That is right. Everyone is challenged. It is not that it is Ittai alone, he just represents a feature of the position.
Rem. Such a man could be trusted.
J.T. David entrusted him with an army later; chapter 18:2.
Rem. He really baptised his household.
J.T. That is right; but he took all over -- more than his little ones, "all his men" -- he had influence with others, with full-grown men. It is quite right in regard to our households, but how much influence have we with other people? Every one of us has influence, either for good or evil. Ittai had influence for good.
It says further, "And all the country wept with a loud voice, and all the people passed over; the king also himself passed over the torrent Kidron, and all the people passed over, towards the way of the wilderness" verse 23. The movement is against nature, for there is nothing in the wilderness for nature; it is a striking picture. What you see is the working of the Spirit of God in a crisis. The whole movement is against nature, being marked by deep feelings -- weeping.
Ques. Is that why the Lord allows tests sometimes?
J.T. I think the evidence of the work of God at any time is passing over the brook and weeping; there is no prospect before you; it is the wilderness. First it is "the remote house"; that is to say, you are cutting yourself off from what you have been going on with. And then there is the wilderness; there is nothing for the flesh.
Rem. They had David's company.
J.T. Yes. "The king also himself passed over". It is remarkable, he did not pass over first.
Ques. Would this represent the night of the Lord's betrayal?
J.T. It is more the awakening to the sense of the position which resulted from that, or what corresponds with it in the history of the church.
Ques. Is the passing over the brook, what our brother calls baptism?
J.T. Yes, I think so. There is a spiritual influence at work; they are all passing over under spiritual influence.
Rem. I suppose nothing short of that will do for the present day.
J.T. In the crisis every one is prepared to do what he can to support what is of God. As weeping, we feel the state of things; God values right sensibilities as to the state of things existing.
Ques. In John 12 the Lord speaks of hating our life in this world, and keeping it unto life eternal. I wonder if Ittai would illustrate that. Is it eternal life?
J.T. Eternal life is in view there; but here it is not the side of blessing that is in view, but hardship. They are facing the wilderness. What I see is that it is a great spiritual movement; they all come under it, they are all moving in the same direction. There is nothing for the flesh.
Ques. Would this at all correspond to going forth to Him without the camp?
J.T. I think it does. It says the king passed over, and then in verse 30, "But David went up by the ascent of the Olives, and wept as he went up, and had his head covered, and he went barefoot; and all the people that was with him covered every man his head, and they went up, weeping as they went up". Now we are on the ascent; the allusion is no doubt to the power of the Spirit, and that involves a moral elevation. They wept as they went up, it is very becoming. I think it is a great thing to understand the ascent here. If I am to be in the midst of the public apostate body, I must understand moral elevation. So that I think this section is of immense importance.
Rem. You would accept the position in going into the wilderness. It is a great test to us.
J.T. Then we have the bare feet, and everyone's head covered. You are not now like the men in Absalom's world. He was a very beautiful man; a very fine looking man with a wonderful head product. There was no one like him in regard to the product of his head, mental ability. But here they are covering their heads; they are making room for the headship of Christ. But their bare feet are on the ground. They are owning their true state. Bare feet and covered heads make room for the Spirit's operations, and the headship of Christ, and that, I think, is what has marked the history of the recovery. Room has been made for Christ as Head.
Rem. So that it depends upon what man you have before you.
Rem. Speaking of the head, one thinks of the sin offering. The head of the bullock, and the skin and flesh were to be burned outside the camp; it was hot on the altar. It is a fine word in regard to man's mental ability!
J.T. The next thing is, "And one told David, saying, Ahithophel is among the conspirators". This was a serious matter. Even David himself recognised Ahithophel's wisdom. Such a man with the conspirators was no small matter; how were they going to meet it? God had to deal with it, and He did, for we read in chapter 17:23 that Ahithophel hanged himself.
Rem. As the hidden wisdom, none of the princes of this world knew it, "for had they known, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory", @1 Corinthians 2:8.
J.T. I think that is what we shall see in the following chapters. It begins with prayer. David said, "Jehovah, I pray thee, turn the counsel of Ahithophel into foolishness", verse 31. But we have further added here, "And it came to pass, when David had come to the summit ... he worshipped God" -- at the summit. In the recovery God must have His part. He will act for David in answer to his prayer, and you reach the summit of moral elevation, you worship God. What a portion that is for God in such circumstances!
Ques. Did you say just now that this was connected with the headship of Christ?
J.T. I think room is made for it in the covering of the heads.
Rem. That is no doubt why David is spoken of as "David", not as 'King David'.
J.T. That is good. The combination against the people of God a hundred years ago was terrible. All the wisdom of the public body (which in a way was originally from the Holy Spirit, but had now passed into man's hand) was against them, and they resorted to prayer. I believe they reached the 'summit;' that is, the heavenly position.
Rem. It is a great thing, speaking of David's weakness, that he reached God here.
J.T. That is what I was thinking. He had wonderful hidden resources. I think God allows things to happen, both locally as well as generally, among the saints, to bring us to our senses, and in that way to call forth what is of God. We begin to judge the flesh, and that makes room for God. Now David is awakening, and what is of God comes into evidence.
Rem. So that, as God's government is accepted, He is free to come in for the saints.
J.T. I think He allows things to happen amongst us, so as to bring in what is of Himself. We are brought to our senses. The Lord knows what is there as Peter said, "Thou knowest all things", @John 21:17.
Ques. Do you suggest that it is only at the summit there is worship?
J.T. That is how it stands. The summit is the height of moral elevation in the Spirit.
Rem. And in connection with that there is prayer, showing that from the summit standpoint there is great dependence on God.
J.T. It is not to be different from this now; the whole result depends on the maintenance of these features, humility, bare feet, walking softly and weeping -- all these features should mark a remnant.
Rem. That is what you would look for where Christ is known as Head; these qualities would come out among His people.
J.T. Quite so; all that goes alongside the going up -- weeping and so on.
Rem. I was thinking that, at one of the darkest moments in the Lord's pathway, He could say, "I praise thee, Father, Lord of the heaven and of the earth, that thou hast hid these things from wise and prudent, and hast revealed them to babes", @Luke 10:21.
J.T. Just so; a very appropriate scripture.
Rem. You spoke about moral distance -- the remote house.
J.T. I think the position remains the same. You cannot go outside the profession; we do not go outside of that, but there is moral distance.
Ques. Would it be the position suitable in Laodicea?
J.T. The Lord is outside morally. He is standing at the door and knocking in grace, and will go in to any one who opens to Him.
Rem. David had regard for the city, he did not want to destroy it.
J.T. That is right. Sending back the ark corresponds to the believer's recognition of Christ's universal rights now. The Lord knoweth those that are His, and every one who is faithful to Him regards all the saints. Anything short of this is sectarian.
2 Samuel 17:14 - 29
J.T. It may be remarked that the object of our taking up this subject is to see how the wisdom of God works to meet the current antichristian activities. As already said, David in the main throughout this section represents what is of God in the Christian profession. Sometimes he rises into a type of Christ, but generally he typifies what is of God in the Christian profession. This includes his great failure in chapter 11, and then his want of discernment and exposure to deception in the following chapters, for, alas! even the saints are marked by these things. So that the enemy attacks us, as knowing our weakness in the way of natural inclinations; sometimes amounting to positive sin, but generally exposure to flattery, the saints being sometimes marked by natural feelings. So that Joab, as we had before us yesterday, discerned that the king's heart longed for Absalom. That is, the natural dominated the king's desire; he was not thinking that righteousness should govern Absalom's return. Thus he is exposed to Joab's machinations; and the woman's speech, which Joab put into her mouth, included an appeal, not only to David's affections, but to his vanity. She tells him he is as an angel of God, that his judgment is always right; whilst at the same time he was receiving her wrong thoughts, and being deceived by her. Over against that, what comes out in this section is that, in adversity, what is distinctively of God comes to light. Adversity brings out what is of God in David in every case. Before Joab's appeal to his natural feelings he breaks down, but God comes in in discipline, and this brings out the latent features
of His work. When we are put into trial and adversity, then it is that what is of God comes to light, so that in these chapters we see how things are balanced.
Rem. The discipline is working for good in that way.
J.T. Yes, the discipline is on God's behalf, as a provision: "For whom Jehovah loveth he chasteneth", @Proverbs 3:12. That is largely the explanation of our continuance in the truth -- the discipline of God. It is to check the natural tendency in each of us, natural feeling and, alas! pride. And so the woman's speech to David included an appeal to his vanity.
Rem. In Proverbs we have the foolish woman with her "much enticement". Proverbs 7:21
J.T. All through Proverbs the foolish woman flatters. The man speaks "froward things", Proverbs 2:12 but the woman "flattereth with her words", Proverbs 2:16.
Ques. Would that be the woman with the spirit of Python (Acts 16)?
J.T. Precisely, but the apostle Paul was not deceived by her.
Rem. The remarkable thing is that here it is a "wise woman", chapter 14:2.
J.T. That would be a wise woman as Joab would reckon, not according to God. She was not building; she was plucking down with her hands; Proverbs 14:1. But the discipline of God, from His own side, saves us and brings out what is of him in us.
Ques. "our God [is] a consuming fire" Hebrews 12:29 would not that be encouragement for us?
J.T. Quite so; but then it says, "fear", too: "Let us ... have grace, by which let us serve God acceptably with reverence and fear. For also our God is a consuming fire", (Hebrews 12:28,29); the fire is necessary. So that the weakness of David comes out, even after the recovery -- after the crisis, as we looked at it this morning. The crisis brought out what was there. David knew God; in every instance
he knew God, so that he says elsewhere, "Let us fall, I pray thee, into the hand of Jehovah; for his mercies are great", 2 Samuel 24:14. And now, fleeing from Absalom, he weeps, he is barefoot, he covers his head, he prays and he worships God.
Rem. As we were seeing this morning, there was very great gain in that he went "up".
J.T. Yes, it was as he ascended. The latent features of the work of God in him come to light. The mount of Olives shows his lowliness and humiliation. He covers his head, making room for the headship of Christ, and then he finally worships God. But chapter 16 brings out, alas! that after all this experience -- typifying our taking our place with Christ in rejection and recognising the Spirit -- we find him again capable of being deceived. In the history of the saints since the revival, since they have been brought to take their place with Christ in rejection and recognise His headship and Spirit, the flesh remains the same. So that Ziba comes in at once; he has got a deceiving story. It says, "And when David was a little past the summit, behold, Ziba, Mephibosheth's servant, met him, with a couple of asses saddled, and upon them two hundred [loaves] of bread"; 2 Samuel 16:1 and in verse 3 the king says, "Where is thy master's son?" 2 Samuel 16:3 Now this is not an Absalom nor a Joab, but it is nevertheless a man governed by the flesh, a covetous man, and his covetousness leads him to slander his brother (as we may say), one who truly loved David; and David is deceived by it. That is the solemn part of it -- exposure to deception, even in such circumstances as these.
Rem. And that after the recovery, after all that has been recovered to us. The position does not maintain us.
J.T. The great revival is indicated in chapter 15, right principles observed, and yet, in spite of that, David is again liable to deception.
Ques. What do you mean by the recovery?
J.T. The saints recovered to the truth of Christ's rejection here; He is not accepted here and we have got to go over the brook, as it were. And then there is the recognition of the Spirit, in the mount of Olives, and the recognition of the headship of Christ. These are features of the recovery, subjectively.
Rem. And they come to us through men who suffered.
J.T. Then the solemn fact comes out, that in spite of that, you have the capability of receiving slander against a brother.
Ques. Is there anything in the fact that he was a little past the summit when this took place?
J.T. Yes; there is a good deal in it; he was past the place in which he worshipped.
Rem. I suppose that, typically, he had lost the sense of dependence and the sense of worship. Now that he is past the summit he is again subject to this deception.
J.T. Paul says, "For we are the circumcision, who worship by [the] Spirit of God, and boast in Christ Jesus, and do not trust in flesh", Philippians 3:3. I suppose that is what kept him; it is what you go on with. It corresponds with the "summit" here.
Ques. Would you say that after we know what it is to reach the summit, we should be on our guard against the adversary?
J.T. Well, that is the thing; you have no confidence in the flesh. And if you have no confidence in it in yourself, you should not have any confidence in it in others. So that if a man comes to you with a story like this, you ought to ask yourself, "Is it possible that this man has any selfish motives in this attack against his brother?" Why should he say such hard things against Mephibosheth?
Ques. Would Ziba represent someone 'outside', as we say?
J.T. I do not think he does. He is the servant of Mephibosheth; he was in his household. David knew him.
Rem. David said, "Where is thy master's son?" 2 Samuel 16:3 This would show that he knew something about him.
J.T. Just so. Now the question arises, What has God been working for, what has He brought us out for, if not that we should worship? The Lord disclosed to the woman that this was the end the Father sought. If He has recovered us, surely it is to worship God. And this is to be continued.
Rem. The woman in the chapter you refer to (John 4) was being set up in the Spirit.
J.T. So that Philippians, which contemplates the very highest spiritual experience, also contemplates low conduct in the saints. Paul had to speak to them weeping.
Rem. "Enemies of the cross of Christ". Philippians 3:18
J.T. I think the special application of this incident about Ziba is to ourselves, that is, to those who have taken the position of rejection with Christ; we are still exposed to these same things, though they may come up in a different way. Ziba does not resort to Joab's means, but his effort had the same end in view, that of deceiving David for selfish purposes.
Rem. Ziba came forward at a very critical moment; David did not see through it.
J.T. And as far as the sequel goes, David never got over it; showing that a brother may be slandered in your ears, and although you recover somewhat, you may not recover wholly.
Ques. In connection with those that the apostle was weeping over, they were enemies of the cross. What was your thought?
J.T. They were enemies of the cross of Christ; their God was their belly; Philippians 3:18,19. It was their natural desires they were thinking about, and that is what Ziba was thinking about.
Ques. Would you say that minding earthly things is, in principle, apostasy?
J.T. That is right; Philippians gives Christian experience -- it is the book of Christian experience; and to mind earthly things is to oppose the truth.
Rem. Mephibosheth uses the expression, "angel of God" in the right sense; chapter 19:27. He does not use it as the woman in chapter 14 did.
Rem. In connection with what you said about Mephibosheth being a spiritual man -- he was ready to let Ziba take all, seeing the king had returned.
J.T. Exactly. The attack is usually on a spiritual man, and if he can be slandered or discredited in the eyes of his brethren, the testimony suffers.
Rem. There is a remark of J.N.D.'s, 'You take care of your conscience and let God look after your character'.
Ques. Would it help us to know who Ziba represents?
J.T. He occupied a menial position, and he was envious of his master. If you find a man who is envious in this sense, you are in the presence of a dangerous man.
Ques. Why does Shimei's cursing come in here?
J.T. Well, that is the next thing; that is the balancing thing. In verse 2 David says to Ziba, "What meanest thou by these?" 2 Samuel 16:2 and Ziba is very quick in replying; but the king is deceived. Over against that you have the attack of Shimei, which balances it. "And when king David came to Bahurim, behold, there came out from thence a man of the family of the house of Saul, whose name was Shimei, the son of Gera". 2 Samuel 16:5 Now, he is in a very definite position, "of the house of Saul". He is like the Assyrian, God would use him as a rod. And David rises here, for he refuses to allow Abishai to attack Shimei; showing that it is in adversity we shine. David says to Abishai, "Let him alone and let him
curse; for Jehovah has bidden him. It may be that Jehovah will look on mine affliction, and that Jehovah will requite me good for my being cursed this day. And David and his men went by the way", 2 Samuel 16:11 - 13. You see, he is really being helped by the discipline of God, and he is accepting it.
Ques. Does David rise, in this incident, to be a type of Christ?
J.T. I think it is Christ in us more. Of course, the Lord did submit to what came, in this sense, as from God. You submit to the discipline of God; it was a question now of submitting to God, the time for the judgment of Shimei had not come.
Ques. You were speaking of David's movements as leading up to Olivet; what have his movements in view here?
J.T. It says, "David and his men went by the way". 2 Samuel 16:13 That is to say, he is still in rejection; it is the position of rejection, he does not stop to avenge himself. The thing is to go on the way you have taken -- the way of rejection.
Ques. Is that what you meant by saying that it came in as a balance?
J.T. It was a balance for David. I suppose it is often the way with us, that we can stand abuse and opposition, but the enemy gets the better of us by flattery and deceit. We shine best in adversity. It is humiliating to have to say it, but very few of us can stand prosperity -- spiritual or otherwise.
Ques. What would put us on our guard against all that?
J.T. This chapter ought to! These scriptures are written for our learning. On the one hand you have a picture here of those right in the main, and yet capable of deception, and on the other you see that what is of God in us shines in adversity, and God justifies it. You stand out in discipline. It is often seen in the saints; they are earthly-minded whilst
in prosperity, but presently discipline comes, and then they shine.
Ques. I was wondering whether the conduct of Shimei was in the nature of railing.
J.T. Quite so; Ziba would be a slanderer, and Shimei a railer.
Rem. "Not rendering ... railing for railing", 1 Peter 3:9.
J.T. Shimei is of the house of Saul. Ziba is not opposed to David, he is simply covetous. Shimei is governed by positive wickedness for its own sake, he is "of the house of Saul". There are those who, like Joab and the wise woman from Tekoah, have personal prominence in view in their movements. Then there are those like Ziba, who are covetous. And then there are those who oppose for opposition's sake; they are out and out against what is of Christ, they are of the house of Saul. They belong to the house that has proved itself to be essentially opposed to David.
Ques. Do you mean that all this is in the profession?
J.T. Yes, it is; there are those who oppose Christ personally, and there are enemies of the cross of Christ.
Ques. Would you say that extreme Modernism would be represented by that?
J.T. It would. You have got to locate where people are; so that Shimei is located for us, he is of the house of Saul.
Ques. Do you suggest that these elements might be found in any of us?
J.T. They might, and if they are not judged they manifest themselves.
Ques. What is the position of a spiritual man in the presence of these railers?
