2 Timothy 1:8, 2 Timothy 2:1 - 13
J.T. We started yesterday with the thought of the testimony, and it seems to be on the minds of many that it should be taken up today. This epistle presents itself as particularly setting it forth. I shall be glad of any thought you may have on the testimony as spoken of here: "Be not thou therefore, ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God".
H.D'A.C. It is remarkable it should be called a testimony here, and that the encouragement should be given to Timothy.
J.T. I suppose the prominence given by the apostle to his own position, in this epistle, would suggest that he had specially in his mind the unfolding of the truth; it would suggest, that the practical way in which the testimony is unfolded in his ministry, was in his mind. That is the full church position; and the light set there in connection with his ministry. He couples "the testimony of our Lord", with "and of me his prisoner".
J.S.A. And then he also connects it with the gospel, of which he was the special exponent.
J.T. I think that being then a prisoner indicates the reception that the testimony received in the world. The apostolic position is a very important consideration in connection with the testimony. I think Paul represented the apostolic idea, and the opening up of the testimony, which was foreshadowed in Moses' ministry.
W.H. Would you say Moses presents to us the apostolic idea?
Ques. What do you mean by the apostolic idea?
J.T. I think that the Lord had taken up Paul, and He would adhere to Paul; He would allow no conditions arising in the world to interfere with His choice: "that by me", the apostle says, "the preaching might be fully known". (2 Timothy 4:17) That is, it must come out by the vessel divinely chosen.
Rem. You mean the apostle being a prisoner does not affect the testimony?
J.T. Paul's imprisonment shows the kind of reception which the testimony received.
Ques. Would it affect the testimony for the good of the testimony?
J.T. No doubt; but it shows the kind of reception the testimony had received. But then the Lord was not going to be affected by that.
J.S.A. That shows the necessity of the power of God to make good the testimony.
J.T. So that the two thoughts run through the epistle. The apostle, the one through whom the power is manifested, can say, "the Lord stood by me and strengthened me, that by me the preaching might be fully known". (2 Timothy 4:17)
Ques. Why do you make the apostolic position so prominent?
J.T. Because I think that it is well to see that God has never receded from the position He took up. He took up a certain position in Paul's ministry, and He has never receded from that; and that position stands.
Ques. Do you mean that if we are to have the testimony that position must be recognised in our souls?
J.T. Yes. You have to make up your mind to that.
Ques. What do you understand by the testimony of the Lord?
J.T. I think it is the testimony connected with the Lord viewed in the official position, which involves His power. You are not to be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, because we can reckon upon His power as support.
T.M.G. That is why it is the testimony of our Lord.
J.T. I think so. I think it is a great thing to make up your mind that God has taken up a certain position in the ministry of Paul which He proposes to maintain, and for that you require the strength of the Lord.
T.M.G. And the Lord alone is equal to that; and He will have that testimony carried out.
Ques. Does the testimony involve the whole church position?
J.T. I think that is exactly what it does. God has taken up a position here in the unfolding of His mind, and He is not going to recede from it. Now, the question is whether we are prepared for that; there is to be no surrender of it. That is the great point in the epistle, I think. There it is; the testimony of our Lord has been unfolded. It is not in this epistle a question of revelation.
H.D'A.C. It is not simply that the Lord is the testimony; the Lord is presented as the One who supports the testimony, and carries it on.
H.M. It speaks of the testimony of the Christ being formed among the Corinthians. Is there any difference in the thought there?
J.T. The Christ has reference, I think, to the Man whom God has chosen. The thought of "the Christ" depends on what Christ is as Man. It is God, as it were, making His choice. He has taken up that Man, and in that Man He unfolds His mind. It is not a question of His power, but of His choice. The Christ is God's choice. God has anointed that Man.
H.D'A.C. Yes; and all the thoughts of God for man are set forth in Him. Would you not connect it with "the promise of life in Christ Jesus" (1 Timothy 1:1) which we read of at the beginning of the epistle?
J.T. I think so. God's Man has come into evidence; now God has found everything in that Man personally. He is so infinitely agreeable to God that He has anointed Him. The thought in anointing is that the anointed one is God's choice. "Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed", (John 6:27). The Father has taken up that Man, and everything has now to be administered by Him; so that He is the anointed Vessel. I think it is in that way we have the "testimony of the Christ". (1 Corinthians 1:6)
Ques. It is taken up in that Person?
J.T. Yes. The kings of the earth stand up and the rulers take counsel against the Lord and against His Anointed, Psalm 2. It is the question of God's choice; but God says, "Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion. I will declare the decree: the Lord hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee". (Psalm 2:6,7). He has put that Man in the place of power and glory.
J.S.A. If I understand aright what you said about the testimony of the Christ, it has more reference to what He is as the anointed Man; but when it comes to the Lord it is more a question of power in carrying out all things.
Rem. One can see the great necessity of it in Timothy; there had been a turning away, and power was needed to support the truth. In Corinthians it was really the testimony that the apostle presented to them to deliver them from man.
J.T. Yes. I think that, speaking generally,
where souls have to be delivered, from the political world around us, what effects that is the testimony of the Christ.
"Neither has the Lord chosen him", (1 Samuel 16:8) was what the Spirit said to Samuel when each of the sons of Jesse were made to pass before him; but when David appears Jehovah says, "Arise, anoint him, for this is he". (1 Samuel 16:12). It is an immense thing to see the Man whom God has chosen for the accomplishment of His designs. If you see the Lord's Anointed it will deliver you from all that is political here.
H.D'A.C. And David comes in after the man of the people's choice. Saul was descriptive of the people's choice, though God allowed the lot to fall upon him. He knew there was none who could, according to the people's idea, better represent what they wanted. He allowed Saul to come forward; and then He brings in the Man of His choice.
J.T. How ready our hearts are to light upon some man.
T.M.G. The first man proved to be a failure, and then God brought in another Man.
J.T. You have to consider the kind of man whom God has anointed.
T.M.G. A man of another order.
J.T. Yes; now David was that in principle.
Ques. Do you get the thought of that in Noah and the ark?
In regard to the anointing, if you see the Man that God has anointed it delivers you from all officialism. God has found. His Man, and He has anointed Him; He has taken Him up and anointed Him. The next thing the anointing involves is that He is in the place of authority; He is "both Lord and Christ;" and the thought of the Lord is introduced here that we might be assured of the power that supports Timothy. There are two things which come out in
connection with David; the complete overthrow of the Philistine power; the Philistine power is really the religious power, and then David gets the ark; he comes to Zion and he installs the ark there. The effect of the anointing was that David secured the testimony in its own place, and protected it.
Rem. There is a beautiful verse in Psalm 89:19: "Then thou spakest in vision to thy holy one and saidst, I have laid help upon one that is mighty; I have exalted one chosen out of the people". That is looking forward to what you speak of.
J.S.A. Reference was made just now to politics. I remember a brother saying that the first verse of the New Testament had cleared him as to politics when he saw that the true Son of Abraham sat on the throne of David; and that anything you could set up in this world meanwhile would only make things worse.
H.D'A.C. It is very easy to get our eyes on the wrong man. Samuel mourned for Saul, but if Hannah's song had been before him he would not have looked to Saul. It is in Hannah's song we get the first mention of God's Anointed. She said: "The adversaries of the Lord shall be broken to pieces; out of heaven shall he thunder upon them; the Lord shall judge the ends of the earth, and he shall give strength unto his king and exalt the horn of his anointed". (1 Samuel 2:10) That referred to the Christ. Samuel had to learn really who was God's Christ; that the Adam man came first in God's wisdom to show that a man who is the very cream, so to speak, of humanity, the best man that could be produced from amongst men, only brings in ruin when it comes to the crisis; when it comes to the test he fails. Then God brings out His man. Samuel had to learn that only David would do for God. We take a long time to get to Christ. We were very glad to get to Him as Saviour, but all our political thoughts are
very much in connection with men around us. Nothing delivers us from the politics of this world like a true thought of Christ. You will be ashamed that you ever touched politics when you get true thoughts of Christ. Men are not going to live down here through a man like themselves, a man of their own choosing; it must be through God's Christ. Only through the Man of God's choice can the nations be blessed.
J.S.A. There are many who keep clear of politics as regards actual facts, but who get under the spirit that is in the world; for instance, those who take part in voting.
Rem. Someone has said, very truly, that you cannot avoid in a certain way forming a judgment about things; but if your heart, as has been said, is set on another Man altogether, the Man of God's thoughts, and all that belongs to Him, you discover that His politics are entirely apart from everything here.
J.T. I think it is quite right to have a judgment as to what is going on in the world, because the elements that are active are simply what God is holding in abeyance. The world is still the sphere of God's government. It is extremely interesting to see how God comes in from time to time to modify things for the sake of the assembly. One has often observed how the spirit of lawlessness has been restrained for the sake of the assembly; and our prayers should be in that connection. Whilst you have a judgment of things, and you see the development of the antichristian system, and that all is about to be manifested, yet you are thinking; of Christ, and you are living in a world that is centred in God's Anointed. It is very interesting to see in Acts 4 how the early saints recognised what God did. In the presence of the combined hostility against the Lord and against His Anointed they prayed to God;
the God that created the heavens and the earth and all that is in them. They were not restricted; they recognised the divine sovereignty of God, and they prayed, and the place where they were assembled was shaken.
J.S.A. And they also owned that nothing could be done except what God had ordered should be done.
L.M. How are you to become acquainted with things in the world? .
J.T. It would be a very bad result if what we are saying would encourage the saints to read the newspapers. The book of Revelation contemplates a knowledge of passing events. The number of the beast has to be counted, for instance.
H.D'A.C. You cannot help hearing of passing events. Why then go out of your way to get the knowledge of them if things are forced upon me I seek to contrast them. It is an immense thing to contrast the things that are forced upon you with our system, the system of God's Christ.
J.T. The man to whom God revealed His mind, and with whom God's testimony began, was a very unpatriotic man; he forsook his country, and his kindred, and his father's house; hence he declined all that which men aspire to in this world.
H.D'A.C. But he was a great politician for "he looked for a city which hath foundations". (Hebrews 11:10)
J.T. And God answered that. As enlightened by God you have certain aspirations. Abraham looked for a city, and God proposes for you what you look for, that you get position in the divine system for what you may think you lose in abandoning the present order of things.