J.T. I suppose Mephibosheth represents such. He is not here at this particular part to answer for
himself. He is brought up later and he does not attempt to justify himself; he says, "Let him even take all" (chapter 19:30); that is the opposite of covetousness. Besides, Mephibosheth disclaims any right to David's consideration. I think David also represents a spiritual man as in the presence of Shimei.
Ques. How does that illustrate our position?
J.T. You accept such opposition as the discipline of God. The consequences of the sin of the public body still exist, and we are suffering from them, we cannot evade them. I think the spiritual man always discerns the government of God in all that happens. David did here.
Rem. Judge nothing before the time.
J.T. We are having to do with God, and we are suffering from certain governmental consequences, in common with the whole professing body. We are not in the hands of Satan in this; a spiritual man never places himself there, he takes everything from God.
Rem. I thought that David felt in the bottom of his soul that the position he found himself in was due to his initial failure, and therefore, in that sense, from the Lord.
J.T. It makes all the difference whether a thing comes from God or from Satan; David takes it from God. Paul says, "A messenger of Satan" (2 Corinthians 12:7), but nevertheless it came from God. Sometimes God allows Satan to show his malice, but He permits him to go only so far, as we see in Job. Now what comes out in chapter 17 is this great question of wisdom, and there we see how God comes in. "And Jehovah had appointed to defeat the good counsel of Ahithophel" -- it is what God is doing. He has appointed to defeat what seemed to be the very best counsel; for "the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God". 1 Corinthians 3:19.
Rem. That is the other side of the picture now. You were speaking this morning of the outward side -- reproach, and the inward side -- wisdom.
J.T. What we had this morning was that in these chapters we have a secret system set up by David in the very midst of Absalom's kingdom. This in result meant the overthrow of Absalom's kingdom, as corresponding with what there is now, in the Spirit being here in the very midst of the profession in which there is apostasy. There is a secret order of things in the Spirit, governed by principles, which mean the overthrow of the Babylonish, Laodicean system. You have in this system (chapter 15) two priests with two sons, young men, and Hushai the king's friend; and we read that one of the priests is a seer, that is to say, he can see things. You can see the end of things, you can see through the current maze.
Rem. It is very striking all through Scripture that where two persons agree God comes in; where there are a few, but sufficient to maintain things, in a difficult day.
J.T. Now you see that Absalom asks Hushai to give his advice. Remarkable thing! And he gives his advice, and it says, "And Absalom and all the men of Israel said, The counsel of Hushai the Archite is better than the counsel of Ahithophel". And then is adds, "And Jehovah had appointed to defeat the good counsel of Ahithophel".
Rem. "He taketh the wise in their own craftiness", Job 5:13.
J.T. It is very encouraging to see God acting -- God controlling all this. It was His doing; He knew how to bring this about. And what you find is that two young men, a maiden, a man with a well in his house and a woman with corn are the agents in it. Now these are all the most ordinary things, but they
serve to conceal what is of God, so that the world is unable to check it.
Rem. It is interesting to see where the two young men were put.
J.T. That is what I was referring to -- the well. It is interesting to see that the man had a well in his house. He was a man who had things appointed properly.
Ques. Are all these things that you speak of as ordinary things connected with the testimony in reproach?
J.T. That is right. They are moving under David's directions, keeping his commandments; you find in verse 15 "And Hushai said to Zadok and Abiathar the priests, Thus and thus did Ahithophel counsel Absalom and the elders of Israel; and thus and thus have I counselled. And now send quickly, and tell David saying, Lodge not this night in the plains of the wilderness, but speedily pass over; lest the king be swallowed up, and all the people that are with him. And Jonathan and Ahimaaz stayed by En-rogel: and the maid went and told them" All these are very simple things, because God uses simple things, but each of these agents is under divine direction, as we may say, and they are in agreement with one another -- they are in each other's confidence. These are the things we ought to develop.
Ques. Do we look for this sort of thing in a crisis?
J.T. You have the two priests together -- they are in agreement. And the two sons are acting with them. Local difficulties often bring out divergence between the young and the old. It was not so here. And then there is the maiden brought in, showing that in these circumstances young brothers and young sisters are brought into the service with the old, so that the system works perfectly, and the will of God goes through without any pretension or show.
Ques. Is there any special significance in the well?
J.T. A good water supply is surely an important feature. It is essential to living conditions.
Rem. There would be something spiritual in that house.
J.T. And there was room there, besides the water. But these two young men are in a humiliating position for the moment. There is nothing very distinguished about the proceedings, from man's point of view. These are features of the position; the work of God goes on in these circumstances.
Rem. The men we have been tracing -- Joab and Ziba -- were seeking their own glorification. These men were put down a well, as doing the will of God.
J.T. In verse 18 it says, "Then they went both of them away quickly" There were two of them, and they came to the house of a man who had a well in his court and they went down there, and the woman spread a covering on the well's mouth and the thing was not known. You see, things are in a mystery, but the work of God goes on in such circumstances.
Rem. And the secret system is held in connection with David.
Rem. We want to hold things in connection with Christ.
Ques. The spreading of the covering -- is that the recognition of headship again?
J.T. I think the idea is hiding. Colossians is to teach us how to hide things. There must be publicity in regard to certain things, but there is also mystery; things are hidden in a mystery -- known only to those initiated. The Lord began that principle in His parabolic ministry; parabolic ministry is to hide things. He takes the disciples into the house and discloses things to them. Colossians is a hiding epistle, going out of the world. The power is there,
and the work of God is going on, but in an obscure way.
Ques. How would that apply today?
J.T. Well, I do not think we should seek any show, any publicity; or to bring the truth down to the level of the natural mind. We should never lose sight of the fact that it is a time of hiding. The merchantman hid the treasure, he found it hid and he hid it afterwards, and so all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge are hid in the mystery.
Rem. These two priests seem peculiarly connected with levitical service.
J.T. They are together, and their sons are working and moving together.
Rem. The young men acted intelligently, because they had been at the 'care-meeting', so to speak, with the older brethren.
J.T. Young men are apt to leave things to the older ones. I do not believe in the young men being excluded from the care-meeting. How can they learn things unless they are there? Indeed, every one in the assembly should be acquainted with things that are going on, both brothers and sisters. In principle, every member of the assembly is responsible in regard to the Lord's interests. But then these two young men knew how to hide, they did not talk about the matter.
Rem. Rahab also hid the two spies.
J.T. The principle of hiding is a very great feature in Christianity. "It is the glory of God to conceal a thing" Proverbs 25:2 and "a prudent man concealeth knowledge" Proverbs 12:23.
Ques. Why does the woman come into prominence in hiding?
J.T. She represents the subjective side, what would be general amongst us if we were spiritual; note the corn is ground, it is ready for use.
Rem. It is an exercise about notice-boards announcing the gospel.
J.T. Well, the gospel should be known: "Wisdom crieth without" Proverbs 1:20. The gospel of the grace of God should be announced in a public way, but when we come to the truth of the assembly, then it is a question of hiding. We must not cast our pearls before swine.
Rem. So that all these principles hold good today.
J.T. These are principles that belong to recovery, that belong to a time following a crisis when the recovery of the truth took place.
Rem. The well was not used to hide these young men from their brethren, but from the enemy.
Rem. Success here depended upon their being concealed.
J.T. You see how all works together; the man with the well, the woman with the corn, and the maid. It is a question of unity -- of confidence, old and young, brothers and sisters, working together to one end. They did not let Absalom know anything. Anything that tends to build up the antichristian world should be renounced.
Rem. These young men were carrying a very vital message.
J.T. That shows the importance of the younger men. The older brethren ought to see that. They have got much more agility, these young men can run. They are much more valuable for such service, as the apostle John says, "I have written to you, young men, because ye are strong" 1 John 2:14. Strength and energy are there.
Ques. What is the force of "all the Levites" going (chapter 15:24)? It seems as if all were in service.
J.T. They were on the "Lord's side" as in the days of the golden calf.
Ques. What would you say about circulating ministry to Christians?
J.T. The point is not to bring things down to the level of man's mind. You know how to minister, to convey your thoughts to persons who have the Spirit, but you do not want to bring the truth down to the level of man's mind. The Lord says, "ye have received gratuitously, give gratuitously"; Matthew 10:8 thus we gladly share what we have with our brethren wherever they may be.
Ques. What does the ark represent?
J.T. I think it represents Christ as the centre of everything for God, so that you cannot ignore the profession. The ark would stand in relation to all that own Christ, even though it be but in an external way. David sends it back to the city. You do not want to make it the centre of a party, or section of Christians.
Ques. Is not that very great encouragement in preaching? There are thousands of Christians around mixed up in public systems.
J.T. There is only one Christ; you take account of people according to their profession.
Ques. What do we learn from going over Jordan here?
J.T. It says, "Then David arose, and all the people that were with him, and they passed over the Jordan; by the morning light there was not one of them missing that had not gone over the Jordan" verse 22. It is the thought of safety beyond death, I suppose. In this position David is furnished abundantly; verses 27 - 29. As we were saying about Colossians, it is the boundary; it indicates the boundary where things are safe, where our life is hid with Christ in God.
Rem. "By the morning light" -- I think that is a beautiful expression.
Rem. And then it says that Absalom passed over.
J.T. He passed over to his ruin.
Rem. The enemy has no power over there.
J.T. No; I think this is the side of the truth that is presented here. All that goes on is to this end.
Rem. It is very encouraging that there is no moment in the history of the testimony that the Lord is not acquainted with; and He has provided against all contingencies.
J.T. In considering these chapters as types of our own times -- the people of God in the present dispensation -- it should be noted that they do not present consecutive history, but rather different views of the saints, of our position and circumstances; so that in this chapter we have another viewpoint.
We have been considering David as representative of what is of God in the profession, marked on the one hand by exposure to deception through natural feelings and affections; and on the other hand, as a subject of the work of God, seen in times of trial and discipline. So that the work of God in David shines in the exit, or flight, from Jerusalem; it shines there more than elsewhere. There is a thorough acceptance of the discipline of God at the brook Kidron, at the ascent of Olivet, and in the worship of God at the summit. That is one view; it is a most delightful view because it shows what is possible, what God effects among His people.
And then we have still the capability of being deceived; when a true lover of Christ, Mephibosheth, was slandered by his servant, David accepted the slander. Over against that you have the railing of Shimei, who is of the house of Saul, which again brings out the work of God in David, who humbly accepted His governmental dealings.
In this chapter it is a question of conflict; how the people of God act under certain circumstances. We have a picture here of the saints in conflict, not with the external enemy, but internal foes -- a family affair really. So that we see here humiliating things on the one hand, yet in spite of all the triumph of
what is of God. What I think we should note is, the mixed motives that governed David, which necessarily caused weakness in the conflict, uncertainty and much unnecessary loss of life, a peculiarly sorrowful feature. That is to say, many of the saints of God are unnecessarily damaged and scattered because of the want of definiteness and clearness in the issues, and in those who take the lead.
Ques. You mean that the conflict was unduly prolonged?
J.T. Yes; and then the leadership was indefinite.
Rem. They lacked the clear voice of the trumpet.
J.T. Just so; "an uncertain sound" 1 Corinthians 14:8.
Ques. Why do the sons of Zeruiah come so much to the front here?
J.T. Well, that is to be taken account of; there is nothing said of Joab since chapter 14. Abishai is mentioned, but not Joab. They were hard men, particularly Joab, an ambitious man, and he acquired the lead here, no doubt because of the want of definiteness in those whom God would use. The victories of David in his earlier days were under God marvels of military prowess, but here we have no definiteness, we have indeed the retirement of David from the generalship because the people wished it.
The position at the beginning of this chapter is to be well noted, because we are bound to have conflict, and the issues should be clear, and those who lead should be definite and free from natural considerations.
Rem. I was struck by your remark as to the difference between David in his earlier days, and David in these later scenes. Perhaps you would give us some idea as to what brought about this extraordinary weakness. It starts with his being on the house-top.
J.T. I think his weakness dates from that point -- "when kings go forth" chapter 11:1. He failed in not going forth.
Ques. Has it something to do with that scripture, "No one going as a soldier entangles himself with the affairs of life, that he may please him who has enlisted him as a soldier" 2 Timothy 2:4? Do you think that David had got himself entangled?
J.T. Yes; I think he allowed himself to get into a low state of soul by want of self-judgment, so that God allowed him to be exposed to himself in falling into such serious crimes; and he never recovered from the effects of them as far as the Scriptures show. He never regained his former energy and strength. As I said before, I think it points to the great breakdown in the history of the assembly, so that you never have the same pristine power. Now, in the presence of conflict, that we can never hope to be free of, we are taught here to avoid mixed motives; to be clear in our motives, and to think only for God and not for our natural relationships.
Rem. I suppose we have a picture of it in Pilate, he was influenced by the multitude. They said, "Away with him, crucify him" John 19:15 David was guided by what the people said. His attitude was the more unjustifiable in view of the readiness of the people to be beguiled by Absalom; it shows that their hearts were as weak as water. David should have learnt from that.
J.T. They are not to be relied on. It is not God's way that the people should lead.
Ques. Do you think we should take it to heart that the indefiniteness led to the slaughter of many?
J.T. Yes. David, left to himself, always thought of the people: "He fed them according to the integrity of his heart, and led them by the skilfulness of his hands" Psalm 78:72. He was a typical leader, but here we see failure in that which had characterised him. It is written down for us to see that in conflict we should be free from mixed motives.
Ques. Is it not most important in assembly matters to get at right principles and right motives?
J.T. And think only for the Lord -- how these things affect Him. Never mind how they affect you, or your children, or other relatives; think of how they affect the Lord, and then the issue becomes clear. You are definite; you are not hesitating.
Ques. The conflict is very testing to us all; it finds out where we are. Would it suggest what we get in Ephesians: "our struggle is not against blood and flesh"? Ephesians 6:12 I was thinking of David at the time he slew Goliath -- what he was to God then! We may be before God very well in our youth, but we may go back as we get older.
J.T. That is right; it will not do to start well and stop. David began well. "Ye ran well; who has stopped you that ye should not obey the truth?" Galatians 5:7. Many young men shine in the conflict, and later become engrossed in family affairs. One has known of cases where issues have been beclouded because certain families were involved. Abishai was unable to see that God was behind Shimei's attack, and so he proposed what would take the matter out of His hands.
Rem. Joab had an official position as chief and captain.
J.T. Well, David marshalled the forces. He was himself supreme. There could be no question about David's rights in the matter. He marshalled the people that were willing; that was right. He took the initiative, but he did not follow it up, and so room was made for Joab. I think this chapter intends bringing to light the character of Joab, and the weakness and folly of David in being so partial to Absalom. David at the outset should have known the damaging influence of family feelings. His brothers were envious of him, "Why art thou come down? and with whom hast thou left those few sheep
in the wilderness?" they question him; 1 Samuel 17:28. Relatives are not to be trusted; they are, as such, useless in the things of God. But David says, "What have I now done? Was it not laid upon me?" 1 Samuel 17:29 There was a cause, and he took the field in the name of the God of Israel. Well, that is where he missed it here.
Rem. You have touched the weak spot in every one of our gatherings, the lack of definiteness, occasioned largely through natural influences.
J.T. And even although David did not go with the army, it was their business to recognise what he said. And so Joab is exposed; he did not care for either David or Absalom, as the sequel shows. So, that we find certain hard men coming to the front but it is due to the fact that the subjects of the work of God are not wholly available. The door is thus often opened to hard ambitious men.
Ques. Does it show the low spiritual condition of David, that God had to use men like the sons of Zeruiah?
J.T. God is, as it were, forced to use certain ones, because He takes up what there is -- what is available. But why should not the product of the work of God be available? What is the matter? Why should unfit men be in the front? capable in their way, energetic, but unspiritual. They misrepresent God.
Why should any one whom God has fitted to serve hold back? Why should I let others do the work when the responsibility is mine? Why should I not go forward, free of mixed motives -- family affairs? If I do not go forward, I simply leave the field open for unfit men. God will use what is available, for, after all, it is His business.
Rem. And the saints have to accept what they do.
J.T. They have to; although God will ever look after His own interests.
Rem. Paul withstood Peter to the face.
J.T. There you have a man wholly free from natural considerations. Paul might have said, Well, Peter is an old brother and has been in the Lord's company, and it is not suitable that I should say anything. That would be accepted, no doubt, by the brethren; but he says, "I withstood him to the face, because he was to be condemned" Galatians 2:11. He sacrificed his feelings that the truth might remain with the brethren.
Rem. He saved the position without great loss.
J.T. Quite so; and Peter was evidently helped and the truth maintained. Peter recognised Paul later, as we know, regarding his writings as Scripture; 2 Peter 3:15,16. Paul was face to face with a serious situation, but being free from natural considerations he acted for God and God gave him victory. David never lacked courage; his great weakness was susceptibility to natural influence -- relatives, and others. God dealt with Absalom Himself; David was responsible to be there, but he had accepted the will of the people.
J.T. The rank and file of the saints. I am not speaking of them as the assembly. The divine way is leadership in persons qualified. Israel were led like a flock by the hand of Moses and Aaron; and so also by David later.
Ques. How do you regard Ittai?
J.T. He is in his place; he had no natural claim, but he loved David. What you notice is the prominence acquired by Joab through all this; he even dominates David. David's weakness made way for this.
Ques. You have spoken of natural influence -- I was wondering what you meant.
J.T. Well, influence arising from the consideration of our relatives in the flesh; also special friendships. Love is indiscriminate; the Colossians and Ephesians
loved ALL the saints -- they were not partial. It is that sort of thing we have to guard against to be clear visioned, so that the issue becomes clear; we know what we are going to do, and we do it.
Ques. What was the issue here?
J.T. It was an uprising against David of one in the relation of son. Absalom represents the present antichristian uprising. The uprising is against David -- not yet against Solomon. It is a most serious conflict; we must perceive the seriousness of it; we cannot allow trifles to interfere with our part in it.
Rem. If you withstand a brother "to the face" he is unlikely to hold anything against you afterwards.
J.T. That is right, "Faithful are the wounds of a friend" Proverbs 27:6.
Rem. There was no hardness on the part of Paul when he withstood Peter; it was in the spirit of Christ.
J.T. Now what you see here in David not coming forward is that the battlefield is badly chosen; it is the "forest of Ephraim" (verse 6), a most unsuitable place.
Ques. The wood devoured more than the sword (verse 8). What is the thought?
J.T. Well, the selection of the battlefield is important. You do not want trees to do damage to people. The forest has not heart or conscience; it is a pity that people should fall by that means. If anyone falls, let it be on account of opposing the truth. There is no clear vision in the forest. And now what you find is that it was no credit to the servants of David that Absalom came into their hands; it was God's doing.
Ques. What part would you have in selecting the position?
J.T. If there is to be conflict you turn to God -- so that the truth should be at no disadvantage in it.
Ques. Would you say that the leaders were to blame?
J.T. I think that is how it stands.
Ques. How would one recognise a right leader?
J.T. He goes forward definitely governed by divine principles and he has no mixed motives. Through godliness he has moral weight and so influences his brethren according to God.
Ques. And should we not remember that true leaders are a special mark for the adversary?
J.T. Quite so. God provides the leaders. If you look at the book of Exodus you will be impressed with the patience of God in providing two men -- Moses and Aaron -- and God led the people by them.
Rem. They speak to us the word of God, and they have Christ as their object.
J.T. That is what it says in Hebrews 13:7. And then we are told to obey our leaders and be submissive, for they watch over our souls as those who shall give account (verse 17).
Ques. Would leaders come to light in local gatherings, as well as universally?
J.T. I think they qualify locally, as David did. Joab wished to climb to the top himself, for David becomes his servant. Returning to Absalom it says, "And Absalom was riding upon a mule, and the mule went under the thick boughs of the great terebinth, and his head caught in the terebinth, and he was taken up between the heaven and the earth; and the mule that was under him went away. And a man saw it" verses 9,10. This man, I think, represents the work of God in the midst of all these things. Seemingly it was an accidental thing, and Joab says, "And behold, thou sawest him, and why didst thou not smite him there to the ground?" He answers in effect, I have respect for the king; that is the kind of spirit; how different if Joab had been possessed of that spirit! This man says, "For in our hearing
the king charged thee and Abishai and Ittai, saying, Take care, whoever it be [of you], of the young man Absalom. Or I should have acted falsely against mine own life, for there is no matter concealed from the king, and thou thyself wouldest have set thyself against [me]". That is a right spirit -- respect for what is said by the king.
Ques. You referred yesterday to Absalom's head and hair; is there any link with that in the way he is caught here?
J.T. The Spirit of God makes much of the product of his head; all that seems to be used in the government of God for his destruction. "He taketh the wise in their own craftiness; and the counsel of the wily is carried headlong", Job 5:13. The power that had carried him failed him -- the mule went away -- "and he was taken up between the heaven and the earth". All this expresses the humiliating judgment of God, as overtaking such a man.
Rem. And in that way it did what David failed to do.
J.T. I think we ought to notice another feature here, the message-bearers. How am I to be a message-bearer? It brings out the desire of the young man to be running, come what may. Ahimaaz wanted to be running: "Come what may, let me run" he says, verse 23. It is a rebuke, I think, to young men who wish to run for running's sake. Ahimaaz had already done well, and now he wants to run again, and he has no message. This is an exposure of what we often see in persons who wish to be active, whether they have a commission or not. Here we have another view of Joab; he is one in responsibility now to give a message, and Ahimaaz says, "Let me run" but Joab -- representing what is right -- says, "There is no news suited to thee" It is a principle that comes out here, that the messenger must be in keeping with
the message. If God gives a message He gives it to a suitable vessel.
Ques. Would not that apply even in preaching the gospel?
Rem. We have to realise, too, that we are to serve as under the Lord's orders.
J.T. So that Joab here represents one in a position to give a message. He is able to tell, and he has discernment as to the kind of vessel that should take it; but still he lets Ahimaaz run -- there is failure even there; the whole position is marked by weakness.
Ques. What is in your mind in speaking of the messenger being in accord with the message?
J.T. Well, that the work of God is varied; everything emanates from God. Every vessel is to be hung on Christ; Isaiah 22:24. There are different vessels, but each is to be "sanctified, serviceable to the Master" 2 Timothy 2:21.
Rem. Messengers, in the New Testament, are Christ's glory; they are fitted; 2 Corinthians 8:23.
J.T. And then there is another thing, that in undertaking work that is not yours, you discredit yourself. David says, "He is a good man, and comes with good news" verse 27. But when he arrives he does not know anything; he spoke of a "tumult ... but ... knew not what it was"; it is all confusion. And the king says, "Turn aside [and] stand here. And he turned aside and stood still" Now that is a very humiliating thing -- to stand aside as knowing nothing definitely of the matter to be reported. The next thing to note is that the other messenger is a Cushite; he has nothing to commend him, being of that stock, whereas Ahimaaz was of the priests. Here is a man who has no reputation at all, in that way, but he has a message; he knows all about what happened.
Ques. "Go tell the king what thou hast seen" (verse 21); is there something in that?
J.T. Yes; he was a witness. That is the point the Lord stresses in Luke 24:48 "Ye are witnesses of these things" I must be a witness to bear witness.
Rem. It was not a message that would appeal to David in a natural way.
J.T. No; he made no allowance for David's natural feelings: "The enemies of my lord the king, and all that rise against thee for evil, be as that young man" He had a thorough judgment of the thing. Whereas Ahimaaz seemed afraid to tell the truth; though he knew it well enough, verse 20. We must not be afraid to wound people's natural feelings in presenting the truth of God; we need faithfulness. The way the Cushite tells the thing shows that he had a thorough judgment of Absalom, and no one can preach the gospel unless he has a thorough understanding of the judgment of God on that man.
These scriptures are typical of what happens among saints today, in order that we may avoid the evils indicated.
Ques. What is the thought in the "ten young men" in verse 15: "And ten young men that bore Joab's armour surrounded and smote Absalom, and killed him"
J.T. These, I believe, are party men; they carry Joab's armour. Elsewhere we read of Joab's men. You can see what a type of man Joab was from that -- he gathered people round him; there were ten young men. Men like Joab always have special persons to support them. Here they are thoroughly with him.
Ques. They speak well of their leader, but not of Christ; is it not a very serious thing to have a combination among the people of God?
J.T. Quite so; David is not said to have armour-bearers, whereas Joab's armour-bearers are spoken of.
Rem. It struck me, too, in chapter 20, when Amasa was slain, it says, "And one of Joab's young men stood by [Amasa] and said, He that favours Joab, and he that is for David, let him follow Joab" 2 Samuel 20:11. Joab comes first in his thoughts.
Rem. I think Mr. Darby said he would not belong to a party for the truth any more than he would belong to one against it.
Ques. How can a young man avoid getting under the influence of such a leader?
J.T. I should say, by keeping to the true Leader. There are leaders, of course. It says, "Remember your leaders", but then it adds, "Jesus Christ [is] the same yesterday, and today, and to the ages [to come]" (Hebrews 13:7,8); that is the balance.
Rem. I suppose if we were loyal to the rejected One we should esteem highly all those who are truly serving Him.
J.T. Paul says, "Ye became our imitators, and of the Lord" 1 Thessalonians 1:6.
Rem. So that a true leader would bring them to the Lord.
Ques. Can we be rightly loyal to any one but Christ? People sometimes speak about being loyal to your brethren.
J.T. No doubt what is meant is fellowship; it is more that you are true to the fellowship. We have to respect the brethren; in all I am doing I must see that I do not compromise them.
Ques. Would you say what "mothers in Israel" mean?
J.T. Persons who exercise maternal care over the saints. Deborah does not undertake the place of leadership; she says, "Hath not Jehovah the God of Israel commanded?" Judges 4:6.
Rem. The New Testament does not refer to Deborah at all; it is Barak's leadership (Hebrews 11:32) God leads by men.
Ques. What is the thought of kings going forth to battle; 2 Samuel 11:1?
J.T. I suppose it refers to times of conflict, when you should not take your ease; as Urijah says, "The ark, and Israel, and Judah abide in booths; and my lord Joab, and the servants of my lord, are encamped in the open fields" 2 Samuel 11:11. What a rebuke to David. He should have been there himself; if he had been there he would not have fallen into sin.
Divine wisdom operating against apostasy (5)
2 Samuel 19:9 - 43; 2 Samuel 20:15 - 22
Ques. Would you say a little for the benefit of those who were not here this morning?
J.T. We read chapter 18 this morning, which, as you will observe, gives an account of the final stage of the conflict between David's forces and those of Absalom. What developed was, that those responsible to lead were governed by mixed motives. David was indefinite, being prepossessed with his love for Absalom. He was governed by natural feeling and affection, and so was indefinite, with the result that the battlefield was badly chosen and many lives were unnecessarily sacrificed. The command was divided into three parts instead of being directly centred in David, who was responsible, and who, indeed, was best qualified as a military leader.
The battle took place in the wood of Ephraim, and more people were destroyed by the trees than by the sword; this should not have happened. The door was thus opened to Joab, who, as we have already noticed, was governed by personal motives, having his own reputation before him; so that he, through David's weakness, acquired the dominating position.
We noted that these records are not consecutive, as typifying the current history of the people of God, but rather present different views.
What we had in chapter 18 refers to the conflict and the principles that should govern us. The conflict we shall have as the testimony continues. Joab acquired a dominant position amongst them, all due to the weakness of the element that was directly responsible to God, and fitted to lead.
Then we noted, in the end of the chapter, another feature of our present position, that is, the carrying of messages. The victory, involving the death of Absalom, had to be reported to David, and Joab is now typical of one in a position to give a message. Ahimaaz says, "Let me run" We noted the disposition of young brothers to "run anyway" Whereas Joab had pointed out that the message was not suited to him in that the king's son was dead, but Ahimaaz says, Let me run, and he did run, but he had no definite message, so that when he arrived he had to stand on one side -- a humiliating thing. The Cushite was fitted for the message; although not so fast a runner, he had a message.
Rem. I thought what you said about those who suffered through the trees was important; in a crisis side issues arise, and people are carried away by them.
J.T. Quite so; I think it should be well noted that in conflict the effort should be to avoid unnecessary losses. Losses there must be; if there is opposition to the truth there has to be discipline, but these scriptures show that the effort should be to restrict it -- to reduce it to a minimum.
Rem. So that the spirit in which the conflict is carried on is important, there should be a desire to save the brethren.
J.T. The culminating feature is in the wise woman at Abel, she reduced the loss to one -- the chief offender; chapter 20:16 - 22. She did it in her wisdom. I believe it is in this woman's wisdom that we see the point of all this instruction.
Rem. There is a lesson to be learnt from it.
J.T. I thought that in this chapter we might see that another exercise is in view; it is the 'reconstruction' period. There always has to be such a period after a conflict, because everything is affected. All the people of God are affected in a conflict for the
testimony, and there has to be a rearrangement according to what has been brought to light. There should be some spoil out of every conflict. So that now it is a question of David's return to Jerusalem, and Jordan involves an exercise in these new circumstances; death has to be accepted. It is stated "Now Israel had fled every man to his tent. And all the people were at strife throughout the tribes of Israel, saying, The king delivered us out of the hand of ... the Philistines; and now he is fled out of the land because of Absalom. And Absalom, whom we anointed over us, is dead in battle; and now why are ye silent as to bringing the king back?" (verses 9,10). It was a sorrowful situation, but not a hopeless one, for the chief offender was out of the way. And now David is coming back into his place, so that we have the thoughts of many hearts revealed, showing what has been effected in those who came to meet him. It is the time of readjustment, and we find our places according to what we have gained in the exercise.
Rem. It is very important that in every crisis, although we may not go through it intelligently, yet we should feel we gain something.
J.T. Something comes to light that has to be definitely noted in a crisis, and I think that what came to light in David was his undue attention to natural affection. When Absalom was slain, he referred to him eight times as "his son" calling him "My son, my son" showing how obsessed he was, and that is the secret that God would bring to light. There is always something underneath that comes to light, and David exposes himself in bewailing Absalom so many times as his son.
Rem. Attention was called to the spirit that animated Joab, and the spirit that was shared by the ten armour-bearers. That we should carry a right spirit is a very important thing.
J.T. I think we noted that the point was that they were his men -- Joab's men; it comes to light in this chapter that he had a band associated specially with him, so that when Amasa was slain, one of Joab's men said, "He that favours Joab, and he that is for David, let him follow Joab" 2 Samuel 20:11; he places Joab before David, showing that Joab was a party man; he had more concern about himself than about David.
Ques. Are you suggesting that new positions are given in this chapter?
J.T. Yes; readjustment is proceeding, and David makes plain that he intends to supersede Joab, but he is not able to do it. That is to say, in the government of God the effect of his weakness stands. Joab regains his place as head of the army. In the end of chapter 20 Joab is said to be over all the host of Israel; that was not David's intent, but he was unable to prevent it -- a very humiliating experience for a king. Nevertheless, what we get here is, one and another coming into evidence in relation to David's return.
Ques. It was said earlier that Solomon was out of sight in all this; I was wondering if things lead up to the bringing in of Solomon later.
J.T. I think all this instruction in connection with the wise woman lays the ground for Solomon's reign. The wise woman of Abel through her wisdom delivered the city; her thought was to save all except the offender. Solomon was governed by that principle (see 1 Kings 3); he would not allow the child to be cut in two; he brought to light in his wisdom the mother of the child. The mother would have the child whole even if given to another. That is the thing to get hold of; your great thought is not to divide the saints; you preserve the truth, but you preserve the saints with it. That brings to light the mother of the child. And for that wisdom is essential.
Ques. Does not that mean that every feature is to be weighed and considered; you desire to face every phase of the exercise so that everyone may benefit by it?
J.T. There has to be the resetting of things, and Joab has to be displaced. He has discredited himself. He brought back Absalom, and brought all this about through his effort to push himself forward. And now what you find is that Israel "had fled every man to his tent" 2 Samuel 19:8, and there was strife; it was serious, but not hopeless; for David was coming back to his house. He was on his way back, and he resorted to the provision he had made in leaving the priests, Zadok and Abiathar, in Jerusalem. They could be relied on as representative of the secret system within Jerusalem at the time of the apostasy. They were the undoing of Absalom. Now David is coming back to Jerusalem, and he sends to these two men, Zadok and Abiathar, saying, "Speak to the elders of Judah saying, Why are ye the last to bring the king back to his house? seeing the speech of all Israel is come to the king, to his house. Ye are my brethren, ye are my bone and my flesh; and why will ye be the last to bring back the king?" (verses 11,12). Here you have an appeal through the priests; it is a question of recognising those who stand the test -- men who stood well in the most adverse circumstances. Now they are available to David in Jerusalem.
Ques. Does the reconstruction begin with what is priestly?
J.T. I think it must, it is the divine way to begin with the priestly element. I think we have a principle there as to reconstruction -- the recognition of the priestly element. The priests, normally, are pre-eminently free from natural feelings; Phinehas was marked by that as representative of the priesthood; Numbers 25. Freedom from natural feelings is characteristic of priestly service.
Ques. Would you say that, in regard to the present dispensation, it would mean the truth of the assembly? These men are in agreement on priestly lines to recover the saints in proper relation to Christ.
J.T. Quite so; they are those who recognise the Spirit. Priesthood, in the true sense, refers to those who have the Spirit. Every true Christian has the Spirit, but it is another thing to be marked off as having the Spirit -- to be spiritual. The apostle could not speak to the Corinthians as spiritual. He had to send Timotheus that he might be amongst them as representative of what is spiritual.
Ques. Do you think that, in connection with recovery, we start with the sovereign side, rather than the responsible side? The elders of Judah were exercised about bringing David back.
J.T. Well, the priestly element is taken into account first. Next, those who were near of kin to David; which would mean a more extended state among the saints. David appeals to them, "Ye are my brethren, ye are my bone and my flesh" The line taken is, first the priestly element, and then the brethren -- those that have that relationship with David.
Ques. I was wondering what we have in Judah here.
J.T. Judah represents brethren to David, because he was of that tribe. They would represent the brethren, or those who would respond to that relationship, for after all, all true Christians are brethren, whatever our state may be. The appeal is on that line, "Ye are my brethren"; but the message comes through the priests -- not now through the young men, but through experienced men, spiritual men.
Rem. So that the exercise is taken up on spiritual lines, as coming from the priesthood.
J.T. David did not employ any others. Judah was really the most responsible in the rebellion;
they were near to David, but it was at Hebron; Hebron was the centre of it.
Ques. Can you reconstruct a meeting after conflict on the responsible line merely?
J.T. I think the thing is to get the spiritual first, and then the brethren. 'Brethren' is a common term; 'priesthood' refers generally in Scripture to those who are spiritual, but when you think of the brethren it includes all Christians, and we can appeal to all on that line.
Ques. Would David in that way seek to restore confidence in the men of Judah, in his grace?
J.T. Well, I think you see his wisdom now; "He bowed the heart of all the men of Judah, as of one man"; that was a great achievement.
Ques. Is it not touching, the appeal to Amasa, one who had been a leader in the opposition, but now appealed to in grace by David?
J.T. And it is on the same principle -- as related to him -- his bone and his flesh. Things have been gotten together firstly through the ministry of the priests, but also on family lines, for after all, that is what God is looking for.
Rem. So that, as you were saying, the real mother of the child, who had the good of the child at heart, would not suffer any damage to be done to it.
J.T. It is a terrible thing to divide the people of God. I think the thing here is that you do not do that, you reach the offender with the minimum of loss; you are concerned to save all the brethren. Save the truth, maintain righteousness, but save the brethren.
Ques. Do not these relationships bring in the assembly?
J.T. They do. That is the point, that these chapters are types; they are not exactly prophetic. Prophecy comes in later, as in Isaiah and Jeremiah. These early books, after the Pentateuch, are to make
clear to us the history of the people of God in its various phases, and to give different views of the people of God in our dispensation. This section is to teach us how to overcome antichristian rebellion by wisdom. It is a question of wisdom, which is the handmaid of love. And so the great object is to save all the brethren while still maintaining the truth; if the offender has to suffer, let him suffer, but not any others; because saints are generally misled. What came out in regard to Absalom was that two hundred went out with him "in their simplicity" 2 Samuel 15:11; they did not understand the movement.