J.S.A. Man desires knowledge, power, and place. Well, the apostle says, "that I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings". (Philippians 3:10) There you have knowledge, power,
and place. God answers your prayers in His way, not in yours.
J.T. I think what Mr. C. referred to is very helpful, and that is, that the things about us being forced upon us enable us to take account of the contrast in what God presents; the contrast becomes very real to you.
Ques. Are the afflictions of the gospel part of the contrast.
J.T. I think the afflictions of the gospel indicated the kind of reception the gospel received in the world; so that Timothy is called upon to suffer evil along with the glad tidings. I think suffering is involved in the position we take up in relation to the testimony.
J.S.A. It is also interesting to see that the glad tidings is looked upon as if it were something that is going on in this world with the power of God behind it to carry it on; but the question is, Are we in fellowship with that?
H.D'A.C. To my mind, we ought to stand for the glad tidings, and to be imbued with it, and be impressed with it more than ever. Some may have the idea that there is no use going on with the gospel; but that should make us all the more eager to go on with it.
Rem. One reason would be that the glad tidings brings Christ into prominence.
Ques. Would you point out what is meant by the testimony involving the whole church position.
J.T. Well, I think the testimony involves all that which has come out in the ministry of Paul. Peter received a commission from the Lord in receiving the keys of the kingdom; and the Lord entrusts light as to the church to Peter. He says, "On this rock I will build my assembly, and hades' gates shall not prevail against it". (Matthew 16:18) And then He says
"I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of the heavens, and whatsoever thou mayest bind upon the earth shall be bound in the heavens, and whatsoever thou mayest loose on the earth shall be loosed in the heavens". (Matthew 16:19) I think the Lord, after having introduced the idea of the church, immediately added that of the kingdom, to show that there would be a way made for the church; and in intimating a binding and a loosing, I think He intended to lift from the Gentiles the restrictions that God had placed upon them governmentally. He intended that those restrictions should be removed, so that the ground might be prepared for Paul's ministry. It is in Paul's ministry you have the church in its world-wide aspect, and I think that is what is in view here; the testimony here is established through the ministry of Paul.
Ques. When you speak of the restrictions that were placed on the Gentiles, what do you mean?
J.T. In calling out Israel, and separating them specially from the nations, there were certain restrictions placed upon the nations. They were "without God in the world", and had no title; they were strangers to the covenant of promise; they had nothing in connection with what God had instituted. Now, Peter removes these restrictions from off the Gentiles. By baptism I think he brought the Gentile under the wing of the Lord, so to speak. Peter had to be educated for it in the case of Cornelius, but he commanded baptism; he baptised them in the name of the Lord, and so he brought the Gentile under the wing of the Lord. Now, that makes room for the church.
J.S.A. Simeon in Luke, announced that the Lord was to be a light for the revelation of the Gentiles, and Peter is the one who is used to bring them into it.
J.T. In the apostle Paul's ministry you have
Paul unfolding all the mind of God in regard to Christ, and the church's place in God's counsels. Now, that involves a very great deal, because it involves the heavens and the earth as well as God's thoughts of blessing for all. God is not going to recede from His thought; that is His testimony.
Ques. How can a person be "ashamed of the testimony?"
Rem. What is referred to there is the opposition which the apostle met with.
T.E.W. It conveys this, that God had abandoned the earthly centre -- Jerusalem. A light, a voice, from heaven; all that indicates the transference of the centre from Jerusalem to heaven.
Rem. Someone asks, how anybody can be ashamed of the testimony. How are we not to be ashamed of it?
W.K. Do not be ashamed to identify yourself with it.
H.D'A.C. I think you should consider whether there is a single point you ought to be ashamed of. Take the whole testimony of Christ; there is nothing whatever shameful in it, in all its parts it is infinitely glorious. When you realise that, you can understand the injunction, "Be not therefore ashamed of the testimony".
Rem. The fact of the warning being given shows that the danger was present.
Rem. There is not a thing in this world which you should not blush at -- the whole system is wrong. We, get under the influence of things around, and hence we get ashamed of Christ.
T.M.G. "The Lord give mercy unto the house of Onesiphorus; for he oft refreshed me, and was not ashamed of my chain". (2 Timothy 1:16)
L.M. How are we to know a man who is a prisoner for Him?
J.T. Well, prisoners for the testimony's sake were
always very scarce, and it is a question whether there are any today; but there is one thing sure, the gospel is in reproach; it is not bound now. It is very encouraging to see, in Acts 7, that whilst Saul, the great adversary of the gospel, was binding men and women, the gospel went on.
L.M. We have come to a very bad pass if there are no prisoners now.
J.T. It is a question of how much we are identified with it; it is a question of how many are espousing it.
H.M. I notice you turn from the expression "testimony" to "gospel". Do you identify the two expressions in your mind?
H.D'A.C. They seem very closely connected. When you come to the gospel you think of God coming out in all that He is.
T.M.G. It is concerning His Son.
J.S.A. I think the words about the apostle's preaching in Romans 16:25, are very interesting. "Now to him that is of power to establish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery". (Romans 16:25)
Ques. Do we need to know the heavenly position of the church in our souls, so as to realise the power of God?
J.T. I think it is a great thing to have before your soul the power of God; but before you can touch what is heavenly you have to see as to whether you are entitled to the earth. It is very weak to talk about the heavenly position if you do not see your title to live here.
Ques. What do you mean by title?
J.T. Well, the Lord has brought to light by the glad tidings, life and incorruptibility; that does not go beyond the present position. It is a question of the power of God. Now, the Lord established a title for man to live on earth, and unless you see that title it is very weak to talk about a title to heaven.
The question of life and death was raised on earth; that question was not raised in heaven it was raised on earth. The whole point is as to whether man can establish a title to life.
Ques. Do you mean because he had forfeited it himself?
J.T. Yes; man had forfeited his title to life; now the Lord is said to have annulled death, but before He annulled death He established a title to live.
Ques. Is that what the anointing comes in in connection with?
J.T. I think so. Whom would God anoint except a Man who has title to live?
J.S.A. There is an interesting verse of scripture that supports what you have been saying -- "In this was manifested the love of God towards us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him", (1 John 4:9)
Ques. It is connected with new creation?
J.T. Surely: but has man a title to live on earth? That must be settled before the heavenly position can be taken up.
Ques. How has that title been made good to us?
J.T. It was first made good in Christ. The title to live must be established by Man. It is a wonderful proposition, to my mind. Man has brought in death; and he is perfectly helpless, unless MAN establishes a title to live.
We all know that the Lord when here was, as He is now, a divine Person; that is a cardinal truth of Christianity; One with the Father. On that side we can easily understand how everything should be accomplished; but the point was that He should become Man, and that being so what came out in Him as Man here was that He had a title to live; death had no claim upon Him.
Rem. No claim upon Him personally, for He was the righteous Man.
J.T. Yes, exactly. The idea was God and man. God formed His creature man, for Himself, and that creature was made to look up to God. God was to be the supreme object of affection for man.
T.M.G. Christ, loved righteousness and hated iniquity.
J.T. Man lost his place through disobedience; now what you see in Christ is the answer to all that; that is, in Christ, God had His full place; it was always a question of God with Him. We have to distinguish between the Lord's position as Son with the Father, and His position as Man before God..
Rem. We have the thought in the Lord's message to His disciples by Mary, "I ascend to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God". (John 20:17)
J.T. It would have availed nothing for us if He had not died; but He had in view the establishment of eternal life for us. He was it; "in him was life, and the life was the light of men". (John 1:4)
Rem. Where man failed in everything, Christ answered to God fully in His pathway before He entered into death.
J.T. Yes, so that manifestly death had no claim over Him. He went to the mount of transfiguration; He had proved His title as Man to go up to the highest place, and there Moses and Elias talk to Him of His decease, which He should, accomplish at Jerusalem. His title to be immune from death was perfectly evident, but they talk of His death. Now, that involves that He was a divine Person, because the overthrow of death involves that He was the Son of God. Now come to our side. "He that liveth and believeth on me shall never die". You cannot establish a title to live; but "he that liveth and believeth in me shall never die". (John 11:26)
Ques. What time does that refer to? "He that liveth and believeth on me shall never perish". (John 11:26)
J.T. I think it means that faith in that Person ensures title to live; the pressure of death is removed from your spirit. You are not in the Christian position if the pressure of death is not removed from your spirit.
L.M. I thought the Scripture quoted referred to the world to come.
J.T. The assembly is relieved of the pressure of, death. The title to the position on earth must be made clear before we can talk about the heavenly position.
H.M. "We know that we have passed from death unto life". (1 John 3:14) I suppose that is the same thought?
Ques. Do you mean that we have title to life here?
J.T. In the midst of this scene of death, we are in the full light of what Christ is.
Rem. We have no title to live here, in connection with men in this world.
J.T. Not as men in the flesh, but as believers in Christ; belief in that Man is discarding this man.
Rem. We have the promise of the things that now are and of those which are to come.
J.T. Yes, but "the life that I now live in the flesh" (Galatians 2:20) is another matter.
J.S.A. If we have a title to live here there is also a sphere established in which we can live, which is not the sphere of the world without.
T.M.G. Romans 6 makes that clear.
J.T. The Lord made the position clear: He had given His instructions to the disciples; and then we read, "These words spake Jesus and lifted up his eyes to heaven and said, Father, the hour is come". (John 17:1) Now, there is the MAN, and He speaks in all conscious relationship with His Father; He is
the Servant; and then. He goes on to say, "thou has given him authority over all flesh" (that is the Lord's position) "that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him". (John 17:2) I think we should be greatly exercised about that. The Lord has a universal position in regard to men, and it is to the end that He should give eternal life to as many as the Father has given Him.
Ques. I suppose you would say because He was a divine Person?
J.T. Yes; I think John presents the Lord as administrating things on the ground of His Person. Paul presents Him rather as the anointed Man, but John says, "the Father loves the Son and hath given all things into his hand". (John 3:35)
Rem. As many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
Ques. That is the divine side of the truth; what is the human side?
J.T. By the human side, I suppose you mean that you believe. "But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name". (John 20:31)
Ques. Is there something further brought before us in this Scripture than what we have been speaking about; that the Lord has abolished death?
J.T. He has abolished it, and brought life and incorruptibility to light through the glad tidings. Now, this refers to the state of things that God intends for us; that are brought to light in the glad tidings.
Rem. Life and incorruptibility can only be seen in one Man, but this life and incorruptibility came to light in the Lord before He ascended.
Rem. I think John, in the epistle, is pointing out that Christ is a real Man; "Jesus Christ come in flesh". He had been so real that the apostle says,
"We have seen the Lord". (John 20:25) The thought in eternal life is to see that man is entitled to live.
H.D'A.C. "He asked life of thee, and thou gavest it him, even length of days for ever and ever". (Psalm 21:4) Would not that be the title to live?
Ques. If it is life now, why do you say title to live? Do you connect it with this order of things?
J.T. Oh, no; it is not connected with this order of things, because, as has been pointed out, there is a sphere in which we can live; but evidently the title to live precedes that.
H.D'A.C. Connected with the promise of life in Christ Jesus at the beginning of the epistle.
J.S.A. If life came in in Christ and is set forth in Him, He must have a sphere in which that life can be lived in relation to Himself.
Ques. Is the title to live presented in the testimony?
J.T. It is in the Lord's name.
L.M. What do you mean by life -- life and incorruptibility?
Rem. Mr. Darby made a remark that eternal life was to enjoy the position God gives you.
J.T. What I have before me is that it is due to God that life should be introduced here in man; it was lost in man. Think what it was to God, that the man that He formed for Himself should have to disappear in death; and what it was to God to see a Man reinstating all that, reinstating all that God's thought was for man! The Father's commandment was life everlasting. That was established in the Lord publicly; the title that man should not die; that was a public testimony; there was no obvious reason why that Man should die; He had every title to live, and for this reason, that God had His true place with Him, in every possible respect. What obvious ground was there for that Man to die?
J.S.A. God has His rightful place. Mr. Wigram when asked what he understood by being "dead in trespasses and sins", replied that man has not one thought Godward.
H.D'A.C. I do not think you can get any right thoughts except as you see them in Christ. Christ sets forth what is in the mind of God for man.
J.T. Now, he goes on to say, "this is life eternal that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent". (John 17:3) He was in the full light of God, and He says, "this is life eternal that they might know thee the only true God". Now, that had reference to what Satan had introduced into the world, that is, idolatry. Satan had introduced idolatry into the world; Abraham had been called out of it, and it was to Abraham that the blessing was promised.
Ques. Is not God's thought for every man now that he might have eternal life?
J.T. The point is that the Lord has established the fact of man living here in the light of God, as knowing God; so that He says, "This is life eternal that they might know thee the only true God;" but more; "and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent". Life and incorruptibility are available through Him to all those whom the Father has given Him.
J.B. What is the obedience that is referred to in the passage? "by the obedience of one many are made righteous". (Romans 5:19)
J.T. The point there is the Lord's death. I think we have to get the two things together, that is to say, the knowledge of the true God, and the knowledge of the One that God sent. Do you see what I mean?
Rem. I see that we may look more exclusively at the Lord's death, and not take into account the pathway of the Lord in which every thought of God was answered as to Man.
Rem. The question of the relation between God and man is settled in the pathway of the Lord?
J.T. Yes, in principle, but then it must be settled vicariously. He did not settle it in His pathway for us. It is essential that we should see that the question was settled for us vicariously on the cross; we must see that. "As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness even so must the Son of man be lifted up". (John 3:14)
J.S.A. Unless the Lord had been as Man the perfect answer to God, how could He vicariously have gone into it on our behalf. I think it is of very great importance to see that all had to be made perfectly clear. He would have abode alone in that order of things unless He had gone into death.
Romans 8:14 - 16, 28 - 30; Ephesians 1:1 - 6
J.S.A. As some here were not present yesterday it may be necessary to state what the subject was. The testimony was before us, and it was pointed out, that it had two characters; the first referring to earth, how men could be on earth in true relationship with God; and, the second, that it had to do with the place God has given to His people in connection with Christ in the heavenlies. We were dwelling more on the position as set forth in Romans; that is to say, man made perfectly clear in relation to God, able to live to God on this earth.
J.T. It was thought that the epistle to the Romans deals with the first side of the truth, that which refers to man here on earth, so that man is reinstated in relation with God; and that the epistle to the Ephesians treats of the relationships in which the same persons are set, as connected with God's eternal counsels.
J.S.A. And these two things, one might add, must be taken together to get a true idea of the testimony.
Rem. You would say it is not God's intention to reinstate man in the position originally lost by him?
J.T. No; but I think it is important to see that God intends to establish every thought that He had indicated as to man here on earth. He set forth certain thoughts in connection with Israel, and those thoughts must find their answer first of all, before the heavenly side can be taken up.
Rem. And that would involve righteousness and life on our side.
H.D'A.C. You do not mean that man is reinstated in innocence, that man is put on the earth without the knowledge of good and evil; that could not be.
J.T. No. God's thought was that He would not surrender the idea of man. Satan would have robbed Him of man, of that order of being, but God would not surrender His purpose.
J.S.A. I understand in using the word reinstate you mean that God should have man back in relationship with Himself.
J.T. You must have the thoughts of God indicated in the Old Testament in regard to man established; because they refer to what God had in His mind to bring in here. What took place in Eden involved that God was robbed of all that; but in Christ becoming man every thought that God had indicated in regard to man on earth is taken up, and in every way set forth.
H.D'A.C. Man was made in the image and likeness of God; and he had the right to the tree of life; he did not actually take of the tree of life; but he had the right to it before the fall.
J.T. There were no restrictions in regard to the tree of life. Man was to be here as God's glory. That was a very great idea; and that had to be set forth in man. It was due to God that it should be.
T.M.G. So that none of the thoughts that God has had with regard to man are lost, even though sin has come in and spoiled man in the first state. Is that your thought?
J.T. Yes; the Lord says, He restored that which He took not away.
J.A.M. Do I understand you to say that God has thoughts of man, as such; and then He has thoughts in regard to Israel, a people in relation to Himself; and that His thoughts in regard to both of them apply to earth?
J.T. Yes, I think so; and those thoughts are all taken up by Christ as Man and maintained in every possible way.
T.M.G. So that nothing is lost.
Ques. Would you say something on the second part of the question?
J.T. Well, the law indicated what God sought in Israel; but we know He did not secure, what He sought in them. Now, Christ magnified the law, and He made it honourable; and that was here. I should like, that we all might see, that what the law set forth in that way is to be continued here on earth, in the saints. Christ died in order to make if possible that it should be continued here. In the first part of Romans 8 you have the kind of man that is suited for the earth; the righteous requirements of the law, we are told, are fulfilled in those who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit. Then, moreover, if any man have not the Spirit of Christ; that is to say, the Spirit of that Man, he is not of Him. So you have here as a result of the gospel a race of men who maintain righteousness. It is not an innocent race, but a race that is righteous; that is to say, they have the means of discharging every moral obligation, and they have also the Spirit of Christ. I should like that we might take hold of that.
Ques. What do you understand by the Spirit of Christ?
J.T. It is the Spirit of that Man. Then we get the other side later on in the chapter where it is the Spirit of God's Son.
T.M.G. Is that the Ephesian side -- the purpose side?
R.L. You could not speak of Adam being either righteous or holy as man; he was innocent.
J.T. Whereas of Christ it was said, "he loved
righteousness". In that, way you learn the kind of man suited for God.
H.D'A.C. God had intended to have a man in His image and likeness. The first man was not, of course, the complete thought. God made man upright, but that does not go so far as a righteous man.
J.S.A. When Adam was set forth, everything, the whole environment, was right; but it is a greater thing to have what is suitable to God in the midst of an environment that is all wrong.
J.T. That brought out exactly what Christ was. An environment of violence and corruption brought out what Christ was. It was not simply that He fulfilled righteousness, but He loved it.
T.M.G. God had that Man always before Him.
J.T. Yes. I think He had the order of life that is to be before God in His mind before the order that appeared in Adam existed.
J.S.A. That is perfectly true. That is connected more with the ultimate purpose of God; but having Adam and certain characteristics that are connected with Adam -- they must be made good.
H.D'A.C. The spirit of things is brought before us in Romans 8, and that leads on to Ephesians.
J.T. Quite so. So we have the spirit of life, the Spirit of Christ, and the Spirit of God's Son. I would like the simple thought of what man is for God, as seen in Christ, to be rightly understood; and that it is God's thought that it should be continued here.
Ques. How far would that go at present?
J.T. It is seen in the early part of Romans 8, in that the righteous requirement of the law is fulfilled in us who walk by the Spirit; and then we have the Spirit of Christ. What a thing it is to have the Spirit of Christ!
Rem. You would say that is to have the character of that Man.
J.T. The character is worked out from it. But see what kind of man it is that has the Spirit of Christ.
J.S.A. Our brother is emphasising that there is a distinct thought in the spirit of a man. It is not quite the same thing as the character of a man; it is more what you might call the particular energy in that man.
H.D'A.C. You get the elements of new creation in Romans 8, bat you get new creation in Ephesians.
T.M.G. The Spirit of Christ would produce the character.
J.S.A. What we have had before us is that there must be a right understanding of what man is here for God, and living to God, before one can properly appreciate the higher order of things that comes out in Ephesians and that shows the importance of the epistle to the Romans being understood, if we are to appreciate truly the line of purpose.
J.T. The whole testimony as regards the earth is witnessed to. God made the earth definitely to be inhabited, and now He has brought in the kind of man that is to inhabit it. So that we therefore anticipate the order of man that is to prevail in the millennial world.
H.D'A.C. An order of man really free from what governed us when under the power of sin and death. Man was always gravitating downwards, but the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus is brought in, and a complete change is brought about. So that man is attracted upwards towards God.
J.T. Directly you get the spirit of sonship another scene is suggested; because where must sons go to? to what position do they belong?
Ques. You mean that is the kind of man that inhabits heaven?
J.T. God is leading many sons to glory, but God
brings man in here in testimony, so that Satan gains nothing. Every divine thought is secured; Satan has gained nothing. God is free now to go on with His eternal purpose, having first secured every thought He gave expression to in regard to the earth, and man on it.
T.M.G. As to the purpose side, Satan has nothing there?
J.T. No, nothing; he never touched that.
J.S.A. I think what you have been saying is very important. The two lines are distinct in that way. You must have the first absolutely made good before you can enter into the other.