Ques. Whom do you refer to in the saints? Have you the whole church of God in view?
J.T. Certainly. We are to "contend earnestly for the faith once delivered to the saints" (Jude 3); but we must seek to keep all the brethren. If one has to suffer, let him suffer, as the wise woman points out. Joab would have destroyed the whole city to get the offender, showing that he was devoid of love for the saints, and of wisdom.
Rem. The whole of Judah and Israel come to David in the end.
J.T. Yes, they do; but twenty thousand people fell, when many might have been saved. Differences ought to be settled before they reach public division.
Rem. "Consider those who create divisions and occasions of falling, contrary to the doctrine which ye have learnt, and turn away from them" Romans 16:17.
J.T. The "grievous wolves" do not spare the flock, others would draw disciples after them. Divisions are always thus marked. I am speaking of our responsibility; God allows divisions that the approved may be manifested among us. Now the first movement in answer to David's appeal is on the part of the men of Judah, and they come to Gilgal. It is now really a question of recovery. The reconstruction period implies movement on the part of one and
another. David is at the Jordan. We have to take every scripture in its own setting. Jordan here refers to death; readjustment must begin there. There can be nothing for God apart from death. So that each has to make up his mind that he is not to carry over his own affairs and interests. But, alas! in spite of the fact that that great principle stands out, such men as Joab and Abishai acquire the dominating position; nevertheless, there is the principle. David is at the Jordan and the men of Judah come to Gilgal to meet him. It is needless to say that these scriptures have a spiritual meaning; they are put down by the Spirit of God for us, because we are supposed to understand what Gilgal means. Gilgal is the rolling away of the reproach of Egypt; worldly reproach was attached to Judah. There never has been a conflict amongst the people of God in which worldly principles and conduct did not appear. At Gilgal this is dealt with. The movement is a spiritual one -- at least in the setting of it here -- and that is the point.
Rem. There is a definite disallowance of the flesh.
J.T. Quite so. It is befitting that we should go to Gilgal; that there should be no reserve, but a frank, open acknowledgment of everything. Then we have Shimei coming; it is a general movement; one and another according to what each has been doing goes to meet the king. There is no hiding of things. So that Shimei comes, and he has one thousand men with him. Well, that is not very hopeful; repentance is not in a company, it is an individual matter. Shimei has one thousand men of Benjamin with him; I suppose he was making a good show to David. Then we have Ziba, the servant of the house of Saul, and his fifteen sons and twenty servants; he has a good show, too.
Rem. It says of Judah that they came as one man; they were exercised individually.
J.T. Quite so. Jacob had many children and droves of cattle in coming to meet Esau (Genesis 32 and 33); it was a question of making a good show, but making a good show will not do. Ziba was a slanderer, and Shimei the railer, and there is no evidence that they had judged themselves.
Rem. They wanted to save their faces.
Rem. "They shall look on me whom they pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for an only [son]" Zechariah 12:10. That is rather the principle; one had wronged Mephibosheth and the other had wronged David.
Ques. Would the fact of Ziba and Shimei being respectively a slanderer and a railer show how solemn the two evils are?
J.T. Yes, they are very deep-rooted. Slander is the outcome of a very deep-rooted evil, speaking evil of one behind his back; a railer is a man who is dominated by sin; he is not ashamed to speak out in the presence of the person he would attack. There is no evidence that Shimei ever judged himself. He tries to make up for his railing here, and makes a long speech to David, and David says, "Thou shalt not die" God saw to it that he died, for he was put to death by Solomon. What we are in the presence of here is that David is coming back to his house and he wants to show that he is king: "For do not I know that I am this day king over Israel?" Poor David! Current facts hardly proved that he was. He was not king in the sense of moral power, for Joab was too much for him, but he was king in the sense of forgiveness, which is a very important side. David did not really clear Shimei; he committed him to Solomon for judgment later. We must never overlook it that forgiveness is a feature of the kingdom; but it is also said, "By no means clearing [the guilty]" Numbers 14:18.
Ques. What does the ferry-boat mean?
J.T. I think it is to bring out that it is not death in the primary sense. It is Jordan passable in this way; the thought of death is retained. The next one who comes is Mephibosheth; he does not bring anybody with him. He is alone.
J.T. He is solitary in his glory, it seems to me. "He had neither washed his feet, nor trimmed his beard, nor washed his clothes, from the day the king departed until the day he came [again] in peace" He is alone as a lover of David -- as one man that loves Christ. He had been slandered by his servant, and he points that out to David, but David never seems to have gotten over Ziba's story; showing how pernicious slander is. He says, "Why speakest thou any more of thy matters? I have said, Thou and Ziba divide the land" verse 29. It is a very poor speech.
Rem. It seems a very strange thing that David did not commend Mephibosheth.
J.T. It does; but it brings out what we are dealing with -- the weakness of things. The Holy Spirit would not mention these things if it were not so.
Rem. Although Mephibosheth was not with David, he shared all the conditions of rejection.
J.T. Yes; it says he was not able to go on account of his lameness.
Rem. He does not seem to have troubled about personal appearance; he has the king in his heart.
J.T. He shows by his attire and demeanour that he feels the absence of the king; he is typically a lover of Christ.
Rem. The Spirit of God vindicates him.
J.T. I think that is the point; the Holy Spirit would not mention all these things save to bring out what Mephibosheth was, typically, as a lover of Christ. And he says to David, regarding Ziba, "Let him even take all"; he did not want the inheritance -- he wanted David.
Rem. That would be the right spirit for reconstruction.
J.T. Yes. There was one among the saints whom the Lord could call attention to. "Seest thou this woman? I entered into thy house; thou gavest me not water on my feet, but she has washed my feet with tears, and wiped them with her hair ... Her many sins are forgiven; for she loved much" Luke 7:44 - 48. She loved much, as forgiven much. If there is one person that loves the Lord, He calls attention to it. And so Mephibosheth shows here that he loved much, because of the grace shown to him.
Ques. How is it that he was not with David?
J.T. The chapter tells you. It says that his servant deceived him, and he was lame. Zadok and Abiathar and others were active men, but Mephibosheth was a passive witness of love to David; he was appreciative of the grace of David. It must be a great matter to Christ, if there is one in any company who feels His absence. The Lord will call attention to him.
Rem. Mephibosheth vindicated David; there was no self-vindication: "For all my father's house were but dead men before my lord the king; and thou didst set thy servant among them that eat at thine own table. What further right therefore have I?" (verse 28). He was a mourner really; one that truly loved the king.
J.T. The more we come under grace and the sovereign mercy of God, the more sense we have of having no rights at all. What rights have I? It is God's mercy and "His great love wherewith he loved us" Ephesians 2:4. Then we have Barzillai; he came from the other side. He was an old man: "And Barzillai was very aged, eighty years old" I think this passage shows that age in itself does not promote spirituality. He was a great man, and he maintained the king, but he did not have any taste
for what was in Jerusalem. David, however, had great respect for him.
Ques. Are there any old men spiritually? There are 'fathers', but are there 'old men'?
J.T. I think when it is mentioned that one is very old, attention is called to something else; that you have not travelled spiritually as fast as you have grown old. Barzillai is said to have been a very aged man, and yet he could not go all the way with the king. There are those who think of their age as if years in themselves counted; they only count if they are "in the way of righteousness"
Rem. Paul speaks of his kinsmen who were in Christ before him; Romans 16:7.
J.T. Yes; but they were not such as "Paul the aged" Philemon 9. The name had evidently a spiritual meaning.
Rem. Barzillai might have been a fresher man if he had been on the other side of Jordan.
J.T. Exactly. The Holy Spirit gives him all possible credit. David had high regard for him, but he declined to go to Jerusalem with David. Of course he gives excuses: "And Barzillai said to the king, How many are the days of the years of my life, that I should go up with the king to Jerusalem? I am this day eighty years old: can I discern between good and bad? can thy servant taste what I eat and what I drink? can I hear any more the voice of singing men and singing women? and why should thy servant be yet a burden to my lord the king?" (verses 34,35). He had lost the use of his senses; as we may say, they had not been 'exercised'.
Rem. In the crisis he had been very true, before Absalom was slain; that was a very good thing.
J.T. Oh, excellent! But then, what can make up in the Lord's heart for your absence in His place? No matter how good his excuses were, we find in the end that David was at Jerusalem without Barzillai.
Ques. What is Mahanaim associated with?
J.T. I think that the setting of Barzillai is that he lived on the wrong side of Jordan; he typifies a Christian who, having the Spirit, as seen in the epistle to the Romans, loves the Lord, but does not accept death in a practical way. He has no taste for heavenly things.
Rem. It is a serious thing not to go all the way.
J.T. It is certainly a serious thing not to have the taste to go. Why should I not have the taste to be with the Lord -- to hear there the holy chants: "the voice of singing men and singing women"? Think of what he is deliberately giving up! To be sure he is furnishing excuses: "Let thy servant ... turn back again, that I may die in mine own city" He offered, however, to go a little way over the Jordan, which was just complimentary to David.
Ques. Did he cease to feed upon the "strong meat"?
J.T. I think so. He was "a great man"; whereas, if he had gone to Jerusalem he would have been a greater man, only he would seem less, outwardly. One lesson to be learnt here is the importance of maintaining a keen spiritual taste. It was a mark of Immanuel: he ate butter and honey that he might know "to refuse the evil, and to choose the good" Isaiah 7:15.
Rem. The tree of the knowledge of good and evil is one.
J.T. What is to be added in regard to Barzillai is that what he declined for himself he would have Chimham to have; he thought it would be a good thing for him, and Chimham went in for it.
Rem. There is never any end to conflict; when there is apparently rest, another issue appears.
J.T. No doubt the altercation at the end of chapter 19 made way for chapter 20. It says, "And the words of the men of Judah were harsher than the
words of the men of Israel" (verse 43); harsh words are provocative. The harsh words of the men of Judah undoubtedly made way for Sheba's rebellion; because it goes on to say, "There happened to be there a man of Belial, whose name was Sheba, the son of Bichri, a Benjaminite; and he blew a trumpet, and said, We have no portion in David, neither have we inheritance in the son of Jesse: every man to his tents, Israel" 2 Samuel 20:1 Harsh words imply the absence of consideration for one another. Under such circumstances there was not wanting a man to take advantage of them; he blew a trumpet.
Rem. There could have been gracious words without any compromise.
J.T. Quite so; and there might never have been a Sheba; but he "happened to be there"; it was his opportunity. There is always someone ready to take advantage of the strained relations arising from harsh words.
Rem. "[Let] your word [be] always with grace, seasoned with salt" Colossians 4:6.
Ques. Was there anything in this issue worth contending for?
J.T. Nothing at all. Israel began, of course; they had ten parts in David; they had been making poor use of them. And now they are boasting of it, and Judah is also boasting; the king is near of kin to them; but they had been making poor use of it, too! If all had been really lovers of David, they would not have been at strife; the harsh words and the cleavage opened the door for Sheba and another revolt. So the lesson is, to close our ranks by love and consideration for one another, and to avoid harsh words.
Ques. Would you say that jealousy was at the bottom of it?
J.T. Undoubtedly. And now the revolt of Sheba brings this wise woman into evidence; the whole
lesson here is in what she does; it is "the wisdom of women" It says in Proverbs, "The wisdom of women buildeth their house" Proverbs 14:1; it is what is subjective. "And a wise woman cried out of the city, Hear, hear: say, I pray you, unto Joab, Come near hither, that I may speak with thee. And he came near to her; and the woman said, Art thou Joab? and he said, I [am he]. And she said to him, Listen to the words of thy handmaid. And he said, I am listening. And she spoke saying, They were wont to speak in old time saying, Just inquire in Abel; and so they ended. I am peaceable [and] faithful in Israel: thou seekest to destroy a city and a mother in Israel. Why wilt thou swallow up the inheritance of Jehovah?" (chapter 20:16 - 19.) She is a wise woman, and she appeals to what is of the old time; she would go back to first principles -- "Inquire in Abel; and so they ended"
Ques. Would you connect that with what was at the beginning?
J.T. Exactly. She would have no innovations; what was at the beginning was enough for her.
Ques. What principle is in it?
J.T. What was said "in old time" She is not dealing with innovations -- with modernism.
Rem. She took a broad view of the situation: it was "the inheritance of Jehovah" that was in her heart.
Rem. At the beginning "they persevered in the teaching and fellowship of the apostles, in breaking of bread, and prayers" Acts 2:42
J.T. That is the idea. Whatever light had governed the saints "in old time" she appeals to. Then Joab gives her the facts of the case: "The matter is not so; but a man of mount Ephraim, Sheba the son of Bichri by name, has lifted up his hand against the king, against David: give up him only, and I will depart from the city. And the woman
said to Joab, Behold, his head shall be thrown to thee over the wall. Then the woman went to all the people in her wisdom. And they cut off the head of Sheba the son of Bichri, and cast it to Joab. And he blew a trumpet, and they dispersed from the city, every man to his tent. And Joab returned to Jerusalem to the king" verses 21, 22. She went to the people in her wisdom: that is what they did in old time, apparently.
Rem. She was a wise woman, for the reason that she knew what was to be done. She promised the head; she discerned what was to be done, though she did not do it herself.
J.T. Quite so. Whilst Absalom's rebellion was general, this is more local. Sheba's rebellion is reduced to what is local. So that I think we have instruction here, as to how to deal with an evil person in any locality. The woman refrained from doing it by herself, she goes to all the people in her wisdom. However influential I may be, I cannot act alone in the assembly. In dealing with sin we must get all the saints exercised about it.
Rem. So that, if we are to consider for the Lord and the Lord's people, we have to go back in wisdom to first principles.
J.T. You must not leave out one in the meeting, because it is a question of bringing in every one, in your exercise. It is the assembly that does it. It has to be the united judgment and action of the assembly; it is not done by an individual.
Rem. I was wondering if the principles that governed this wise woman were acted on in Acts 15.
J.T. Well, I think so; at least the wisdom would be seen there. What comes out is the superiority of those who are dealing with it, to the controversy. Paul and Barnabas went "up to Jerusalem to the apostles and elders about this question" Acts 15:2 and on the way up ministered to the assemblies and caused
great joy, showing that they were above the controversy. And at Jerusalem they were received by the assembly. It is a question of the assembly first. And then the apostles and elders come together to consider the matter (verse 6). The enemy (verse 5) brought the matter up, and the apostles and elders came together to consider it. Peter stood up, pointing out how Gentiles were brought in through his ministry. Then Paul and Barnabas spoke of what God was doing among the Gentiles; what God was doing -- the positive thing. The Judaising teachers were not doing the work of God; it was Satan's work. James confirmed what Peter had said, after which they arrived at the decision. Then the whole assembly was carried in the decision. And so the great thing in dealing with evil is to carry all the saints with you, otherwise you will lose some of them. This woman went to them all in her wisdom, and they cut off the man's head -- they did it.
Ques. This woman was "a mother in Israel": a faithful one who cared for the people of God. Do you put her in contrast to the wise woman of Tekoah?
J.T. I think so; she had the wisdom of God. Proverbs sets them over against each other -- the wise and the foolish. It says, "The wisdom of women buildeth their house; but folly plucketh it down with her hands" Proverbs 14:1. That is what the woman of Tekoah was doing. You can understand that this "mother in Israel" yearned over the saints; she would grieve over the loss of one of them, so she made it a point to go to each one of them.
Isaiah 7:2 - 15,21; Isaiah 9:6
I have been encouraged to turn to Isaiah, and to these chapters, as indicating how the truth is developed in a remnant of God's people. And when I refer to a remnant I do not mean a part -- a fragment; it is not in this way that the idea is treated in Scripture. In principle, it embraces the whole, for it contains the substance. According to chapter 6 the 'trunk' -- a figure taken from the terebinth -- remains, although felled (verse 13). And thus in the remnant is said to be the "holy seed"; that which is of God in the nature of a seed for productiveness is there, the "holy seed" is said to be the trunk of it. And so chapter 7 takes up the thought and follows it through the immediately succeeding chapters. In chapter 9 there is the recognition of Christ as on their side: "Unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given"
What I wish to emphasise is the development of the truth as involving headship, and the patience of God. Some of us take little account of the patience of God in His dealings with us. We are moved at times by ministry, but we overlook what it has cost God to provide it. Whatever comes to us in the way of ministry, refreshment and edification, is from God. He is constantly taking account of our needs, not only the current needs, but coming ones. So that in view of the continuance of the testimony here, God is now preparing for it. In making this provision He selects His own vessels, and in due course His selection comes to light. We may quarrel with it; this is inevitable if the flesh works, but in result we shall see that God's selection is wise. And so, in dealing with the remnant here He approaches
those responsible, but He approaches them for their encouragement; "the house of David" is mentioned. True enough Ahaz was of the lineage of David, but I think there is more than that in the reference. God was still standing by that house. "It was told the house of David" that there was a confederacy against him, and he was moved as the trees of the forest are moved by the wind. It is well indeed to take account of evil; it is not wise to ignore it, especially a confederacy. A confederacy is the most potent of all opposition to God; organised opposition is the most serious. And so you find in the gospel of Matthew, which is calculated to meet this, in support of the testimony in the assembly, that the Lord deals with twos. Indeed, this number is employed on the side of evil as well as of good. The evil is met by the good on its own ground. Thus we have "two of you" -- two of the assembly -- as over against two demoniacs, two blind men, etc.
Here the prophet is indicating patience and that, dear brethren, is what I wish to emphasise -- the patience of God; how He will not pass over those responsible; He would treat them with the utmost kindness, giving them all due credit. Ahaz is of the house of David, and his heart is moved; he has no means of meeting the confederacy, which proves that he had not been accustomed to rely on the power of God; but God would assure him of His interest in him. How often it is that we are unable to cope with the confederacy through which the enemy would attack us! Therefore the word is, "Fear not" I want to show that the secret of that lay in Ahaz understanding the headship of these confederacies, for all must turn on this ultimately. "For the head of Syria is Damascus, and the head of Damascus is Rezin ... and the head of Ephraim is Samaria, and the head of Samaria is Remaliah's son" verses 8,9. What kind of heads were these? Attention is called
to the persons, and these must be compared with Christ, who is our Head. It is one Head, not two or more.
What you get in the epistle to the Corinthians is the development of wisdom. The way out, in every difficulty, is by wisdom. Now, Corinthians does not give you headship fully, it leads you up to it, I mean collectively. It teaches that Christ is made that unto us: "Who has been made to us wisdom from God, and righteousness, and holiness, and redemption"; 1 Corinthians 1:30 but that is objective, that is what He is. He is available to us as wisdom.
But then, as the man must lead, the apostle says, "Christ is the head of every man" 1 Corinthians 11:3. It is an individual matter: before I can arrive at what is collective I have got to know Christ as my own Head. Every brother, therefore, is responsible to come into the apprehension of Christ as his Head. In that fact he has got a certain superiority over his wife -- he is her head, for God would put things right in our households. If things are not right in our houses they will not be right in the assembly, and so Christ is Head to the man. It is man there in contrast to woman. He begins to discover the superiority of wisdom in the ruling of his house; his superiority must lie in wisdom, and Christ is become his Head for that. So that, whatever mistakes have been made, there is a way out, or rather I should say, a way back, for it is ever thus, and the retracing of steps is humiliating. It may be, indeed, that things have been done that cannot be undone, and the government of God goes on, but certainly where there has been deflection, wisdom leads us to retrace our steps. It is in the retracing of steps taken in folly that we show we are learning wisdom; it is humiliating, but wholesome.
And so Jehovah says to Isaiah, "Go out ... thou and thy son"; what the previous history of that
boy was Scripture does not say, but at this juncture he was such as Isaiah could take with him; he was available for divine use. "Go out now to meet Ahaz, thou and thy son Shear-jashub" -- I can see the prophet on his way; "at the end of the aqueduct of the upper pool, on the highway of the fuller's field" -- suggestive places! We are in the presence here of divine thoughts, beloved; a prophet of God with a message in his heart from God, on his way to meet the king in the places mentioned. A matter this of little importance to the mere passer-by, an ordinary matter indeed, a man with his son by his side, but an extraordinary matter to faith. I look at that boy, and I look abroad on the position of Judah; I think of the thoughts of God in connection with Jerusalem and the house of David -- what a picture! I think of Ahaz; what hope is there in him? I look at that boy; what is his name? Shear-jashub(see footnote). It is not here that there is a remnant, or that there shall be a remnant, but that a remnant shall return -- there must be the retracing of steps. Every step taken in folly has to be retraced. Every word spoken in folly has to be undone. Every bit of conduct done in folly has to be owned. A remnant shall return. Am I to be in it? Is there anyone here who has not learned something of retracing steps? Have we all moved out of false positions, false associations? Others are doing it; others will continue to do it. Am I doing it? Am I in the movement? And so I look at the boy, and his name speaks volumes: "A remnant shall return" What about that upper pool and the conduit to it? I am to come into the good of the water; and a 'fuller' means that there is to be whitening; compare Mark 9:3. These all have their voice as to what God is doing.
What does Ahaz think about all this? He has got a word from God, "Fear not" He is encouraged
of God not to fear. Think of the grace of God in dealing thus with a man like Ahaz! He says to him, "If ye believe not, surely ye shall not be established" verse 9. It must be on the principle of faith; God is appealing to us on that principle. We have part in the returning remnant by faith, and by faith we are established, as of it. God further says to Ahaz, "Ask for thee a sign from Jehovah thy God; ask for it in the deep, or in the height above" verse 11. A sign in the height above, beloved friends! I have no faith in calculations based on historical events; they are no signs, they are not reliable. Look up for the sign in the heights; that is where God begins to act. I look down into the depths, God moved there -- what a sign! Need I ask for more? I want to know something about the heavens, what God does there, and what He has done in the depths. Think of Christ in the heart of the earth! But Ahaz says, "I will not ask, and will not tempt Jehovah" What false piety! Many of us are hindered by false piety; it is the flesh, it is the very essence of unbelief. And so Jehovah says to him, "Will ye weary my God?" How much of it there is! By false piety God and the saints are wearied.
And now God says, "Therefore will the Lord himself give you a sign" Beloved brethren, one would wish to emphasise the wonderful grace of God in moving so infinitely above our poor unbelieving hearts. He says, "Therefore will the Lord himself give you a sign"; it is to be a Babe, for in truth we have to begin small in returning; hence the place children have in this section. "Behold, the virgin shall conceive and shall bring forth a son, and call his name Immanuel" That is the sign; left to Himself, that is the sign that God gives. Are we content with God's way? In bringing in a child, is it not to remind me that I am to begin there, if I am to advance into headship? I look at Damascus and
Rezin, and I look at Remaliah's son -- political heads; I might write a book about these heads, but what do I know about headship? What do historians know about headship? What do philosophers know about headship? They may pull it down. I might write an essay on Rezin and expose him to the world as a man wanting in political skill or in military prowess, and all the while be utterly devoid of wisdom. One sees books all around, exposing current leaders in this world; the Christian needs them not. The Christian knows what Samaria and Damascus and Rezin and Remaliah's son stand for; he needs not biographies or histories to instruct him that wisdom is not there. He knows that these heads are truly devoid of wisdom. As it says, "The world by wisdom has not known God" 1 Corinthians 1:21 and "That hidden [wisdom] ... which none of the princes of this age knew, (for had they known, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory;)" 1 Corinthians 2:7,8 They are wiped out as by a stroke whatever they may have been, politically or philosophically, all are consigned to oblivion as wanting in wisdom, the "hidden wisdom" The believer knows it, and the believer begins as a little child. I have got to learn everything; I have got to begin at the bottom. I know nothing, and can but know nothing spiritually unless I begin as a little child. This babe is to be named Immanuel (God with us). That is a great lesson for the Christian to learn; it is on the positive side -- "God with us" It is not yet we with Him, but He with us.
In keeping with what I have been saying, I turn to the verse lower down, "And it shall come to pass in that day, [that] a man shall nourish a young cow and two sheep, and it shall come to pass, from the abundance of milk they shall give, [that] he shall eat butter ... and honey" verses 21,22. He says in effect, I see that this wonderful Babe called Immanuel ate butter and honey, and I must have such food. It is
a question of food. There can be no development in the things of God -- and that specially applies to the young -- unless there is proper food; without this I shall never have a spiritual constitution. I begin to see this, and then I say, Where am I going to get the food? for outwardly we are in impoverished circumstances. It is a question of getting proper food; if there is not proper food in our meetings, how can the young get on? And so this man, in the light of the food Immanuel eats, sets about patiently to get it. He nourishes a young cow; he understands that milk comes thus, and butter comes from milk. It is through a process involving care and toil.
Dear brethren, we represent many meetings here. What about this painstaking, calculating way of bringing in such food for the saints that they may be built up in constitutions like Christ's? for that is the idea. Anything different must be rejected. For in heaven we shall all be like Him, constitutionally; otherwise, too, of course, but constitutionally we shall be like Him. It is one of the most important features for those who care for the saints, that the young should be built up constitutionally like Christ. The man nourishes "a young cow and two sheep" so that there is abundance of milk, and everyone partakes of butter and honey. The butter is brought about by a process; the book of Proverbs tells us about that: "For the pressing of milk bringeth forth butter" Proverbs 30:33. So that butter, the food of Immanuel, is available; very simple, but very nourishing.
Then we have the honey, which is also the result of great care. It is a mutual thing; butter represents individual exercise. For honey there must be mutual exercise and contribution from everyone in the company. The young produce as the old do. It is a question of production, and wisdom knows how to bring in the mutual element. So that the honey is
sweeter than the butter; the mutual products are sweeter. A spiritual address is pleasing, but what can be more delightful than the mutual production? Reciprocal affections, as the saints are together in the unity of the Spirit is what should be specially cultivated. "If then [there be] any comfort in Christ, if any consolation of love, if any fellowship of [the] Spirit, if any bowels and compassions, fulfil my joy, that ye may think the same thing, having the same love, joined in soul, thinking one thing" Philippians 2:1,2.
There is much in between the passages I read, too much to deal with now, but it enters into the history of the remnant. You get another child called Maher-shalal-hash-baz (meaning 'swift for spoil, hasty for prey' ), a very different child; his name refers to the Assyrian power (chapter 8), but as he reaches "to the neck" he encounters Immanuel. The land is His and the remnant understand this. They are conscious now of support; it is not a babe, it is the active presence of God amongst them; "God is with us" they say (verse 10); they are supported by Him in the presence of the Assyrian and of the confederacy among the mass of the people. God was hiding His face from the apostate nation, but the remnant would have the law and testimony among them: "Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples. And I will wait for Jehovah, who hideth his face from the house of Jacob; and I will look for him" Isaiah 8:16,17 And then, "Behold, I and the children that Jehovah hath given me" Isaiah 8:18 Look at that, beloved! being brought under Christ in the relationship of children.
And now they say, "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder; and his name is called Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty God, Father of Eternity, Prince of Peace" chapter 9:6. Their eyes have been opened to the greatness of the Person as thus known, "Unto
us a child is born" We come to see what He is on our side: "Unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder" Now we have the solution of everything; we have One who is capable of headship; Christ is Head over all things to the assembly. We discern the heads of this world, that they are devoid of wisdom; we are now in the full light of Christ as Head according to God. "The government shall be upon his shoulder; and his name is called Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty God, Father of Eternity, Prince of Peace" We have come to apprehend Christ in the greatness of His Person.
He is 'Counsellor'. We take counsel with Him. And He is 'Wonderful'. The things He does amongst us are truly wonderful! As I was saying yesterday, if we were called upon to give our experiences, what a record we could give! but we hold them as Paul did. He kept it secret for fourteen years that he had been in the third heaven. He did not tell everything out; he was greater inwardly than outwardly. This was in keeping with Christ as typified in the ark of the covenant; He was greater inwardly than He was in His external appearance. The unspiritual man makes a show of what he is and has, but the spiritual man is content that his greatness is hidden. He waits for the time of display; he knows that his life is hid with Christ in God, and he waits for the time "when the Christ is manifested who is our life" when we shall "be manifested with him in glory" Colossians 3:3,4. So that we are not here to tell our experiences; it is not the time for this; but they are nevertheless wonderful. It is said of the angel who visited Manoah and his wife that he "did wondrously" Judges 13:19.
'Wonderful' is His name, and this is understood by the remnant. He who is Wonderful has gone up into heaven, but is coming out presently, and we
shall have part with Him. And so, as I said, we are greater inwardly than outwardly. The Father works in the inner man; Ephesians 3:16. We read also, "But if indeed our outward man is consumed, yet the inward is renewed day by day" 2 Corinthians 4:16. I am not saying that there is not to be testimony, nor that the life of Jesus is not to be seen in us -- in our mortal body, but the inner is the greater: "What we shall be has not yet been manifested; we know that if it is manifested, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is" 1 John 3:2.
Then He is the "Mighty God" Jesus is known to us as the Mighty God! what can He not do? What contingency can He not deal with? And He is the "Father of Eternity" Let us worship in our hearts as we think of it -- "Father of Eternity" for that is how it reads. The Man with whom we are identified as rejected is the Father of Eternity. Marvellous expression! And He is "Prince of Peace" -- the Prince of it! Well, that is what is available; that is what the Lord is as known by His people in remnant times. We are thus prepared for Colossians. It is a question of learning wisdom in Christ; first in our houses and then in the assembly, and being governed by it. Colossians prepares us for the assembly; Christ is Head there of the body, the assembly; in Ephesians He is Head over all things to the assembly. The very greatest things are opened up to us at the present time, but it is a question of beginning small and being subject; learning folly, as in Ahaz, and repudiating it, and learning wisdom as in Christ, and walking in it. May God bless His word!
Pages 84 - 248 -- "Standing by the Cross of Jesus". Great Britain, 1928 (Volume 91).
John 12:31 - 33; John 19:25 - 27
I have it before me to speak to you about the cross. You will observe in chapter 19 it is said that certain ones stood by the cross of Jesus, and I read from chapter 12, having in mind to link on the verses read from that chapter with those in chapter 19. I might, indeed, refer to earlier passages in this gospel, where the cross is alluded to without naming it, as in chapter 3, for example, but I wish to speak of it as specially called attention to by the Lord in chapter 12 -- as the evangelist explains, "This he said, signifying by what death he was about to die" What death? The cross.
What I may remark is that this subject, extensive as it is in the epistles as well as in the gospels, bears particularly towards the western world. The apostle, as most of you will remember, introduces it very early in his first letter to the saints at Corinth. He speaks of "the word of the cross" -- mark the word of it! "The word of the cross" he says, "is to them that perish foolishness, but to us that are saved" 1 Corinthians 1:18 -- that is to say, a class of persons known as the saved -- "it is God's power" (chapter 1:18); and then later he alludes to it, that is, to Christ crucified, in regard to the saints viewed in another way -- "to those that [are] called, both Jews and Greeks" 1 Corinthians 1:24; to them it is the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
Now, as I said, its bearing is towards the west, speaking, of course, from the standpoint of the origin, geographically, of the testimony; not that
one would stress unduly the geographical thought, but we are bound, in dealing with the testimony of God to follow the Scriptures, and if we do, we must take account of it. The division of the race -- of the families of Noah -- was not accidental. God looked a long way ahead in His governmental orderings. Although He had concealed the church (for "it is the glory of God to conceal a thing" Proverbs 25:2), although He had kept it there hidden for the ages, He always had it in His own mind, and in His governmental orderings He never lost sight of it; so that we find before the testimony actually reached the west, as we speak of it, the Holy Spirit was peculiarly active in the way of limitation. We have to learn negatively as we have to learn positively. In Acts 16, therefore, the apostle Paul was forbidden to speak the word in Asia. The word was preached in that province later, but at this particular juncture he was forbidden to speak it there. And then again he had it in mind to go into Bithynia to preach and "the Spirit of Jesus did not allow them" Acts 16:7 Then, further, we are told that the Macedonian man was seen by him in a vision, saying, "Pass over into Macedonia and help us" Acts 16:9 Thus you see how geographical positions were in view, and so the apostle, concluding that the Lord would have him to go to Macedonia, came westward.
Now what I am saying involves more than may appear on the surface; it involves that, whilst the field is the world which the Lord has acquired a right to by redemption, having already had title to it creationally, and that whilst He commissioned His apostles to go "into all the world, and preach the glad tidings to all the creation" (Mark 16:15), yet He reserved His rights, as I may say, as the Prince of the princes of the Levites, so that no one -- not even a Paul -- was a free-lance; there is no such thought warranted in the Scriptures; the most gifted, the
most devoted, the most honoured of the servants of Christ is necessarily under His direction. Hence, as I said, the great apostle comes westward, and in all his epistles you will find those addressed are generally Jews and Greeks, and these are the ones to whom "the word of the cross" specially applies. I do not say that the word of the cross is not applicable to anyone in the world; it is, surely; but we have to do with Scripture, and therefore with those sections of the world, and with those races, in which evil is specially developed on the one hand, and, on the other, with those sections that God knew would yield most for the present specific purpose in view of which He is operating. Thus we find in Matthew that Jesus having been born, the magi come from the east. We have to view their movements in a prophetic way, as, I apprehend, what will come about under God in a coming day. The eastern nations, undoubtedly, are in His mind; every one of the sons of Noah is before Him, and in due course they will come and will recognise the king of the Jews: "Where is the King of the Jews that has been born? for we have seen his star in the east" they say, "and have come to do him homage" Matthew 2:2 We may be sure that however dark the horizon in the east is now, the star will again arise to illuminate it, and that that star is a guide to Jesus, the King of the Jews.
But what we find here in John's gospel is not that. What we find is Greeks coming up to see Jesus -- not as having been born merely, but as well known in His public ministry; and they say to Philip, "Sir, we desire to see Jesus" and the Lord says in answer to the desire expressed by them, "The hour is come" -- not that the King of the Jews should reign, but "that the Son of man should be glorified" They approach Philip who, the Holy Spirit tells us, was of Bethsaida -- a Galilean; and Philip tells Andrew, who was of the same city, and Andrew and Philip tell Jesus, their
minds filled doubtless with the importance of these personages from the west, famed as they were then and as they are today for their philosophy and education. The Lord makes no allusion to that; but He says, "The hour is come that the Son of man should be glorified" The Son of man is certainly not to be glorified in relation to their renown. Let no one think that anything that comes from them as such can add to the glory of Jesus; let no one assume that "words of wisdom" as Paul says (1 Corinthians 2:4), can add in any way to the glory of Jesus! What do these princes of literature care for Jesus? "None of the princes of this age knew" 1 Corinthians 2:8 the hidden wisdom; Paul says, "the world by wisdom has not known God" 1 Corinthians 1:21. It knew not God, whatever else it knew, and so they "crucified the Lord of glory" 1 Corinthians 2:8! Mark you, it is not simply the glory of the Lord that is in view; it is "the Lord of glory" that is to say, One who officially has the dispensing of glory.