J.T. What I understand by the millennium is this; it is the intensification of responsibility; responsibility is intensified; and it is put into the hands of Christ; and everything is maintained by Him intact. That shows His perfection in carrying out every divine thought in regard to the earth; hence the thought of the Son of man is the prominent idea.
Ques. How is responsibility intensified?
J.T. Ten is the numeral of responsibility, and it is multiplied by one hundred.
T.E.W. I think, in a certain sense, men will never be more responsible than they are at this moment.
J.T. To what man did God ever commit a dispensation that was to endure for a thousand years? Take Noah, and Abraham, and David; they had certain responsibilities, but of very short duration. Now, in the millennium there is a thousand years; and the whole question of human responsibility is settled, and terminated.
H.D'A.C. There is Christ in the millennium with all that is needed to fulfil the responsibilities.
J.T. Then, when you come to the other side -- the Ephesians' side -- it is also set forth in Christ.
He is the expression of the man who is to be before God eternally. It is to be man, but man in the relationship of son. When you come to Ephesians, He is the "Beloved;" that is what He is to God. God has taken us into favour in the Beloved; and I do not think we shall ever get on to Ephesian ground until we have the thought of the Beloved.
Ques. Is it the same thought as in Colossians, where it says "the Son of his love?"
J.T. I think "the Beloved" is a stronger expression as regards affection. In Acts 20 we have "the blood of his own", but here it is the Beloved. There was not another. I think the key to the apprehension of God's purpose is affection. It is because of "his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ (by grace ye are saved); and hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus". (Ephesians 2:4,5)
Rem. To get the apprehension of it is to apprehend God's love.
J.T. We have to see the place that Christ has Godward. I think the term "Son" or "Son of God", applying to the Lord, refers to the unique place He has personally as the One through whom everything is effected. But, then, we must think of what He is to God.
Ques. What do you understand as to quickening in Ephesians; "quickened with Christ?"
J.T. I think it includes the whole divine thought as to us; it is not a question as to what is local. I take it to be anticipative, as including the whole work of God.
H.D'A.C. The whole work of God, in time, in regard to the church looked upon as carried into effect by one stroke of His power.
J.T. What makes the history of Moses so interesting, especially in connection with young Christians, is that it connects the faith of the parents with the decision of the child afterwards. It shows that the decision of the child afterwards was in keeping with the parents' faith.
Rem. They saw he was a goodly child.
J.T. Yes; I think there was some reflection of Christ in him that faith saw.
Rem. Something that would indicate to them that he was God-given.
J.T. The Spirit's comment on the passage in the New Testament helps us greatly; "By faith, Moses when he was born, was hid three months of his parents, because they saw he was a proper child; and they were not afraid of the king's commandment. By faith, Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter, choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season". (Hebrews 11:23 - 25) That is, his decision when he came to years of understanding was in keeping with the faith of his parents.
Rem. Therefore it becomes very helpful for all, but especially for young Christians; it is a great thing to come to a decision.
J.T. I think the greatest initial difficulty that Christians have is to come to a point of decision, especially if worldly circumstances are favourable, as in Moses' case.
Rem. To choose between the people of God and the pleasures of sin.
J.T. Yes; Moses deliberately made up his mind to abandon a position that was in every way to his advantage as a man in this world.
T.M.G. He might have been a great man in Pharaoh's palace.
J.S.A. It sometimes comes in in a subtle way; some might think they would do better, perhaps, if they remained in favourable circumstances, instead of identifying themselves with the reproach of Christ.
J.T. Yes; and in Moses' case the reproach was regarded in its true light; it was esteemed greater riches than the treasures in Egypt. He esteemed the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt.
Rem. Why is the only alternative to the reproach of Christ, the pleasures of sin?
J.T. There is no middle ground. Young people regard many things in the world as harmless; but they are not really harmless. Any pleasure in connection with the world is sinful.
Rem. I suppose the great aim in the world is to supply pleasure, so that souls may be ensnared. If the pleasure side of the world was eliminated there would not be much to go in for; and whilst certain things may be regarded as innocent pleasures, yet they form part of the world-system, and it is a question therefore as to judging the system. It is not exactly to determine whether this or that is harmless, but to determine to what system it is attached.
T.M.G. What do you understand by the world-system?
J.T. I think the present world-system began with Babel; Genesis 9. It is a system in which the greatness of man necessarily figures; and I think the book of Exodus contemplates that it began directly under wicked influence. Pharaoh was a wicked influence; he was actuated by murderous intent for personal motives; the command to destroy the male children was wicked; and the question is therefore whether
we are enabled to determine what the system is that is under such an influence as that. The king had arisen who "knew not Joseph". Christ is disregarded by the influences that dominate the world.
J.S.A. Are not young people apt to think of the pleasures of sin as something absolutely wicked; but what is sin? It is following my own will; it may be what appears to be quite harmless, but the question is whether it is according to God's order of things.
J.T. The question is, whether it is connected with a lawless system.
T.M.G. The will of man in contrast to the will of God.
Rem. But faith will renounce the whole system, not merely this thing or that thing.
J.T. That is the thought. It was impossible that the children should be overlooked in the world's system, because the enemy made a point of retaining the children. Pharaoh at the outset sought to have the males destroyed; and at the end he would have fain retained the children.
J.S.A. I think that is very important, because it shows how very strongly Satan is working to get hold of the young.
Rem. A single person may have the mind of God.
J.T. A parent is in a better position to judge as to God's mind than any other person, because the interest in the heart of the parent is but a reflection of what is in God's heart, and therefore when you have children, the exercises you get if you are with God are to enable you to realise what God had to endure with man.
Rem. It is most interesting to me to see the way the faith of the parents comes out in Hebrews 11.
J.T. Yes, it is the parents in that chapter: the
Spirit takes account there of the father and mother, whereas the mother only is spoken of in Exodus 2.
Rem. They recognised God's claim or God's intent, for their child; they would not recognise the authority of Pharaoh or the enemy.
J.T. They did not fear it. That is a great point for a parent: "they were not afraid of the king's commandment". (Hebrews 11:23) When you transfer that to Christianity, the point is that all power is vested in the Lord; and it is in the light of that you are not afraid of the king's command.
J.S.A. It is quite within the bounds of possibility that we might reach a crisis when the State would interfere, and it might be a question of choice between the king's command and the Lord.
Rem. They were not afraid of the king's command here; they hid Moses three months.
J.T. The king's command required that the children should be given up. I think what has been called attention to is very important, because as time goes on the ruling powers will come more and more under the influence of evil; the anti-christian spirit is now creeping into the governments that were regarded as the best; and it works out in the claim to educate the children. As claiming title to see after the education of the children you may depend upon it the enemy has something in view. No government will claim today the right to teach the grown-up people. Every man, they say, has the right to his own opinions; that is recognised everywhere; but, then, what about the education of the children?
Rem. I suppose as God's authority is publicly set aside, the power of the authority from beneath would become more marked.
J.T. Exactly; we can be thankful where the power of God is recognised; but then, the enemy is at work, and is gradually introducing principles that
will nullify it. We have to decide whether we will submit to the king's command or the Lord, and I think we can well afford to do the latter, because the Lord has all power. I think we ought to baptise our children in the light of the Lord having a right to them, and power to save them.
J.S.A. It is a good thing to have such a sense of the greatness of Christianity that we impress upon our children the fact that the Lord is greater than all else.
Rem. Will you say a little more about the baptism of our children.
J.T. Well, there are a good many sides to it, but this is one, that the Lord has all power. You have confidence in baptising your children, because you can reckon on His support, and that is a very great point. The apostle says "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house". (Acts 16:31) Now, I think it will be observed, as a rule, that only the first part of that text is used for the preaching of the gospel; the second part is not introduced, whereas the jailer acted upon the second part: he was baptised, he and all his straightway; he rejoiced with all his house, having believed in God. He believed the full gospel.
T.M.G. What is there in Moses being placed in the basket by the riverside?
J.T. Another side of baptism is that you do not accept your child on the ground of nature: on the ground of nature your children are entitled to nothing but death.
Rem. What are we to understand by not accepting our children on the ground of nature?
J.T. You regard them as divinely given, but then God looks for faith in you, and faith recognises distinctly that they can only be accepted on the ground of death.
T.M.G. Is not that the point in Hannah's bringing
her child to Eli and offering the sacrifice? Is there anything of that in the case of Moses being practically delivered to death?
J.T. I think that was the idea; however little the mother may have understood it, God allowed it to take that form, so that we might have spiritual instruction in it; the child was virtually drawn out of death.
Rem. There is evidently much significance in the fact, as his name means drawn out of water.
J.T. Another thing, you introduce your children into the positive system of things; they are baptised to the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. I think it is important to see that you own the Lord's authority and give them up to Him, but they are introduced into the full light of the revelation of God.
Rem. People often refer too much to the negative side and not enough to the positive.
J.T. Look what you have been brought to! In baptising your child you impress upon it that it has been brought into the full light of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
Rem. I suppose if we were more in the true light of it as parents we should impress the child more with it.
Rem. The responsibility rests with the parents as well as the child in connection with baptism.
J.T. I think all the responsibility rests with the parents until the child becomes responsible. It is said of Moses that when he came to years, he refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter. It seems to me that in the case of the Lord in childhood we have indicated the period of responsibility in regard to children. I think that until the age of twelve the Spirit of God holds the parent specially responsible for the child.
Luke gives us the history of the Lord from the outset. What He was as a Babe is recorded, what He was at twelve years old, and then what He was at thirty years. The Spirit records all these things The allusion to twelve has a meaning,
Rem. What would you say Moses gained by turning his back on Pharaoh's court.
J.T. The comment of the Spirit on it shows that he esteemed the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt.
Rem. Would you say he gained very great distinction in God's system?
J.T. Moses deliberately weighed one thing against another, and he chose affliction with God's people.
Rem. I suppose seeing the end really helped him as to his decision: "he endured as seeing him who is invisible". (Hebrews 11:27)
J.T. Yes. I think people may see in Moses on the one hand what baptism involves; it is connected with the parents; it is a question of the faith of the parents, and all the activity that follows. You can understand how exercised his mother must have been, and how God answered her faith in giving him back to her to nurse. On the other hand, when the time came Moses made his decision, and I think then he came into fellowship; that was his decision.
T.M.G. He associated himself with the people of God.