Solomon is the great type of the Lord of glory. What you find in him is ability to speak of things. "He spoke three thousand proverbs; and his songs were a thousand and five. And he spoke of the trees, from the cedar-tree that is on Lebanon even to the hyssop that springs out of the wall; he spoke also of cattle, and of fowls, and of creeping things, and of fishes" 1 Kings 4:32,33. We have thus in Solomon one competent to speak of the whole realm of creation; he would bring out in his speaking the glories of it, and so he is a type, as I apprehend, of the Lord as the Lord of glory. Think of what the world lost in crucifying Him! They had cut themselves off from the source of all wisdom -- public and hidden; they had thus written themselves down as fools; indeed the wisdom of this world is foolishness; they have crucified the Lord of glory: "the world by wisdom has not known God" 1 Corinthians 1:21 I speak thus lest we may
be hankering after what the princes of this world can supply. The word of the cross alludes to them: "to the Jews an offence, and to nations foolishness, but to those that [are] called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ God's power, and God's wisdom" 1 Corinthians 1:23,24
I would address myself to the youngest here. Think of what it is to be 'called'! It is not here exactly the calling as we speak of it, what is eternal -- the calling on high, it alludes to the call that has come into your heart, as we get it in Leviticus; God called Moses out of the tabernacle. It is God, beloved young people, setting Himself in His own abode and calling you out of the world. Have you begun to move out of it? The call means that you cut your moorings and move out. It is to the called that Christ is the power of God and the wisdom of God, and if the call is answered to, you are in line to be introduced into the "hidden wisdom" It may not have occurred to you that there is such a thing as the "hidden wisdom" which God, as it says, prepared before the world for our glory, but God would give you a look, as it were, into that world -- as the Lord Himself uses the expression, "that world and the resurrection from among [the] dead" (Luke 20:35) -- a very different one from this -- one where we shall be, as He says, "equal to angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection" Luke 20:36 One look into that world will blind your eyes to this.
Well now, having said so much about the word of the cross and its bearing toward the west, inclusive of the Jews, I want to dwell on the attractiveness of Christ as presented in this passage, and one would again repeat, so that we may have it clearly in view for our consideration, that the fact that the Jews are in view as well as the Greeks does not weaken the thought that the west is in the mind of God. The word of the cross is to break up -- is to cut at the roots
of all western so-called learning, civilisation and renown. The Christian has to overcome these things, and it is a matter of no small importance that this comes out in this very gospel, which is intended for our own time. Three times over the Lord is alluded to as lifted up. Naturally we all wish to be lifted up, but in another way -- to be lifted up by worldly things; every unconverted man and woman is aiming at it -- to be lifted up to become conspicuous, to be, as they say, in the limelight in the presence of men. The Lord's own brethren said to Him, "If thou do these things" -- if you have things that distinguish you above others -- "manifest thyself to the world" John 7:4. He says, "My time is not yet come" John 7:6 The time, beloved brethren, for display is not yet, so that instead of being lifted up in that way, the Lord of glory was lifted up ignominiously, and so we read, "As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, thus must the Son of man be lifted up" (John 3:14); and again here, "And I, if I be lifted up out of the earth, will draw all to me. But this he said, signifying by what death he was about to die" How much are we prepared to be lifted up in that way -- to be "made a spectacle" as the apostle says, "to the world, both to angels, and men ... become as [the] offscouring of the world, [the] refuse of all" 1 Corinthians 4:9 - 13? How real it was to him! "I am crucified with Christ"; "Far be it from me to boast save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom [the] world is crucified to me, and I to the world" Galatians 2:20; Galatians 6:14.
Now what John would bring out is that the work of God is equal to any test that you could bring to bear upon it; that is a point that you will find emphasised throughout this gospel. And another thing is that every bit of the work of God, in whomsoever, is taken account of, whether it be in a Nicodemus or in a Joseph of Arimathaea. In these last days, beloved
brethren, we are to understand that every bit of the work of God, in whomsoever or wheresoever, is to be taken account of; it is like the precious gold, whatever the surroundings, you can look at it by itself; we are to look at it, as it were, abstractly; we are to take account of it by itself; it is the work of God and it will shine by-and-by, whatever its surroundings are now. And then, as I said, another feature is that, viewed abstractly, it will stand any test you may bring to bear upon it. And that is how this passage is set. The Lord says, "And I, if I be lifted up out of the earth, will draw all to me"; that is to say, in spite of the ignominy, in spite of the disgrace, in spite of the fact that two malefactors were hanged by His side, in spite of the spitting and the shame, the work of God will show itself, it will draw toward Christ. And so it is, beloved young people; if you are true to yourself, you will find that the work of God in you will draw toward Christ. "I myself with the mind" says the apostle, "serve God's law" (Romans 7:25) -- not that I ought, but I do it; "He that has been begotten of God keepeth himself, and the wicked [one] does not touch him" (1 John 5:18); "and he cannot sin, because he has been begotten of God" 1 John 3:9. It is important to learn how to take account of things abstractly in that way, to see them as they really are. There is that in me that abhors the cross, there is that in every one of us that abhors the cross; it is a scandal to us, but if I recognise the work of God in me, it does not abhor the cross, it glories in it. I am to identify myself with that, regarding it as myself. And so the Lord says, "I will draw all to me" It is, as I may say, the test as to whether I am born of God. If I judge myself in the light of God, I shall not abhor the cross, I shall boast in it.
Now I want to show in chapter 19 how certain ones stood by it, "And by the cross of Jesus stood" etc.
John is the only one who presents this feature. Just contemplate for a moment what this scene was. What terrific opposition! All the forces of evil were concentrated there, directed against that blessed Man as He hung there on that cross. Evil from every direction pressed in there, shame and spitting were common, taunts were common, and yet the Holy Spirit is able to say, "And by the cross of Jesus stood his mother, and the sister of his mother ... and Mary of Magdala" What a trio! They are not here seen as standing "afar off" as elsewhere, they are standing by the cross of Jesus! How delightful to heaven, and how delightful to the heart of Jesus! And there was another there whom Jesus loved standing by. Note that word. How is it with us? How is it personally, how domestically, how is it in our business arrangements, how in our public comportment, how is it in regard of the word of the cross and the cross of Jesus? These beloved women were standing by, and the one whom Jesus loved was standing by.
Then you see how the Lord honours those who stand by. It says, "Jesus therefore, seeing his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, says to his mother, Woman, behold thy son" Was He not positionally equal to that honour? He was, for he was standing there; they were both standing there. And so the Lord says to the one whom he loved, "Behold thy mother" The Lord confides in the one who stands by. Is it here for nothing? Is it a mere historical reference? Not at all. It is to encourage us now as standing by, so that the Lord might confide in us, and in confiding in us might commit to us what is most precious. Could anything be more desirable than to have such a charge committed to us by Christ as hanging on the cross? "From that hour the disciple took her to his own home" Would he ever forget those words from the dying Saviour? Would Mary ever forget them?
Never! They would be bound together spiritually as no other two could be, and all because they were both standing "by the cross of Jesus" It is a most blessed thing to be confided in by the Lord. I know of nothing to be coveted more, than that He should confide in one.
You find at the end of the gospels examples of the Lord's confidingness. I refer, for a moment, to Matthew; you will remember how the Lord sent a message to His brethren by a sister, and I would remark, if you will allow me, that certain current references amongst us to sisters tend to divert them from their real calling and service. The Lord would, as it were, elevate them in their own minds as regards His service. We often say, 'Even a sister could do that'; but what is verified at the endings of the gospels is that the sisters are marked off as confided in, and so in this case the Lord sends a message to His disciples saying, "Go bring word to my brethren that they go into Galilee, and there shall they see me" Matthew 28:10. It was His message -- a message of immense importance; so much so that the enemy moves at once to counteract it: "And as they went, behold, some of the watch went into the city, and brought word to the chief priests of all that had taken place ... they gave a large sum of money to the soldiers, saying, Say that his disciples coming by night stole him [while] we [were] sleeping ... and this report is current among the Jews ... until this day" Matthew 28:11 - 15 They tell a lie. As light radiates in these devoted women, Satan's effort is to counteract it. You may be sure that every movement of this kind the enemy will seek to counteract by a lie. I mention this because of the solemnity of the currency of a lie. If a lie becomes current, it is apt to be crystallised and regarded as traditional, and traditional truth, so-called, is often a traditional lie. And so the lie continued, as Matthew says: "current among the Jews until this day" Matthew 28:15.
And then in this gospel, need I comment on the wonderful message which was sent to the disciples, again by a woman? What is so touching about it is that she assumed not to be directly sent to the disciples. It says she "comes bringing word to the disciples that she had seen the Lord, and [that] he had said these things to her" John 20:18 She delivers her message in a most comely way; she had the light before the others. And then here, as I said, there is the principle of confidingness on the part of the Lord in those who were standing by the cross. Is it not an incentive to draw near to the cross, not only to hear the word of it, but to boast in it? As we do this, we may be assured that we shall prove that the Lord confides in us. So John is entrusted with the Lord's mother.
Then another thing with regard to John is that it says, "But one of the soldiers pierced his side with a spear, and immediately there came out blood and water. And he who saw it bears witness, and his witness is true, and he knows that he says true, that ye also may believe" John 19:34,35 He was a witness of the blood and the water that flowed from the riven side of Christ. He was such an one as could speak of it, as having seen it. Now that is another great matter. There are two ideas in the thought of witness, one is that I am competent, as having seen the thing, and the other is that I am called upon to bear testimony, or witness. And so, beloved brethren, as standing by the cross, we shall be witnesses of much; we shall not present things merely as having heard, we shall be able to say, "I know" We were speaking lately about the public assembly -- that the first speakings in it were marked by certainty. The assembly of God should indeed be marked in that way -- not only by order, but by the things that are said: they "found the eleven, and those with them, gathered together, saying, The Lord is indeed risen"; Luke 24:33,34 there was certainty as in it.
The others were also speaking with certainty, saying that He was made known unto them in the breaking of bread. I refer to that in connection with this chapter (John 19) -- that there is certainty in the one who stands by the cross; he says, "and he knows that he says true"; John 19:35 he was a competent witness. And so it is that as standing by the cross in these last days we shall have communications, we shall see things, we shall become aware of their certainty, so that we can speak as the oracles of God. "If any one speak -- as oracles of God" 1 Peter 4:11. And so John could speak with authority; as he says in his epistle, "We know that the Son of God has come" 1 John 5:20 But it all arises, as I said, from being near the cross, the cross of Jesus.
Exodus 25:8,9; Leviticus 1:1,2
J.T. I thought we might look briefly at the tabernacle as presented in Exodus and Leviticus this morning, and in Numbers this afternoon, so that we may see something of the largeness and elevation morally of that in which God dwells, and how it is inclusive of the universe; and then that as dwelling in it, He calls out of it. In Leviticus, it is not only that He spoke out of it, but He calls -- the latter thought underlies the assembly. He forms those who are called, not only out of the world, but in relation to that in which God is. Not only did the people need to be delivered out of Egypt, but they needed to be delivered out of the smallness of human thoughts, however extended -- deliverance out of mere national or local feeling, into the greatness of the realm in which God has placed Himself and in which He lives. It is only as we hold ourselves locally in relation to the whole divine system that we see things aright. So it occurred to me the Lord might help us in the consideration of the subject, in a brief way, great as it is; that, delivering us out of the world, He would also deliver us out of the smallness of our own thoughts. Thus we are on a higher plane in chapter 25 of Exodus than we are earlier. Moses, Aaron, Nadab and Abihu, and the elders of Israel were taken up, and they saw the God of Israel and what was under His feet. Thus we get an elevated view, and then that in which God would dwell and is to be known. Whatever may be the responsibilities locally, our thoughts are never to be less than that which is presented in relation to God.
Rem. That would lead to enlargement of thought on assembly lines.
J.T. That is what I had in mind; divine thoughts all centre round Christ and the assembly -- not the assembly presented locally, but in its universal bearing.
Rem. Your thought is that the more we take in the universal bearing, the more we shall be governed in our local setting.
J.T. Place the universal thing first. We have to consider for all in any local exercise.
Ques. Would Colossians bear on it -- to be filled with the knowledge of His will, in all wisdom and spiritual understanding?
J.T. Yes; the full knowledge of His will; and so Ephesians emphasises the will -- the good pleasure of His will, the mystery of His will, and the counsel of His will; the will of God is stamped on all. And then follows that which is, as it were, fixed in the way of unity. In Ephesians 4 the apostle, a prisoner of the Lord -- or in the Lord, as it is -- enjoins that the saints with all lowliness, and meekness, and long-suffering, should bear with one another in love, endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit. "[There is] one body and one Spirit, as ye have been also called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all, and through all, and in us all"; Ephesians 4:4 that is to say, there is a universal system of things marked by unity. The unity of the Spirit pervading it has to be kept in all lowliness and meekness, forbearing one another in love. It is thus that these general epistles teach us to move on in the testimony in practical unity in relation to the whole.
Ques. Have you any thought as to Moses getting the pattern on the mount?
J.T. It is to suggest moral elevation. You get an extended view; not only have you specifications, but you have what is seen on the mount. The disciples on the mount of Transfiguration were taken
up to see; they had heard much, and seen much, below, but there was that which was to be seen on high.
Naturally our thoughts are very near the earth, and always tending to be local. Undue local feeling is selfish feeling, whereas the extended view from the elevation enables us to see with God, and that in which He dwells.
H.H. It is in the local position that we are tested as to how far we are working these things out with our brethren.
J.T. Quite. That comes out in Numbers, where there is not only speaking out of the tabernacle, but speaking in the wilderness, where we are set up tribally and family-wise in relation to all this, each having his own appointed place in connection with his family and his tribe. But Exodus is the extended view, so that we may see where God is, that in which He is, and that in which He displays Himself.
C.C.E. Your horizon is rather limited on the plain, and therefore the mountain gives the idea of an extended horizon.
A.H. The tabernacle was said to be a representation of things in the heavens. Would that correspond with the mountain?
J.T. Quite. It is not only that it is that, but it is seen on the mount, it is seen from the elevated position. First, the God of Israel is seen, and what is under His feet, and they ate and drank there. God would impress us not only with what He can be to us in delivering us and instructing us severally, but with what He can be to us on high, how He would make us feel at home there. But then afterwards Moses and his attendant Joshua go up alone in order that Moses should get a view of that in which God would be displayed, and in which He would dwell.
A.S.L. Did Moses see on high the entire system as in the thought of God and then come down and put up a miniature of it in the wilderness? It is a remarkable expression; it says, "the figurative representations of the things in the heavens" Hebrews 9:23 I thought that would convey that he saw the whole thing in all the extent of it with God, and then was instructed to go down and make according to the pattern thereof.
J.T. That seems to be it. No one but Moses could set up the thing; for he saw it. We have only the specifications. After it was set up, of course the others saw it. Patterns or models of it now can at best only be founded on specifications.
A.S.L. And they are only patterns or figures of the things in the heavens; Moses saw the thing in all its extent.
J.T. He not only got the specifications, but he saw the pattern, its oneness -- it is in the singular.
A.S.L. So in Hebrews the heavenly things themselves must be purified by better sacrifices. He saw what represented the heavenly things themselves.
C.C.E. Do you think he saw the divine idea embodied in one whole?
J.T. I thought so; the divine idea presented as one whole.
Ques. Does Ephesians give the elevated view?
J.T. Yes; only there it is more a domain. The tabernacle is a structure. The tabernacle is really more the end of chapter 2.
H.H. Do you think of the holy mount in regard to the elevated position?
J.T. It is a great feature of the gospels. Luke says there were those who were "eye-witnesses of and attendants on the Word" Luke 1:2 That is a question of what is spoken, but the mount of Transfiguration refers to what was seen. "There are some of those standing here who shall not taste death until
they shall have seen the kingdom of God" Luke 9:27 or, as in another gospel, "the kingdom of God come in power" Mark 9:1 Whatever view it may be, it was what they saw, and that was intended to impress them. Those three disciples, therefore -- Peter, James and John -- had a unique place, as Moses had. There would be not only what they heard, but what they saw.
H.H. It is an abiding system, would you say, and we need to be elevated in our hearts and minds in order to take it in?
J.T. I thought that; and we need to have the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the full knowledge of God to take the thing in, otherwise, although holding together by a sort of mutual agreement, we shall be simply so many churches and so many parishes in practical independency.
Ques. Does the universal idea govern the local?
J.T. The universal is the thing presented. Exodus, therefore, is on a higher plane. We are dealing with something seen on the mount, of which the pattern is presented, and then specifications are given. One man, at least, with Joshua, had the thing as seeing it, and that would necessarily govern him in all his ministry. Whatever anyone might say to Moses about the specifications of the tabernacle, he would always revert inwardly to what he saw; and in all that he had to say to the people he would convey to them that there was something that he saw, that is to say, there is something more than can be conveyed in words. Christianity is not in word only.
Ques. It is seeing, is it not?
J.T. Yes. There is the impression made on the mind by what is seen. Entering the holiest we apprehend God as in Christ, and Christ as He is before God.
Ques. Does the apostle emphasise that in Corinthians "Last of all ... he appeared to me also"? 1 Corinthians 15:8
J.T. Quite. There you come to a very important thing, because the Lord is presented there as risen and seen by those who were prominent in the testimony -- a very different thing from seeing Him here in the flesh. He was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve, after that seen of five hundred brethren, then of James, then of all the apostles, and last of all seen of Paul. The Lord intended that there should be something known in those in the way of impression by what they saw -- something that would give colour and character to their ministry.
Ques. Have we not often to change our attitude in order to see? It says in Revelation 1:12, "And having turned, I saw".
J.T. That refers to change of dispensation, I think; John had been occupied with what was in keeping with the present dispensation; he was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, we read.
Rem. In the first epistle of John it says, "We have seen with our eyes; that which we contemplated" 1 John 1:1.
J.T. That bears on what we are saying. There was what was seen as well as what was heard, so he couples the two, "That which we have seen and heard we report to you, that ye also may have fellowship with us" 1 John 1:3 It shows how Christianity is infinitely above the mind of man, for however much acquainted man may be with doctrine he could never have the impression of what was seen.
Ques. Does the extended view begin with the contemplation of the Person?
J.T. Well, I think so. "We have contemplated his glory" John 1:14 it says in John's gospel. There is no doubt there is something akin to the elevation in the mount of Transfiguration for all of us. If we are attentive to the Lord, He would give us the extended view. No ministry can give it to us, but ministry conveys some impression that sets you in movement towards it.
C.C.E. Do you think ministry conveys the impression of one who has seen?
J.T. I think that is so. You are impressed by the fact that there is someone who has got something you have not, though you may follow all he says; but you would like to get it.
Ques. Would Ephesians 1 fit in here: "being enlightened in the eyes of your heart"?