J.T. Yes, that is what fellowship means. It means a deliberate committal of oneself to the people of God.
Ques. Does not the commission of Moses' sister show how God was honouring the parents' faith?
J.T. It all indicates how faith in your parents, or in those who are interested in you, acts for you; children have very little apprehension of the exercises of parent's faith in regard to them.
Ques. Is it not important for young people to
realise the great compensation in being identified with God?
J.T. I think so, and to be identified with the people of God; because you will notice Moses chose rather to suffer affliction with the people, of God; that is simply the Old Testament way of showing how the believer comes into fellowship.
Ques. Would you say at the age of responsibility the question would arise in a child's mind in regard to having to choose for himself; he has arrived at a point when his parents are no longer able to choose for him, and he sees in the Christian circle a place of salvation in contrast to the world?
J.T. Yes, it becomes a question of what kind of society I am going to have. It refers, I think, to the exercises that go on in the soul of the believer. Think of Moses surrounded with all the magnificence of the court of the king: well, he heard about the people of God; he knew about them, and he deliberately commits himself to them.
Ques. Did he not look on to the future? He had respect to the recompense of the reward?
Rem. It is an important point to arrive at when we have to decide whether we will accept the reproach of Christ.
J.T. It is remarkable how intelligent people were in those days with comparatively little light. Moses had an idea of an end in view, and of God's people, being under reproach. Well, the gospel sets out all that to us, so that young believers might see what there is for them now, and what there is in the end.
Rem. The difficulty is that many among the people of God in an outward way have not taken up the reproach, and I suppose they do not get the compensation.
J.S.A. It was not simply the reproach of Christ,
but it was with the people themselves he was identified. In connection with that I was thinking of the New Testament scripture: "Be not thou ashamed of the testimony of our Lord nor of me his prisoner". (2 Timothy 1:8) You have there the two things: you have the reproach, and you identify yourself with the persons who are in the truth.
Rem. That is where the reproach lies.
J.S.A. Suppose a young person says, Well, I accept what you say. The answer is, Very well, then take your place with it.
T.M.G. Onesiphorus was "not ashamed of my chain, but sought me out diligently and found me", (2 Timothy 1:16,17) Paul says.
Rem. I suppose when our children reach what you speak of as the age of responsibility we might look for some confession from them as to their faith in Christ.
J.T. That is what we should expect.
Ques. A good deal depends on the way they are trained, so that they might be prepared for the path?
Ques. And then I suppose they would come more immediately under the Lord's dominion?
J.T. Yes, they are under your dominion up till that time.
J.A.M. They may come to responsibility then, but your responsibility does not cease.
J.T. Their responsibility does not cancel yours.
Rem. Up to that age the Lord's discipline is exercised through the parents, but after that age they would come more immediately under the Lord's discipline.
J.T. Yes; you recognise that the Lord will take charge of the child, and that in due time he will receive the Holy Spirit.
Ques. Would you say it was the Spirit's seal to the faith of the parent
J.T. Well, I do not think the Spirit seals the faith of the parent; there must be faith in the child before the child gets the Spirit.
Rem. The faith of the parent is acknowledged by God: take for instance that verse -- "train up a child the way he should go". (Proverbs 22:6)
J.T. I think so. Every time you think of your child you say that which is born of the flesh is flesh; that is, you are made to feel that, so that if God does not operate in the child there is nothing for Him.
Ques. Abraham said, "Oh, that Ishmael might live before thee". (Genesis 17:18) Is not that the desire that governs every parent?
J.T. Ishmael was the wrong man; he was the man after the flesh. Isaac was the child of promise.
Rem. I suppose we would be very glad indeed if our children were to live before the Lord.
J.T. Oh, but you want them to live in the light of Another. You do not want them to live here in nature; what you cherish for yourself you cherish for your child, and that is, that they should live in the light of Christ. That is the only life worth living.
Ques. Do I understand that it was a want of faith in Abraham when he prayed that?
Rem. Being baptised in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit covers the whole ground.
Rem. Cast out the bond-woman and her son.
T.M.G. When Isaac gets his rightful place Ishmael goes out.
J.T. It is said about Abraham in commendation of him that he commanded his house and his children after him. He ruled his house.
Ques. Do you mean that his character would come out in his true children?
J.T. I think that what Noah failed in comes out
in Abraham. God did not commit government to Abraham, but Abraham recognised that the testimony as to government was there, and he answered to it. I suppose, if we come into fellowship, if we commit ourselves to the reproach of the people of God, that God takes us up and uses us.
Rem. But Moses had to retire; it seemed for a time as if he was not of much use.
J.T. What you see is that if the parent does his part of discipline, God will do the rest. He will see to the discipline of the servant. You cannot send your son to college that he might be made a servant of Christ. God takes him up and makes a servant of him.
Ques. I suppose the education commences early when they come into fellowship.
J.T. I think so; they come to see what the mind of God is; God has a people here, and the children's energies now, if truly identified with them, are bent on the prosperity of that people. You may try to do right things and do them in the wrong way; but Moses had the right idea in slaying the Egyptian.
Ques. When we speak of coming into fellowship do you look at it as the answer really to the Spirit's, work in them?
J.T. Oh, yes; there is a definite decision; the Holy Spirit gives you that. What is it that leads you to love the Lord's people? That is the work of the Spirit.
Rem. I thought it was really the Spirit who brings into fellowship.
J.T. Fellowship is your putting your hand out; you commit yourself to a partnership. No one can bring you in.
Rem. That is important; we cannot bring into fellowship in a sense.
J.T. You cannot bring your children into fellowship. Your responsibility in regard to your children does not come into the assembly at all. It is a great mistake to think that a father should have any responsibility over his children there. The Lord is supreme directly you come into the assembly.
J.S.A. It is a great thing for parents to so understand the greatness of the assembly, that we, by our lives impress on our children, that it is the greatest thing; then it is a question of the Spirit making that good to the child.
J.T. Yes, and the child must remember that he has to put his hand out, so to speak, and identify himself with that position.
Rem. I suppose there comes a moment in the history of every true child of God when he has to choose Christ or the world.
J.T. I think so; and another thing comes in there, that is, what we come to. I fear that it is, in most cases, just coming into the meeting. We come into fellowship, but it is Christian fellowship, or it is nothing. What does that introduce you into? It is that you have to do with a new order of things. The system itself is moral; it is not a system for sight; it is a faith system.
J.T. I think it is; but it is a faith system.
T.M.G. It is not merely what the eye rests on.
T.M.G. You might see the saints and not the place.
J.T. Yes, and the saints may fail, but the system is immutable.
Rem. You might be in fellowship and not break bread.
J.T. I think so, but everyone who has intelligence would break bread. The breaking of bread is the symbol of fellowship.
Rem. The breaking of bread does not bring you into fellowship?
T.M.G. You might be breaking bread and not be In fellowship.
Ques. What qualifies you for fellowship?
J.T. Well, the saints have to decide as to fellowship, because on your coming in whatever may be attached to you is attached to them now; and you should see that consistency with the death of Christ is the test. I would like to dwell upon the faith system because if your soul gets into that nothing can shake you; because that is unshakeable.
J.S.A. I remember a time when placed in certain circumstances I looked to the brethren around me in whom I had confidence, only to be disappointed; and I remember going home one night and saying, Well, can it be worth while going on with them. It was only for a moment, however. The system abides. Nothing else will keep you.
J.T. I think what you see in Moses is, that if you are true, when you come into fellowship, the Lord will take you up. You see that the people of God require help; there never has been a time when they did not. Moses saw that, and he undertook to help them. He did not act according to God's mind, but still the Spirit recognises it in due time. It is remarkable that in Acts 7 He charges the people with rejecting Moses in this connection.
Before Moses learned his lesson, he says, as it were, 'I am going to deliver the people'. He had to learn that God was going to do it, although through him.
T.M.G. Is not that what every servant has to learn?
J.T. A young man is liable to say, 'I am going to do it;' but Moses had to learn that God would deliver His people. God says to him at Horeb, "I am come down to deliver them". (Exodus 3:8)
Ques. What light has a soul as to the Lord in coming into fellowship?
J.T. It would be hard to say. You can hardly say what has drawn you to the people of God, but there is something there that draws you. You see how Ruth was drawn and she said, "thy people shall be my people". (Ruth 1:16)
Rem. That was the outgoing of affection. It would not do to make it merely an outward thing. It would be the activity of affection, no doubt.
J.T. I think it might be noted that the epistle to the Romans does not take us beyond what might be called the ministry of Moses; that is, it agrees with that which the ministry of Moses represents. Moses received his commission at mount Horeb, and what was introduced at mount Horeb may be taken to represent the great end in his ministry; that is, the establishment of the service of God here. The people were to serve God at that mountain; and the end of his ministry was to bring that about. The epistle to the Romans qualifies for it in an individual way. The epistles to the Corinthians, especially the first, show the collective side; but neither of those epistles take us out of the wilderness. I think, that taken together, those epistles contemplate what the ministry of Moses typified. I think it helps us greatly to have the types in view when considering New Testament scriptures.
T.M.G. When you say the service of God, what are we to understand?
J.T. According to Hebrews, our consciences are purged to the end that we might serve the living God. It has reference to our approach to God, and our having to say to Him according to the order that was established in connection with the tabernacle.
Rem. "Let my son go that he may serve me". (Exodus 4:23) "Israel is my son". (Exodus 4:22)
J.T. Yes; that was the message to Pharaoh, not directly to Israel. The message to Pharaoh was, "Let my son go", because the point was to appeal to Pharaoh's heart. They had that place in God's purpose, of course; but they were to serve God at mount Horeb. That was where Moses received his
commission, and I think a man's ministry should rise to the height of his commission. Moses did not take the people into the land, but what he did was to establish an order of service to Jehovah at mount Horeb.
J.McF. Does that correspond with Luke 1:72 - 75: "to perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant; the oath which he sware to our father Abraham, that he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear in holiness and righteousness before him all the days of our life". (Luke 1:72 - 75)
J.T. I think that is a very appropriate scripture to quote in regard to it. It shows the great end God has in view in delivering us. It is a very important thing to connect the ministry of any servant with his commission, and the circumstances under which he receives it.
W.K. "To serve" in Luke 1 has reference to approach to God.
J.T. It is a very great end to have in view, and that it should take place in the wilderness, where things are contrary. Now, Romans 6, I think, corresponds with Marah; that is, the wilderness is definitely accepted in the soul; and there is really no progress until that takes place. The soul bows to the will of God, because the wilderness is the sphere of the divine government. The flesh, in us is not to escape the judgment of God any more than the Egyptians. The bitter waters become sweet as we see that Christ has been into them.
T.M.G. Is that the acceptance of death as our own portion?
J.T. Yes. The waters, as has often been pointed out, being similar to those of the Red Sea, typify death as God's judgment. Christ has been into death on account of what we are, and hence death
is our portion because of the flesh in us. If the bitter waters of Marah are accepted, we are never disappointed at anything: no circumstances or combination of circumstances will disappoint us.
Ques. Is it the acceptance of death here?
J.T. Yes. We may accept the gospel and regard ourselves justified, and still continue to live on in the flesh; the bitter waters are not drunk; but this is not acceptable to God.
Ques. What enables one to accept Marah?
J.T. Well, I think it is seeing the divine end in view. It is not man in the flesh that God intends to bless. The soul is led to see that God intends to conform us to the image of Christ. The foundation of everything that comes in afterwards in our history is really laid in our souls as we receive the gospel, and the gospel is really the presentation of Christ to the soul. So that the Deliverer is presented, and we are to be formed after that order of man.
Rem. And that Man has died and is risen again.
J.T. If Christ is rightly apprehended in your soul you love Him, and you do not wish to be diverted from Him. What is written of Ruth may be applicable to us; she would die where Naomi died.
Rem. You want to be identified with Him, whether in death or in life.
J.T. Yes. Then chapter 7 takes up another chapter in our history; it treats of our relation to the law. Chapter 8 is the brazen serpent and the springing well. Rahab had light, not only as to what represents the resurrection of Christ, but she had light as to the power of the Spirit; she told the spies what the Lord had done to the Egyptians, and what the people had done to the two kings of the Amorites that were on the other side of Jordan, to Sihon and Og.
Ques. What do Sihon and Og stand for?
J.T. Og was a very big man, and he had a very
large bed; it is remarkable that it is recorded of him that his bed was nine cubits long and four cubits wide, and when the Spirit records that, you may depend upon it that it has reference to the kind of man he was; he was slothful, and it is just slothfulness and absence of exercise that hinders us. I have no doubt, that the spiritual apprehension of this chapter enables us to apprehend what is represented by what is recorded. A bed is a place where there is no exercise, Og was a slothful man, and a very big man, and it is only in the power of the Spirit you can overcome that. It is really what we are after the flesh. We have not to go very far to find a big man; doubtless it is what we are in our own eyes after the flesh.
Rem. It takes the power of the Spirit to overthrow such a man.
J.T. Just so; that is how the power of the Spirit is brought into evidence; it is by the overthrow of such a man as that. He would be a man utterly insensible of the rights of others. Conflict with him comes in directly after the springing well is recognised. You come to a point in the history of your soul when you recognise that all power is in the Spirit, so that there is no power in the flesh.
J.McF. Where do you find such a man as Og?
J.T. We have not far to go; you have not to go outside yourself; I mean if you take account of yourself after the flesh.
Rem. Mr. Stoney said he once thought that the flesh was stronger than the Spirit.
J.T. Take a man like Saul of Tarsus; see what he must have been in his own eyes; and the same applies to us all naturally. But Paul says: "no longer live I, but Christ liveth in me;" (Galatians 2:20) there was the overthrow of Og.
Rem. It was Christ that was in evidence; Saul of Tarsus was no longer in evidence.
J.T. Quite so. Oneself is often one's greatest obstacle in advancing spiritually.
Ques. How do you distinguish between this and Canaan?
J.T. The teaching of this chapter refers to Christians as we are in the flesh; but we are in the light of the condemnation of sin in the flesh, and we have the Holy Spirit. Now, that is a divinely given state; it is of God that it should be so; that while here in the flesh we should have God's Spirit, and know that sin is condemned in the flesh, and that we are entitled to the inheritance; that is what I call spiritual territory, but it is short of Canaan.
Ques. That would answer to the plains of Moab?
T.M.G. Canaan is new creation.
W.L. Romans is the solution of the question of man's responsibility; but it does not bring us into the domain of the purpose of God.
J.T. It is a territory for the saints to pass through, but not to live in; it is right so long as you are passing on, but if you live in it you are short of divine purpose; and, as living there, there is nothing to regulate you, because the law at Sinai did not really go beyond the brazen serpent; and the next law that was formulated in Deuteronomy was not intended for the territory on which it was formulated; it was for Canaan, It was given on the plains of Moab, but it was not for that territory. If you live in Moab you have to formulate a code of your own.
Ques. Is it not our great danger, to settle down there?
T.M.G. The two and a half tribes stopped short of the purpose of God for them.
J.T. The plains of Moab as a typical territory represents us as here in the flesh, but as having the Spirit on the ground of the condemnation of
sin in the flesh in the death of Christ. Canaan represents what is entirely spiritual, and is outside flesh and blood conditions,
Rem. In that state there are exercises, and there is movement.
J.T. That is the point; you are free of the flesh, and you move on. But the great danger after the brazen serpent, is the Moabite. Now, the Moabite is an unconverted, or worldly Christian relative. No one is more liable to draw you into the world than an unconverted or worldly relative. The Moabite had a link with Israel after the flesh.
Ques. Would you say here that though you have not reached the purpose of God, you are in the light of it?
J.T. This chapter sets you in the full light of the purpose of God, but not yet in Canaan.
Ques. If there is exercise and movement, you are moving on to it.
J.T. Yes; but, as I said, the danger is the Moabitish influence.
Ques. You would say this is a state that applies to us so long as we are down here; we may go on in our souls to the purpose of God; but this is true of us as men in the flesh.
J.T. You may enter into Canaan in the power of the Spirit on special occasions. This Moab is divinely given territory which we must not surrender, but the point is that it should be influenced from Canaan, and not Canaan influenced from it. The two and a half tribes went over into Canaan from the plains of Moab; but their hearts were in Moab for their families were there.
T.M.G. I suppose that would apply to Christians having the truth and not living in the power of it?
J.T. One who has Canaan in his heart does not in heart live anywhere else; that is his home. But he has to attend to his family duties, and that is
very blessed, too, because it is divinely given territory. As head of your house your Canaan experience gives colour to all that you do. So that, instead of your influencing the assembly from Moab, you influence Moab from the assembly.
Rem. Your affections and interests are all centred in Canaan, and all your relationships here are influenced accordingly.
J.T. But if you have to come to the meeting and attend to assembly, affairs as a matter of duty, and if you are glad when it is over that you may get back to your family, you are living in Moab.
T.M.G. That is what the two and a half tribes did.
J.T. If you go to the meeting simply as a matter of duty, because you have light, and you think you ought to go, and yet you are glad when you are free, and that you can go home; that is living in Moab. I am not disparaging your going for that reason, because it is well that you do go. It was well that the two and a half tribes did go over to fight, but they were really living in Moab. In that case your influence in the assembly cannot be heavenly, and when you go home you want some kind of an outward sign that you belong to the heavenly.
Ques. Is that the altar of Ed, Joshua 22:34?
J.T. Yes. Canaan is the home sphere, so that it is the greatest sphere; the family and business, are minor spheres, though ordained of God, but they are influenced by what you enjoy in Canaan. When the kingdom was established in David and Solomon, they ruled over all that territory, and much more, and that was right; but, then, they lived in Jerusalem.
Rem. The influence in Canaan is the influence of divine Persons.
J.T. Yes; and the dignity of your place with Christ in the heavenlies.
Rem. The point is, do we really take delight in that?
J.T. It should be the chief and constant thought of your heart, because it is there that eternal joys are begun; it is there you touch the eternal order of things -- the heavenly joys.
T.M.G. Mr. Stoney used to say we taste the joys of home before we go home.
J.T. So that Romans 8 opens up wonderful light as to us. It is not the final thought for us; it prepares us for that.
Ques. In what way do you connect what you have touched on with what you said last night in regard to the husband?
J.T. Well, I connect the marriage thought with the covenant. We are to be to another, to Him who is raised from the dead, that we might bring forth fruit to God. God endeavoured to put His thoughts into form with Israel; but when He does a thing the second time He does it permanently. The first is for testing, showing His disposition, that if He could have used Israel He would have done so; that was His disposition. Hence He took up the place of a husband to Israel; there was affection, and He remembered it, Jeremiah 2. He made a covenant with them, and took the place of husband towards them, but the prophets show how far Israel deflected. Hence God has to form new marriage relations, and those relations are in resurrection.
Now, another thought comes up in the following chapter, and that is, that God intended, that certain principles should be maintained in the wilderness in Israel. Moses sums it up in the book of Deuteronomy, saying, "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart". (Deuteronomy 6:5) God intended that that should have taken place in the wilderness; but it fell to the ground. Well, He returns to that thought here in Romans 8; and where it fell to the ground in
connection with the first order, it is secured in the second; the righteous requirements of the law are fulfilled in those who do not walk according to flesh, but according to Spirit.
T.M.G. So that it is really man here according to God.
J.T. And then it must be remembered that this chapter treats of the Spirit. It is a sort of treatise on the Spirit. It affords light as to what the Spirit is to us; and the effect of that is that you are independent of the flesh.
Ques. Why is the Spirit so prominent, and so often mentioned? It is often said the Spirit is never an object.
J.T. It is in this chapter. In chapter 7 you have learned what the flesh is, but you have no power to overcome it. Here you have the power.
Ques. Is it that you turn to the Spirit instead of to the flesh?
J.T. Yes; we turn to the Spirit. But, as I said at the beginning, we must remember that this is the ministry of Moses; that is to say, the well was dug in Numbers 21, "at the direction of the lawgiver". The authority of the Lord is always in evidence in Romans.
T.M.G. Yes, because it is man here, and what man ought to be.
J.T. So that whilst you recognise the Spirit, it is in connection with the Lord. If you read down the chapter you will see that the Spirit supports you in everything; we get there what the Spirit is for the believer.
Ques. In the last verse of chapter 7 it says, "I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh, the law of sin". (Romans 7:25) Is that connected with the brazen serpent aspect; the soul apprehends
Christ Jesus in that way as the One who had put an end to the flesh?