J.T. Yes; "so that ye should know" Ephesians 1:18 It is all to one end. And then the second prayer (chapter 3) comes in, that ye might be strengthened by the power of God in the inner man. God works in the inner. There may be much in the outer -- clearness of doctrine -- but it is the inner man finally that tells.
A.S.L. Would seeing in this sense consist in the conscious knowledge of things? The sense that a brother has something you have not got would mean that he has got the thing in his soul.
J.T. Yes; so John's epistle is to bring that about. "These things have I written to you that ye may know that ye have eternal life"; 1 John 5:13 that is conscious knowledge.
Ques. Whom would Moses represent as having this extended view?
J.T. I think he represents authoritative ministry in that particular view; ministry first comes to us in an authoritative way. You are impressed that there is something there beyond mere words.
A.S.L. "I will come ..." Paul says, "and I will know, not the word of those that are puffed up, but the power. For the kingdom of God [is] not in word, but in power" 1 Corinthians 4:19,20. That is it, is it not?
Rem. The Lord Himself spoke with authority and not as the scribes.
J.T. That is right. In each case He spoke of what He knew. "We speak that which we know, and we bear witness of that which we have seen" John 3:11.
Ques. Would it be Christ as the apostle?
Ques. Do you suggest that it is open to us to go up to the mountain characteristically?
J.T. I think so in a way, but of course the apostles had a special place. "That which we have seen and heard we report to you, that ye also may have fellowship with us; and our fellowship is indeed with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ" 1 John 1:3. That, I think, indicates the peculiar place the apostles had as seeing things. Christianity has come in, therefore, in an authoritative way in vessels who had not only heard but had seen. Hebrews says, "and has been confirmed to us by those who have heard" Hebrews 2:3 But there is more than that. Hebrews does not emphasise apostolic authority in the apostles, because Christ Himself is there as the Apostle, but in the apostolic epistles we have authority in persons who both heard and saw.
F.W. Would it have reference to the foundation work -- what was initially conveyed to the church?
J.T. Christianity was brought in in that way.
F.W. There seems to be a distinction between Moses at the end of chapter 24 and the verses we started with today: "And they shall make me" Do we come in more distinctly there?
J.T. The people are brought into it when it says, "And they shall make me a sanctuary" but all the responsibility as to the pattern was on Moses.
Ques. So we go back to the apostle Paul for the pattern?
J.T. Yes. In 1 Corinthians 3:10 Paul says, "as a wise architect, I have laid the foundation, but another builds upon it. But let each see how he builds upon it"
Rem. So the apostle's ministry takes us there.
J.T. In Ephesians the foundation is of the apostles and prophets, but in Corinthians Paul speaks of something he had laid.
F.W. Is there not a moral thought for us that we should appreciate what God in His sovereignty has given us in the way of light now, even as in the early days they were governed by the apostles, and as the Israelites were governed by the light Moses had?
J.T. It is a question now as to what the Spirit says to the churches. That may be very little or it may be much. Certain conditions necessarily interfere with or modify what the Spirit says -- the state of the instrument, for instance; but whatever the Spirit is saying is to be attended to. The bearing of what He says will always be in regard to the foundations, in regard to what there was at the beginning. There may be much that is corrective in it, and no doubt ministry now is in the main corrective, for the state of things is so weak that there is not much scope for opening up the mind of God -- the things of God -- but nevertheless if the Spirit is speaking, He is to be heard; what the Spirit says is the point to pay attention to.
A.H. Do you think the Spirit comes in with Bezaleel? It says he was filled with the Spirit, and he shows the people what to do.
J.T. That is good. He represents that which is employed universally in the structure, and everyone is brought into that.
Ques. In the verses read it is not only the seeing, but the being shown; it says, "I will shew thee" Does that involve God's sovereignty?
J.T. Yes, quite; it was the showing of the thing then because it was still future, but all has come out now, and there is nothing to be added; it is the filling in; the foundation is laid. In Zechariah 4 the thought is that the one who lays the foundation finishes the building; according to the ministry of
the Spirit in a day of small things, in the days of Zechariah and Haggai the beginning and end are brought together. It is all a question of what Christ is doing, but each one may have his part in it.
Ques. How would you say the injunction to build a tabernacle would come to us; is it passed on to ourselves?
J.T. In the way of providing material, I think. What has been called attention to is, "they shall make me a sanctuary" and that brings us all into it.
Ques. Is that the Spirit's work?
J.T. It is the Spirit's work through each of us; hence the importance of being enlightened to see the divine scheme, so that we are working with God, not working merely locally, that what we are doing locally has a bearing on the whole. It is said of Jonathan that he wrought with God; 1 Samuel 14:45.
Ques. Does not God in this way secure His own glory?
J.T. Yes; He brings us all into it, and hence the importance of getting the thought of God -- seeing what His mind is in the way of pattern, and specification. Exodus makes a great point not only of what was shown to Moses, but also of what was actually made; "and he made" "and he made"; every item is given in review, not only as shown, but as made. Things are to be constructed and finished.
Ques. Would gold, silver and precious stones be the Spirit's work in contrast to wood, hay and stubble?
J.T. Yes; that which stands the fire.
Ques. Do you suggest that every saint should be engaged in this work?
J.T. Certainly; "They shall make me a sanctuary"; the word 'sanctuary' mentioned before dwelling reminding us that we are to be holily
engaged; we are not to bring our natural minds into it. The holiness of the sanctuary is one of the great features to be emphasised.
Rem. So that we provide conditions for the divine presence: "that I may dwell among them"
J.T. That is right -- holiness. Peter says, "Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy ... pass your time of sojourn in fear" 1 Peter 1:16,17 Our natural minds are not to be brought into the thing. "The stranger that cometh near shall be put to death" Numbers 1:51 refers to the natural mind.
Rem. We are each given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ; Ephesians 4:7.
J.T. The supply is all given, and given bountifully.
Rem. Right construction and right building must be the outcome of right seeing. How do we come into the seeing?
J.T. It is by the acquirement of the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of Him. The Lord opens the understanding. "Think of what I say" Paul says, "for the Lord will give thee understanding in all things" 2 Timothy 2:7. That means the whole thing -- nothing left out; there is nothing you may not get understanding about; hence the great importance of turning to the Lord in matters. He will never leave us in the fog or puzzled. Every part of the divine system will be opened up to us to understand; He will give us understanding in all things.
Rem. We have to consider the light that Paul brought in.
J.T. Paul is the architect; he is the only one that uses that word: "As a wise architect, I have laid the foundation" he says (1 Corinthians 3:10); that would be in relation to the whole structure; for the architect does not simply have the foundation in mind, he has in view the entire building. Timothy fully followed it up, so that the apostle could entrust him with it. "The things thou hast heard of me in
the presence of many witnesses, these entrust to faithful men" 2 Timothy 2:2. I suppose Paul would not have passed over the elder brethren at that time if they had been available, but he took up a young man because evidently Timothy had followed the thing up and was trustworthy; he was an available vessel. There was not only light with Timothy, but affection; he cared "with genuine feeling" how the saints got on. And then, he also paid strict attention to what Paul said. If you have what Paul said and love in your heart for all the saints, you are fit to be a builder.
Ques. Do we see in Luke 24 how the Lord works in bringing the two back to the centre? Is that an illustration of how He works now with us?
J.T. Yes; that is true. The Lord brings them back to the centre, and then shows Himself to them, and opens their understanding that they might understand the Scriptures. The understanding of the Scriptures, according to the Lord's subdivision of them there, is of great importance to the builder.
H.H. Paul knew all about the heavenly system, did he not -- he had been in the third heaven?
J.T. His ministry for fourteen years had all been influenced, no doubt, by that view, although he had said nothing about it, and he would not have told them, but that necessity called for it; but no one who heard him could fail to be impressed, I am sure, with the sense that there was a man who had seen something. He had kept it a secret for these fourteen years, but the fact that he had not told anyone does not mean that it had not impressed them. Then we see the way the Lord takes to keep us, as having such light -- His disciplinary measures. The apostle having received the impression, and seen the things, when he came back to earth there was given to him a thorn in the flesh to buffet him that he might not be exalted above measure; as he got the impression, so
he got the thorn in the flesh; the thorn was a ballast to his ministry; it was in that way balanced, so that he was not exalted above measure. It seems to me that the Lord's disciplinary measures balance us, so that we might be here, forbearing one another in love, endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit. That is what God has before Him. If we have the light He would balance us.
H.H. So that suffering would come in in some way to make us correspond to the light.
J.T. Yes; some limiting thing, so that the saints really get the thing with God. We may discredit the light unless we are lowly in the dissemination of it.
C.C.E. Paul could only correct such a state as that at Corinth as having been where he had been.
J.T. I think that. He said, I cannot go there, I can only write to them, and of course my letter cannot convey what I could convey personally, but I shall send Timotheus, for he is my child in the faith; he is like me, so that they would have in their midst, accompanied by the letter, a reflection of Paul: "who shall put you in mind of my ways [as] they [are] in Christ" 1 Corinthians 4:17 That is the thing that confirms the truth.
Rem. Timothy was a product of his ministry.
Ques. Would what you say of the apostle Paul equally apply to the apostle John? He was shown the things, and he was to testify what he saw -- the book of Revelation being the outcome of the things that he saw.
J.T. There in Revelation you have a seer. The thought of the seer is one who sees. In apostolic ministry it is not only seeing, there is also the hearing. There are things heard as well as seen, both eyes and ears are brought into play in the apostles.
Ques. Would you give us a word about the materials?
J.T. I did not intend to speak of that, but the gold, silver, and brass, and all the different materials are most instructive; and each has its own meaning. The order is: gold, silver, copper, blue, purple, scarlet, fine linen, goat's hair, rams' skins dyed red, badgers' skins, acacia wood, oil for the light, and spices for the anointing and for the incense of fragrant drugs, onyx stones and stones to be set for the ephod and for the breastplate. Each item has its own meaning as pointing to the richness, the variegated richness of the dwelling -- all coming through and working out in the affections of the saints. God is so delighted with man brought into relationship with Him, that He would secure all the materials of the system in which He is to dwell through their intelligence and affections. It is very wonderful! God could bring about all these things Himself, but He does it through the saints.
F.W. They were apparently all found with the people; they did not come from heaven.
J.T. Not exactly, but they refer to the work of God in the saints.
F.I. Was the material given intelligently as the result of the elders being ennobled when they saw the God of Israel?
J.T. Yes; but I think it dates back to Egypt. God includes in the material every bit of His work, for He begins to work in us from the very outset; our repentance and our conversion are the fruit of His work, and that brings joy in heaven. Every bit of the work of God in us from Egypt onwards is taken up.
Ques. Would it be a similar thought to Luke 8, where certain women "ministered to him of their substance"? Luke 8:3
J.T. Yes; that is in Luke 8, but in chapter 7 you have a woman who is a sinner who is a child of
wisdom; and "wisdom is justified of all her children" Luke 7:35 the Lord says, and then brings her in and sets her forth as a model -- "Seest thou this woman?" Luke 7:44 He says. There is something to look at -- small, but a model of love; she is a child of wisdom, and the Lord filled her treasures. The Lord fills the treasures of all the children of wisdom; they are rich people, so that in the next chapter they minister to Him of their substance. I think that shows that what God surrounds Himself with is the fruit of His own work in His people. He loves man in the abstract, and now that Christ has come in He loves them in the concrete. Man is there in Him; there is One in whom He has found His delight, and He is bringing in an order of man in whom He finds delight, hence the value that He attaches to His own work coming out man-wise, as it were, in our intelligence and affections. He surrounds Himself with that. God dwells as to His own infinite essence in light unapproachable, and we cannot say anything as to that, but we know something about what has come out, and what He has brought about by His work as it comes out in us. We know about that and that is what the scripture is dealing with. Beyond that we do not know; there are things that we know nothing about, but we do know these things. The Holy Spirit is given to us, as John says, that ye might "know all things" 1 John 2:20.
Ques. Do you see the heave-offering in that woman in Luke 7?
J.T. Yes; she loved much; that is a good deal to say. The Lord loves to have someone in every locality to whom He can direct attention in that way -- "Seest thou this woman?" Luke 7:44 He says. It is as much as to say, There is my thought.
Ques. Why does the gold come in first?
J.T. God is emphasising that things must be of
Him; although they come through the hearts of the saints, yet they are of God. The whole scene inwardly is marked by what is of God; it is all of Him.
Ques. Would you connect the gold with the delight that is found in Christ?
J.T. Yes; it was in Him it came out; God has visited His people; Luke 7:16. John says, "Ye are of God, children" 1 John 4:4 The silver is the next thing -- redemption; there can be nothing effected save by redemption. Copper would signify that everything is according to divine judgment; God has not left it to man; everything is according to His own judgment. All these things have their own meaning. Blue means that heaven takes the pre-eminence; heaven comes first with God.
Ques. What difference do you make between purple and scarlet?
J.T. Purple is related to suffering; the whole thing is marked by suffering. It is a combination of the heavenly and the earthly colours -- blue and scarlet. Then the earthly comes after that; scarlet is earthly glory. I suppose purple is a type of suffering and imperial glory; it is not only royal, but imperial. The Lord is King of kings; 1 Timothy 6:15.
F.W. You made a remark that the sanctuary came before the tabernacle. "They shall make me a sanctuary that I may dwell among them" What had you in mind as to that?
J.T. The idea of holiness. The word for 'tabernacle' is 'dwelling'. The dominant word in the whole section is that God would dwell, but He notifies that they were to make Him a sanctuary. The apostle has that before him in Corinthians -- the temple of God is holy.
F.W. "Holiness becometh thy house" (Psalm 93:5); not only righteousness, but holiness.
J.T. That is the way it stands.
Ques. Is your thought that the builder would have to bring material?
J.T. Yes; you are concerned about supplying material; and every one of these items should appear in every saint -- every one of them. Then it goes on to the fine twined linen. This is not merely linen, but byssus, Egyptian cotton, the point being, I believe, the fineness of the yarn or texture. Things are to be very fine. The textile used was to be very fine, indicating delicacy of sensibility and feeling. There is nothing coarse, or rough, or uncouth in the house of God. There is to be delicacy of feeling. It was seen in perfection in the Lord -- the fineness of His feelings and thoughts and affections. Then it goes on to the goat's hair, which is the very opposite to that. When you have to do with sin it is not a question of fineness or delicacy of feeling, but of denunciation; there is to be no compromise with what is evil, but rigid separation, not minding whether you hurt people's feelings or otherwise. Thus within it should be all delicacy and consideration and courtesy to each other -- to brethren, and indeed to men too, but when it comes to sin or a question of unrighteousness there is to be nothing but the strongest denunciation of it, however much people's feelings may be hurt.
Ques. Is that the prophetic side of things?
J.T. It is much like that. John's clothing was camel's hair. The goat represents a separate type of man; he goes by himself, and is a man who is known of God. We have been referring to these details as regards material, but the general thought before us is the sanctuary and the dwelling. The book is most elaborate in the way it works out the completion of the thing, not only the completion of it in detail, but the setting up of the whole. Nothing is left to Moses' imagination or ingenuity; all is of God.
A.S.L. "See that thou make [them] according to their pattern which hath been shewn to thee in the mountain" Exodus 25:40 -- this is repeated frequently.
J.T. They were the things to be used in the service, especially what was in the holy place. Then God owns the work by coming in Himself to dwell, and then Leviticus is, He calls out of that. It is not simply that He speaks, but He calls, and that is what indicates the assembly. The call was out of the tabernacle.
Ques. Do you mean that the call was out of Egypt to the tabernacle in the wilderness?
J.T. The tabernacle was set up in the wilderness, and the call is out of it. I think the call may be seen in Romans and Corinthians.
J.T. It is rather God making Himself heard to those who are at a distance. In Corinthians we are said to be "called saints"; so that we do not come by choice. It is a question of God's call. It is a great thing to see that God calls; He calls out of this wonderful system.
A.J.G. Does Paul bring that to bear upon the Corinthians when he says, "Consider your calling" 1 Corinthians 1:26?
J.T. Yes. There is what they were called from; they were called from among the poor, from among the little-esteemed, the despised in this world, but they were saints by God's calling.
Rem. We are said to be called to the fellowship of God's Son.
Ques. In reference to our calling, is it to show us the greatness of our conversion?
J.T. It is not that so much; the point is where God is when He is calling, and what He is calling us to.
Rem. We are called to that system.
Numbers 1:1 - 3,16 - 19; Numbers 10:33 - 36
J.T. It is evident that, as in Exodus, we have the dwelling, that in which God is with us -- dwells with us, so Leviticus gives us how we are to be with Him, hence the call out of the tabernacle, or tent of meeting, as it should read; then how those who answer to the call are to be with God -- the terms on which we are to be with Him.
Then Numbers is the public position, how we are to be for God and in connection with the latter the love shown in the divine way of being with us in all the vicissitudes of the wilderness journey -- the love, patience and grace that shine in the divine manner in the wilderness, so that the book is really, as we might say, in the wilderness. I believe the original title, at least a certain title given to the book, was simply, "In the wilderness" The book opens with God speaking in the wilderness, He speaks out of a tent, but it was in the wilderness. And so the numbering is said to be in the wilderness of Sinai, and the first movement is from one wilderness to another; chapter 10:12. Thus we are with God, or rather God is with us in circumstances in which there is nothing for the flesh; and in connection with this, we have military units and orderings involving local responsibility; so that while the love of God is put to the test, and answers to it perfectly in these circumstances, our love is also tested, for the wilderness brings out where we are, and what we are.
Ques. Is Leviticus the terms on which we are to be with God, so as to be for Him according to the book of Numbers?
J.T. Well, that is right. The second verse (Leviticus 1) begins the subject of the terms: "When any man of you presenteth an offering to Jehovah, ye shall present your offering of the cattle, of the herd, and of the flock" Leviticus 1:2 That leads on to what may be regarded as the divine requirements, the terms upon which we, from our side, are to be with Him, to approach Him. The requirements, while they take account of, and make provision for the majesty of God, also make provision for the minutest work of God in His people; the youngest and weakest is provided for as well as those who are most advanced. But one's thought was to dwell, not on the terms, but rather on the fact that God called out of the tabernacle; and then in Numbers to point out how the love of God comes in, typically, in the way in which He accepts the circumstances of His people, accommodating Himself, as it were, to them; so that He told David, who was minded to build Him an house, that He had not dwelt in a house since the day that He brought up Israel out of Egypt, "even to this day" but had walked in a tent, and in a tabernacle; 2 Samuel 7:6. He had never had, as we may say, such accommodation as David had in mind to provide for Him; but He points out to David that He had accepted what there was; He had walked in a tent, for note, it is a matter of walking, not dwelling merely; there was very little restfulness in it; He walked in a tent with them and in a tabernacle. The allusion is to Numbers, to bring to our attention what divine love is as with us now, bearing with us, and putting up with all sorts of things, and yet finding its way to be with us. Numbers, therefore, opens with the speaking in the wilderness -- out of the tent, but in the wilderness.
Ques. Is that exemplified in the pathway of the Lord Jesus with His disciples?
J.T. Well, I think we have it indicated there.
"And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us" (John 1:14); and He put up with much. The patience and grace of the Lord with His disciples help us to understand how He bears with us now. We must all be aware of how much He has to put up with in us and what poor accommodation there is.
H.H. The epistle to the Corinthians would be on that line -- the love of Paul to the saints, and how he put up with things in them.
J.T. Yes, I think so. The apostle was representative there of divine love; he says, "If even in abundantly loving you I should be less loved" 2 Corinthians 12:15. "But be it so" he said; he accepted it.
H.H. We are more familiar with the thought of the wilderness in connection with our individual path here; but what you are referring to is more the church's position in the wilderness; the exercises that are in that connection.
J.T. That is right. The earlier instructions here are to preclude any unnecessary inconvenience -- the workings of the flesh; every precaution is taken in these early chapters anticipative of the working of the flesh, to preclude it. These chapters should be read in that light -- the divine foresight and forethought in order that the workings of the flesh should be shut out.
F.W. When you speak of the wilderness, do you mean God's ways with us?
J.T. Well, the ways of God come out in the wilderness; His ways with us are but the means of His showing His patience, how long-suffering He is, and how ready to accept the inconveniences of the wilderness. Caleb and Joshua entered into that; they came to see what marked God's ways with the people, and they were content, and accepted the long period of journeyings imposed upon the people on account of their own wills. So that I think the ways of God with us -- with His people -- viewed collectively,
only bring out the love that underlies all; as we read, "In all their affliction he was afflicted" Isaiah 63:9. He entered into what they went through. Perhaps you had something else in your mind?
F.W. I was only trying to focus the thought of the tabernacle in the wilderness. In Exodus there seems to be a different setting of the tabernacle -- more the Ephesian, the assembly side, would you say?
H.H. Psalm 68 refers to God arising and His enemies being scattered, then verse 7 might have a bearing on what you are saying, "O God, when thou wentest forth before thy people, when thou didst march through the wilderness" Psalm 68:7
J.T. You get two beautiful touches in the type. Paul refers to one of them, "a spiritual Rock which followed [them]" furnishing drink and refreshment, "now the rock was the Christ" 1 Corinthians 10:4 The rock went behind, and the ark went before; that is to say, all the pioneering work, involving the severest conflict and drudgery, so to speak, belonged to the Lord. The allusion, I suppose, to the rock which followed them gives the thought of water-carrying -- a sort of drudgery; divine love expressing itself thus. In Numbers 10 we find that the proper position of the ark was in the centre, the divine intent being that Christ should be honoured among the people, and that all should serve Him; He was to be in the very midst of the armies of Israel, surrounded by them. Instead of that, however, He breaks through the ordinary rule and goes before. It is a very remarkable thing that there is nothing said previously about the ark going before, showing how divine love reserves its own liberty. It acts from itself; as the Lord did when He sat at table, then rising from supper He laid aside His garments. Love would act thus, and He sets an example to us, that, instead of in any way preserving dignity or honour we may rather accept the drudgery. The whole idea of the system that
exists around is built up on the honour that is put on the servant, whereas the divine way is to give that up, to relinquish all that for the good of others and to accept the drudgery.
Rem. We all need grace to move on that line.
Rem. The spirit of the apostle was, "ourselves your bondmen for Jesus' sake" 2 Corinthians 4:5.
J.T. Yes. So he insists that the servants were the property of the saints, "For all things are yours" even the great servants, "whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas" 1 Corinthians 3:21 - 23. The honour of Christ -- the place which belongs to the ark -- is preserved when the early instructions in the book are observed, that is to say, the recognition of the twelve. The idea is that lie has that which, as actuated by love, is flexible.
F.W. I do not quite understand your reference to the ark and the rock.
J.T. I was pointing out that in Numbers 10 the ark leaves its own normal place, which was in the midst of the camp guarded by military organisation, a priestly organisation, and a levitical organisation -- all concentric circles, so to speak, but the ark inside. Now when the time for movement came, we have the order of the movement, and then it is said that the tabernacle is taken down in its own place, but nothing is said about the ark; whereas in the verses read (35 and 36) the ark goes before -- it takes the lead, to find out a resting-place for the people.
F.W. What do you understand by that?
J.T. It is divine love in Christ taking on the most onerous and menial work -- first going before and finding a resting-place in the wilderness where there was no way, no path, and then the rock following, which is another thought; that rock they all drank of, it says. It is as if the Lord were carrying water behind them. The drudgery, the menial character of the service is in view. There was no actual rock, but
He provided it; it followed: "the rock was the Christ" 1 Corinthians 10:4
F.W. "And have all been given to drink of one Spirit" (1 Corinthians 12:13); is that a similar thought?
J.T. The reference to the Rock, the rock which followed them, is a menial one, whereas in 1 Corinthians 12 it is the cup of blessing that is undoubtedly alluded to. We have been all made to drink into one Spirit. The reference in chapter 10 is to the menial character of the thing -- the Rock that followed them.
Ques. Was this "resting-place" provisional? It says the ark went before them in a three days' journey to search out a resting-place for them.
J.T. Yes, it was leading on; it was, as you say, provisional, because, whenever it happened, Moses said these words, "Return, Jehovah, unto the myriads of the thousands of Israel"
C.C.E. Do you think both these movements have been exemplified in the Lord's goodness to us during the last century? He has gone before in His gracious way to provide a resting-place for us, and then there is His wonderful grace in providing refreshment for us; I wondered whether we could make that application.
J.T. I am sure we can; it is very practical. If we see what divine love is in thus adapting itself to us, to our needs, we are reminded of the earlier instructions; that if the conditions described do not exist, the corresponding gain is not realised; hence we have the twelve princes, and the numbering is to be with their cognisance. Verse 16 should read, "These were those summoned of the assembly, princes of the tribes of their fathers, the heads of the thousands of Israel" Numbers 1:16 It appears it is not simply that they were summoned, but that they were responsible, being such as could be summoned.
C.C.E. The thought would be that they could be called upon for consultation and such like.
J.T. Yes; and then their responsibility always stood in connection with the tent of meeting, so that they were always liable to be summoned; they were such as were summoned. Anything that might come in to prevent them responding to the summons would bring to light that there was something wrong.
E.S.H. Would the care-meeting be something of that character?
J.T. I think so. The Lord expresses His mind in the summons; He indicated that not only were the persons responsible, but they were known, they had been summoned before, they were tried men. But the thing represents state in the saints rather than persons; the Lord has those known to Him on whom He can lay His hand.
E.S.H. Does Matthew's gospel provide for this, do you think?
J.T. Well, I think it would. Matthew at the end presents the Lord acting in the capacity of a king. He sent a message to His disciples, "Go bring word to my brethren that they go into Galilee, and there they shall see me" Matthew 28:10. Then in verse 16 we read that the disciples went into Galilee to the mountain which Jesus had appointed them, and when they saw Him they did Him homage. Now John tells us that the Lord said to them, "I will see you again" chapter 16:22. That would be from His side. When it is a question of simple privilege and affection going out, it is from His side, "I will see you" but when it is a question of legislation, and the responsibility laid upon us, it is a question of our seeing Him, "There they shall see me" and they did see Him, and when they saw Him they did Him homage -- there was respect; there was reverence.
F.W. Did they get their commission in the end of the chapter from that point?
J.T. Yes. But then He says, "All power has been given me in heaven and upon earth" Matthew 20:18 That was to be
taken notice of; they could not go anywhere else for power; it was all in His hands. Now He says, "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations" Matthew 28:19 That was a big order! That would throw them back on themselves, as it were -- what they were to do. How were they to do this? They certainly could not do it of themselves! But then the Lord puts it on them to do it, and the more He puts on you, the more dependent you are; but you know where to go; He says, I have got all power; you know where to go to get help.
Now these men who were summoned were like that; they were in the place of responsibility, and Moses could call upon them at any time.
Ques. Is it necessary to go to Galilee for that?
J.T. I think it is; if you go to Galilee, that means you have interest in the thing, because you feel the need of going there; and what can you do by yourself?
In Luke the Lord puts no such obligations on us, nor in John, or Mark, but He does in Matthew, because it is a question of our being made "princes ... in all the earth" Psalm 45:16 so that the Lord can call upon us, and summon us.
In Numbers 16 Moses summoned some, but they refused to hearken; that is where the rebellion came in.
Rem. "A vessel ... serviceable to the Master"; "Be strong in the grace that [is] in Christ Jesus" 2 Timothy 2:21,1. Would that cover what you were saying?
J.T. I think so, the vessels are meet for the master's use. But these twelve men would represent the responsible element, and of course all are responsible. But the summons is a very serious matter. You have to give up your own thoughts when you are summoned, for something is to be said to you; the Lord has something to say.
Ques. What were they summoned for?
J.T. Oh, for various things. The exigencies of the wilderness required that they should be called upon to assemble and give their counsel. If anything happened in any of their sections, it would be a matter for them all. The local question arises in regard of each one of them.
Ques. Do you think that if we were conscious of our responsibility that our ears would be attentive to the summons?
J.T. If anything happened in your locality you would be wise to respond to the summons. After all, it is a general matter.
H.H. "The angel of the assembly" Revelation 2 and 3. Does that touch on it at all?
J.T. I think that is the idea -- the responsible element.
E.S.H. Does that scripture: "Princes shalt thou make them in all the earth" (Psalm 45:16) show that any local matter is to be viewed in relation to what is universal?
J.T. I think that is right. They were treated as one whole. The number twelve denotes flexibility; the Lord has what He can use. There is no number, perhaps, more easily divided than twelve; its parts are many.
Ques. What do you say it denotes?
J.T. Flexibility in government, in administration.
H.H. Do you mean it would not be the judgment of one merely, but more like a jury, something they could agree upon amongst themselves?
J.T. Yes, and the Lord has such a vessel, such a flexible number, as it were. He could use one; He can subdivide the number, and yet all stands in relation to the total number, so that any subdivision of the number used stands in relation to the whole. He can subdivide and use every part of the total.
Ques. "If two of you" Matthew 18:19. Would that suggest two of the whole agreeing in regard of the Lord's interests?
J.T. "Two of you" means two of the assembly.
Ques. Did the Lord subdivide the number when He took up Peter, and James, and John with Him into the high mountain apart?
J.T. Yes, quite; it was a fourth of the number.
C.C.E. The Lord is prepared for any emergency.
J.T. That is what I thought. In the book of Revelation you have the fullest conception of it -- a hundred and forty-four thousand. Whatever men may have in the way of empire, or cabinets, or administrative machinery, here is something that the Lord has. The winds are held up till the "bondmen of our God" Revelation 7:3 have been sealed in their foreheads -- "[the] seal of [the] living God"; Revelation 7:2 and John says, "I heard the number of the sealed a hundred [and] forty-four thousand sealed out of every tribes of [the] sons of Israel" (Revelation 7:4); that is to say, God has multiplied them and He is to have a wonderful system of administration, flexible in the last degree, so that it is all under His hand; He can use it at His pleasure, and divide it according to His infinite wisdom. Well, we want to be in that, to be available for it.
Ques. Do you think that the local exercises are in that way preparing us for the universal administration?
J.T. It would seem so; so the thought would be to be available to the Lord as a unit, as any part of the number, or in any subdivision of it, but in relation to the whole. Then another thing that arises is the question of confidence. This administration at the present time is carried on over a wide area, involving many modifying things, such as national prejudices and local prejudices of various kinds, and distance, so that the question of confidence comes in prominently,
as to whether we can accept what has been done at a distance from us.
C.C.E. How is this confidence fostered?
J.T. They were the tribes of Israel. It says, "Take the sum of the whole assembly of the children of Israel, after their families, according to their fathers' houses, by the number of the names". They were of one parent stock, though divided up into families, and the pedigrees were to be declared. It says in verse 18, "and they declared their pedigrees, after their families, according to their fathers' houses" -- one fountain, one parent, one source, and the pedigree brings out that I belong to that. The pedigree is to be declared, meaning that there is genuineness; we are all of one family, notwithstanding many modifying things; we are that and we hold to it, and it underlies confidence. I do not see how the fellowship which is proper to the assembly is to be maintained apart from confidence.
Ques. All partaking of the divine nature (2 Peter 1:4); is that the point?
C.C.E. The world works on the principle of a central authority.
J.T. The situation in our day is that we have no king to command at all. "The locusts have no king, yet they go forth all of them by bands" Proverbs 30:27. Colossians and Ephesians are the furnishing epistles, particularly Colossians, which brings in "love in [the] Spirit" Colossians 1:8 -- "love ... towards all the saints" Colossians 1:4 Love in the Spirit is love unaffected by natural predilections and preferences; it is pure, and it is universal -- for all the saints -- hence you have confidence; if anything is done, say in Australia, or in South Africa, or anywhere, you have confidence, and you leave it there.
Ques. Is the truth of the one body behind it in any way?
J.T. That is the thought, otherwise, we are just so many communities with a sort of unwritten understanding, which is not the unity of the Spirit at all. What God would hold us to is the unity of the Spirit, and that is a subjective thing.
H.H. We have to be built up in our souls as to what the assembly is in order to feel our responsibility in relation to it.
J.T. We are notified at the very beginning here that the scene in which we are is contrary; we are not going to have any help from it; it is in the wilderness. The book of Numbers begins with that, so we must make up our minds at the outset to be tested to the utmost limits of our capacity, and that throws us on the Lord. It is no small matter to move in such a scene, even physically, with a large number of people, and to maintain the principles of God. The tabernacle, so to speak, is standing in the midst all the time, so how are we to hold the truth of the assembly, that in which God dwells, and yet be separate and definite in our local setting -- how is it to be done?
E.S.H. Do you suggest that if family relations and affections amongst brethren are developed, there would be more confidence?
J.T. Yes, for there would be the consciousness of common parentage, as it were, and being of the same family. After all, Israel were sons of one man. The pedigree establishes that fact for each one; it establishes the fact that I belong to the family.
Ques. Would that correct the tendency to question what is done at a distance?
J.T. I think confidence would enable us to rely on what was done at a distance; we must come to that.
Ques. Would it be on the line of love believing all things?
J.T. Just so, that is right; "believes all things, hopes all things" 1 Corinthians 13:7
Ques. Would this confidence tend to maintain the normal conditions to which you refer in the early chapters?
J.T. Well, I think that confidence is one of the greatest features, calculated to guarantee the fulfilment of the early chapters -- our belonging to one family, and each showing his pedigree. Anything contrary to that later would be called in question. If I have established my pedigree, I have established and avowed my relationship to the saints as one of the brethren and am under obligation to love them, and that is wherever they are, whether local or elsewhere.
Rem. It is striking that the pedigree and the father's house are thus brought together at the beginning of this particular book that takes up the local settings of things.
J.T. It is so; the thing comes down to the standard of the father's house; first the tribe, and then the father's house; the family thought runs right through, so that we can have it in the smallest number -- the father's house, or we can have it with the whole twelve tribes. The family thought was always to be maintained, hence when they went up to Jerusalem three times a year, the family thought would ever be present.
F.W. Why do you think the order is changed in the naming of the tribes? According to the instructions the tribe of Gad comes in earlier, but in the record of the carrying out of the instructions the order is changed and he is nearly last.
J.T. Everything here is in divine wisdom; there would be some good reason for it, but what it is I do not know. You notice that as a rule Reuben is mentioned first, but in the order of march, Judah comes first. Reuben represents the responsible side,
but Judah is the sovereign side; on the line of the responsible side God may alter things and put another before you.
Ques. Would you say the maintenance of the family thought produces confidence?
J.T. That is what I have been trying to enlarge on: "we are brethren" as Moses insisted. At the very beginning of Exodus we have a sort of key to the whole of these instructions; I refer to the combination of light and love in Moses and Aaron. When Moses returned from the wilderness after forty years, he had the light, but Aaron had the love. God says to him, Aaron is coming to meet you, and he will be glad to see you, and when Aaron met him he kissed him. The love side is seen in Aaron, he was the brother, and he was the Levite. "Is not Aaron the Levite thy brother ... And also, behold he goeth out to meet thee, and will be glad in his heart" Exodus 4:14 So that you have in the meeting the combination of light in Moses and love in Aaron, and these go together.
Ques. Like Paul the apostle and Sosthenes the brother?
J.T. Very much like that; Moses has the light, and Aaron is the spokesman -- the brother is the one who speaks; these two things run right through.
Ques. Would both be seen in the breast-plate of the high priest?
J.T. Well, the saints were all there in the heart of Christ. He never loses sight of one of us. According to our scripture He has us here under His eye for administration, to be summoned at any time and to be used according to His pleasure, whether one or two or three. You can divide twelve into twelve units, but all under His hand and all serving in relation to the whole number.DIVINE WISDOM OPERATING AGAINST APOSTASY (2)
DIVINE WISDOM OPERATING AGAINST APOSTASY (3)
DIVINE WISDOM OPERATING AGAINST APOSTASY (4)
THE REMNANT
STANDING BY THE CROSS OF JESUS
GOD CALLING OUT OF THE TABERNACLE
GOD SPEAKING IN THE WILDERNESS -- IN THE TABERNACLE