J.T. Yes. The serpent was lifted up upon a pole so that it could be seen; hence it is Christ presented as the Deliverer from the state in which you were. Then the opening verses of chapter 8 introduce the bearing of the brazen serpent. "What the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh". It is the impotency of the law. What it could not do, God did, for sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh.
Ques. You would connect the last verse of chapter 7 with the third verse of chapter 8.
J.T. Quite so. So that after sin is condemned in the flesh, it is something that you need not notice any more. The flesh may suggest many things in you, as it will; as the apostle says here, "it serves the law of sin;" but if God has condemned it, you need not take any notice of it.
Rem. You need not recognise it.
J.T. If God has condemned it you are entitled to condemn it.
Rem. And then you would get the good of the Spirit.
J.T. Quite so. But before the death of Christ you could not take the ground that God had condemned sin in the flesh, because God was owning man in the flesh, and it was in that connection that the flesh had such power. We have very little conception of what the early believers had to suffer from those who had formerly been owned of God.
Ques. Well, then, the flesh is the state; but what about the mind of the flesh?
J.T. That is the energising thing. But many people are greatly harassed in their souls, because they do not take account of the flesh as a condemned thing. You are not under any obligation to it at all;
it is there, but it has no legal claim on you any more; God has condemned it; He has condemned sin in it.
W.L. We are not responsible for what it is, but for what it does.
J.T. This chapter, as I said, is a full statement as to the value of the Holy Spirit indwelling the believer. It is not a question of the Spirit in the assembly exactly, but the Spirit indwelling the believer.
Rem. It is not exactly Isaac having his place, as in Galatians?
J.T. The point here is that you give the Spirit His place, and if you do, Christ will have His place.
Rem. And it is as under the Lord that the Spirit gets His place.
J.T. Whilst you are here in flesh and blood you are always under the authority of the Lord. You could not reach the first part of chapter 7 without the Spirit and the knowledge of the condemnation of sin in the flesh; because the earlier verses of that chapter show the end to be reached; that is, we are to be to Another, even to Him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God. The teaching of chapter 7 requires the Spirit. It has often been pointed out that chapter 7 in its structure is similar to a psalm; that is to say, the end to be reached is stated, and then the road by which it is reached.
Ques. Do you get eternal life here; it says in verse 13, "if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live?"
J.T. I do not think life in this chapter goes beyond what you realise of the Spirit in the wilderness; you do not reach the sphere in this chapter; the earlier chapters indicate there is such a sphere. Eternal life is in Christ; that is outside of the flesh altogether; but then you require power to reach that, and this chapter shows the power. But verse
13 is life in view of righteousness, not eternal life. In John 4 the Spirit leads to everlasting life; whereas the point here is that the thoughts of God which He had given expression to in the wilderness should be maintained in the wilderness by Christians.
Rem. John starts on this ground.
J.T. Yes, and He takes you into Canaan at once; he says, "whosoever believeth on him should not perish but have everlasting life". (John 3:16) That is Canaan. The Son of man was lifted up in order that the believer should not perish but have everlasting life.
T.M.G. I suppose through all this truth of Romans, God would have what He required here on earth?
J.T. That is the idea exactly. It is the testimony to every thought of God as regards the earth; that is the epistle to the Romans.
I think the service of God underlies chapter 7; the covenant is there. But the first epistle to the Corinthians runs parallel to this as to the company. It is the individual side here. The epistle to the Romans treats of the individual believer in his relations with God, and everything is adjusted; but then there is a parallel truth in Corinthians which contemplates, not individual believers, but the saints viewed as the assembly. With this the Supper is connected; it is connected with the service of God. It contemplates that in which our wills are set aside.
T.M.G. I think that distinction is very interesting.
J.T. Corinthians, contemplates the assembly of God as distinct from Jew and Gentile: it is not the assembly in Canaan as in Colossians and Ephesians.
John 6:26 - 71
J.T. It is important, that we should see that food is essential to entering into eternal life. The moral constitution has to be built up and sustained, and the food that will do this is supplied here. What man is naturally, as God's creature, suggests what he is spiritually. God having opened up His mind as to man in the third chapter of John, the following chapters are intended to meet him in the varied elements (so to speak) of his constitution. Man has affections. John 4, I think, meets that side; the affections are taken account of. Men had ample opportunity to satisfy themselves in the world if there, were satisfaction to be found there. The woman of Samaria shows that there was no satisfaction there; and hence the Lord proposes that which would satisfy permanently, for the living water would become a fountain within her springing up into everlasting life. Then, I think, chapter 5 sets forth man's weakness, and the weakness of the law in meeting his need. So that that chapter shows us the power, side; and also it opens up the sphere of life; the believer is passed from death into life. But such an one requires spiritual food, and chapter 6 supplies this. The question raised is as to what we feed upon, so as to have eternal life as an enjoyed blessing now.
Ques. Does chapter 6 contemplate the wilderness?
J.T. Yes, it contemplates wilderness conditions, but the thought is that we might pass out of wilderness conditions, and for that, food is essential. So the subject is opened up in this way. The crowd really followed Him because of the loaves and fishes. It was a question of food; hence the Lord says,
"Labour not for the meat which perishes, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life; which the Son of man shall give unto you". Bear in mind that the Lord adds at the close, "the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit and they are life". We have to be prepared for spiritual thoughts in a very exalted degree in this chapter.
Rem. There is a peculiar significance in the fact that the Father has set His seal on this One.
J.T. I think so. He is sealed here in view of giving "the food which abides unto life eternal"; (John 6:27)
Rem. That is very important to have in mind, that the divine seal was upon that blessed One who in His humiliation was to become the food to sustain the life of His people.
Ques. Is this food in contrast to the manna?
J.T. Yes, it is. Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness and are dead, but here is food that you eat and you live. There is a remarkable similarity, however, in one respect between the manna and this food, in that both come down from heaven; but the manna was for sustenance for the wilderness; this food is for sustenance for eternal life.
Ques. I would like something to be said with regard to the way John introduces the brazen serpent here as in view of Canaan; What is the distinction, or what does Canaan convey to your mind? If eternal life is not for heaven, what does Canaan convey to your mind?
J.T. Well, it has, on the one hand, reference to the entire sphere to which the purpose of God applies, and according to the book of Joshua and the epistle to the Ephesians, that would include heaven or the heavenlies; but whilst the heavenly side is necessarily the greatest, Canaan also includes the whole millennial order of things. On the other hand, it has reference to a spiritual order of things existing during the
Christian period, and that for the moment is the most important. Types have more reference to the present time than they have to the world to come; they are more intended to show how we as believers now enter into the good of divine things. So that Canaan, in that sense, would be the spiritual sphere which lies outside of the conditions established in connection with man in flesh and blood. It is a sphere and order of things wholly spiritual, and really lies outside of the distinctions that belong to us as in the flesh. Eternal life is also really outside of the relationships which belong to us here as in flesh and blood. It is practically enjoyed in the circle of the saints viewed as born of God.
Ques. But that spiritual order belongs to the present?
J.T. Yes. It is a spiritual order of things into which we enter, and it is outside the relationships we stand in here, but it has an influence upon those relationships, and gives character to them.
Ques. Is that what was meant when it was said that it was an out-of-the-world order of things?
Ques. Do you mean that Canaan would typify fully the sphere of heavenly blessing and eternal life? What is the distinction between the sphere of eternal life?
J.T. Well, it has been well described as being indicated in the Lord's sojourn here between His resurrection, and ascension. That was an out-of-the- world condition of things.
Ques. You refer to the forty days?
J.T. Yes. The Lord was outside the sphere of the world clearly; "the world sees me no more" (and neither did it), "but ye see me". (John 14:9) Now, I think that in some sense conveys the idea of the platform, so to speak, on which eternal life stands; it is outside of the world, and necessitates resurrection.
But this chapter shows that it does not necessarily refer to the time when we shall be raised literally. The Lord says, "He that eats my flesh and drinks my blood has life eternal, and I will raise him up at the last day", (John 6:54). So that the chapter contemplates eternal life now.
Ques. He gives it now in a spiritual way?
J.T. Yes. I think it is very important to remember that Christianity is established as a provisional state of things. It is not final; nor is it a perfect state of things. It is a provisional state of things pending the coming of the Lord, when we shall have the final state of things.
Ques. How would you distinguish between the thought of eternal life and the purely heavenly state of things?
J.T. I was thinking only today, that if you take the most exalted personage in the land, there is one thing in which he is on a common platform with everybody, the lowest as well as the highest, and that one thing is life. In order that this should be sustained he has to eat, sleep, etc. But then, whilst he is compelled to do certain things in common with everybody else, his exalted rank, and all that goes with it, necessarily give character to every detail that he has in common with all others. Well now that is how I understand the manner in which we have what is common to every family that comes into the blessing of God. Whether in the present age or coming age, all have eternal life. This is undeniable. But we have something more excellent than they; we have a heavenly place in Christ, which is peculiar to ourselves, and that is what we boast in specially, and therefore this gives character in us to what we may have in common with all others. The dignity of the position, and the relationship that goes with the position, tend to give colour to what we enjoy in common with all other families.
Rem. Then if such an exalted privilege is ours, our walk, in every detail, should be affected by it.
J.T. Quite so. You remember that when the Israelites passed over Jordan, twelve stones were taken out of Jordan and placed in Gilgal. Those twelve stones represented the twelve tribes, but in the subsequent development of things, the tribe of Levi was taken apart from the other twelve and given an inheritance. They had the Lord God of Israel, they were to dwell in cities, and they had the priesthood and the offerings as their inheritance. Typically they had a heavenly position in contrast to the others. But they were on common ground. There was something they had in common with all the other tribes at Gilgal; they were represented in the twelve stones. Now, I think that indicates our portion; that whilst abstractly you must place eternal life by itself, and think of it by itself, yet when you come to the entrance into it, it is enjoyed along with the relationships that are special to us, and these relationships, being greater, must give character to the lesser.
Ques. You are referring to sonship?
J.T. Yes, and our position in the heavenlies. If the king entered into the poorest house in the realm, he would carry into it his kingly dignity. I would use that as illustrating eternal life, but only to show that there is something really greater, although depending on it; for obviously everything depends on life; and that greater thing gives character to all we enjoy, whatever it be. But in one sense nothing can be morally greater than eternal life, for the introduction of it where death had been is the great triumph of God. Besides, in Psalm 133, it is specially called "the blessing". Romans 6:23, reads: "the act of favour of God, eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord". (Romans 6:23)
Rem. It is helpful to see that eternal life is God's
thought for every family, but then there is the special place, and you connect that with sonship.
Ques. The heavenlies are in heaven?
J.T. Well, the heavenlies in Scripture are more the sphere of rule and light, but they include "the third heaven", which would he the most exalted. The assembly comes down from God out of heaven.
Ques. Will you explain what you mean by Christianity being provisional?
J.T. Well, it is an order of things established here by God in view of the maintenance of the testimony until the coming of the Lord. It is not the final state of things.
Rem. It fills up the interval between the rejection of Christ and His appearing, but He takes His seat on the Father's throne now. The house of God is a provisional thing here, whereas the Father's house is a permanent thing.
Ques. I suppose what is effected in us during the present time is everlasting?
J.T. The work of God in our souls is abiding; and we have access to what is eternal. Eternal life is eternal, and we have access to it by the power of the Spirit. In one sense we may say it is within the reach of the spiritual. The apostle Paul entered into it a great deal more than we do; but with all that the present conditions are provisional.
Ques. I suppose when what is final and perfect is come, there will be no need for testimony?
J.T. Quite so; the tabernacle, in one respect, contemplated a provisional state of things, it was movable. The temple indicates a permanent state of things.
Ques. Do you consider eternal life as heavenly life?
J.T. Well, you have to take account of it by itself, because the blessing is enjoyed in your soul at the same time as you enjoyed the special relationships
with the Father and the Son in which we are set. Eternal life in our souls has reference to our knowledge of the true God; of God revealed here in Christ, and of the Man who came out here to do God's will. The moral thought underlying John 17:3 is of immense importance to lay hold of.
Rem. "God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life". (John 3:16) God is presented to the soul in His love.
J.T. God is to be rightly apprehended in man's soul, and the result is to be that men turn from idols to serve the living and true God, and wait for His Son from heaven. What a great thing it is to have in your soul light as to the true God in the midst of an idolatrous world!
Rem. I am afraid we are very defective as to the revelation of the true God.
Ques. "As the living Father has sent me, and I live by the Father;" is that the key to the thought?
J.T. One word in John's writings that helps us in the understanding of his gospel is the word sent.
Ques. Do you mean to convey by that that the Lord was here as man?
J.T. Yes, in a world where all is lawless He was here carrying out God's will, and in that position the idea of God is brought to man. He has revealed God to us. But then He is also the eternal life. That is what He was as man before God.
Ques. I suppose if we had been brought up in the midst of idolatry we should have understood the knowledge of the true God better?
J.T. I think that is important. We have not seen the moral thought in the true God and the true Man, but if you do see it, it is a safeguard in the midst of the world; it keeps you. Take Psalm 119; only fully seen in Christ, but it gives us the experience of a man who has learned to love the law. The whole
of the Psalm is, devoted to the expression of the exercises of a man who has learned to love God's law; and when that point is reached in the soul then you can go up: so the songs of degrees follow. It is morally due to God that His will should be carried out down here where He has been dishonoured.
Rem. I have been struck with that word sent in the gospel of John, which you emphasise.
J.T. The force of it really is that the Lord was here carrying out the will of God. He was sent by God. He loved the law, but then when you come to the gospel of John it goes far beyond that, because it meant the carrying out of the divine purpose. John says, the Father sent the Son that we might live through Him.
Ques. "He whom God has sent speaks the words of God", (John 3:34). How do you understand that?
J.T. It is the idea of apostleship. Apostleship is that the person has been with God, and as with Him he is sent out to communicate God's mind. The Lord was that in an infinite way; He spoke only the words of God.
Rem. What you have said makes that very clear: "He gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting", (John 12:49).
J.T. Yes, that is very beautiful; that is His last word to the Jews. I think that passage opens up the point of the gospel very largely; that is, as taken in connection with what the apostle says at the end of chapter 20, "these are written ... that believing ye might have life through his name". (John 20:31)
What has been suggested already is important to take account of; that He was sealed as Son of man; "him hath God the Father sealed". There was one marked off by the Spirit to give food to the world. Joseph was the preserver of life in the world. Now, the Lord is here sealed by God for
that purpose, so that the world, instead of remaining under death, might live; hence the point of view is very wide. It is not the life of the saints simply, it is the life of the world.
Rem. He is spoken of here as the bread of life and the bread of God.
J.T. Another point in the chapter to recognise is that the Lord emphasises that He came down from heaven. There is a similarity in that respect, in regard to the manna, for both came from heaven. "Man did eat angels' food", (Psalm 78:25); the food of those who are marked by obedience. It is a food that gives you a constitution which enables you to carry out God's will in the wilderness. But the bread here in John 6 is to enable us to enter into eternal life, but this food has to be appropriated. The Lord has opened up the position, and He gave His flesh for the life of the world. The title to eternal life has been made good for man, and the bread provided; but all has to be appropriated. This is our side.
Ques. So that although eternal life is for the world, only those who eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink His blood have it?
J.T. It is limited to those who appropriate it, although available for all.
Rem. I suppose John 6:53 makes that plain: "Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you".
Rem. This bread would not be applicable to the time to come.
J.T. No; it is in view of the scene of death. It contemplates that we are in the scene of death, and that the only way out of it into life is by eating this bread.
Rem. It gives us the moral constitution of an overcomer.
J.T. It gives power to pass out of the natural
into the spiritual. It is all very well to have the light of eternal life, but it requires power to pass over into it, and the eating of this food gives you strength. Often it has been pointed out, that there are two tenses of the verb to eat in verses 53 and 54: that is, the past and the present. "Eats", verse 54, is present and continuous.
Rem. "I will raise him up at the last day". I always think of this chapter when one of the saints dies. You have the comforting thought that the last day is the last day, and the Lord will raise you up then. It shows how the Lord has charged Himself as to us. The Father has given us to Him, and He takes charge of us to the very end.
Ques. What about the drinking?
J.T. Well, it is an allusion to what man requires for sustenance.
Rem. "He that eats my flesh and drinks my blood dwells in me and I in him", (John 6:56)
J.T. I think that means the soul's appropriation of the Lord's death in its full bearing. It involves the end of what I am as a man born after the flesh.
Ques. Has the Spirit of God any place in connection with this appropriation?
J.T. The Spirit underlies all the teaching from chapter 4. The Spirit enables us to go down.
Ques. In what way? Would the Spirit keep Christ before your soul as that on which you feed?
J.T. We are in a world where everybody is seeking to get up.
Rem. That is the tendency at the present time, and we are affected by it.
J.T. Yes, it is the spirit of the world to get to the top of the ladder. That is where the test comes; the Lord was going down. He never exalted Himself. "The bread of God is he who comes down out of heaven" (John 6:33)
Ques. How many of us really wish to diminish,
to become less to play the losing game in this present world?
Rem. If this is not our food it is impossible for us to take such a course.
J.T. Under God's government we may prosper in things here; but the danger is of living in our prosperity. Of course, we have to live in righteousness in the world and "provide things honest", and all that; but the question is where one lives, and what are one's hopes and aspirations? What do we regard as life? "If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him". (1 John 2:15) You see here that the Lord is going down, and He loses every advantage that a man could have in this world. That is a test for us if we are eating that food.
Ques. Is the thought of growth here?
J.T. I think this food is that by which we grow; and growth in Christianity signifies that you are more lowly, more simple, and you have more affection. That was what Christ was here. The gospels present to us what Christ was here; a Man among men; now, that is the divine thought; and God will never recede from it. That is what He looks for from believers in Christ.
Rem. Colossians speaks of kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, long-suffering. The saints were to put on these.
J.T. If you do not feed on Christ you are afraid of death; the wise man sees the evil and hides himself. What I understand by hiding yourself is, that you feed on Christ, you accept His death, and therefore you are prepared for the evil. If dissolution overtakes you, you have already anticipated it.
Ques. Have not the affections a great part in all this appropriation?
J.T. Surely. Christ has gone over before you.
Rem. I suppose chapter 4 established the capacity for the enjoyment of it?
J.T. I think so, and then chapter 5 is power, lifting man outside the legal system.
Ques. Will you say a little on chapter 10? "I give unto them eternal life". (John 10:28) In what way does He give eternal life?
J.T. There it is collective. It is to the flock. Eternal life was in God's mind for Israel, and it was made available for them in Christ; but they would not come to Him that they might have it. But the thought did not lapse, hence it was given to the sheep. The flock, given to Christ by the Father has it now instead of the nation. God granted to the Gentiles repentance unto life; and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed. Thus the blessing is now connected with the flock, composed of Jews and Gentiles. In chapter 7 we have the feast of tabernacles, and this is superseded by Christianity; that is, a glorified Christ, and believers on Him indwelt by the Holy Spirit here on earth. Then, in chapter 8, there is the thought of following Christ, as the Light of the world, and this is exemplified in chapter 9. This leads up to the flock in chapter 10, with whom, in a collective way, eternal life is connected.
Exodus 33:12 - 23
J.T. In suggesting this scripture my thought was that it answers to our brother's wish -- the consideration of the divine way as leading to the glory. God's way is in the sanctuary, and His way is in the sea; and I thought we might see from this section of Scripture, that is, beginning from chapter 20, that evidently His way is with the object in view of taking His people out of this world, and establishing them in connection with another system of things; that is the great end that God has before Him.
Rem. It is God's delight to have His people near Him; to gather them around Himself.
J.S.A. What is in view here is that He is carrying them up from where they were to the point where He would have them to be.
J.T. And He says, "My presence shall go with thee, and I will give thee rest". It is a great thing to see that God begins in the securing of what is for His pleasure. In chapter 20 He asserts His rights. It is clear that unless God's rights are owned the thought of God's people moving out of this world, and being suited to God's world, cannot be brought in.
Ques. How would you describe His righteousness coming out in chapter 20?
J.T. Well, I think the law is the principle of it. It is the assertion of God's rights over us; these must be recognised. I think, when it is recognised then you have the unfolding of the divine way. God's divine way is in the sanctuary; and the sanctuary is unfolded in chapter 25.
Rem. You say the rights of God have to be first acknowledged.
J.T. I think so. Apart from that you never get any light.
W.K. What do you mean by the rights of God?
J.T. Well, He has a right to man's affections. "Thou shalt love the Lord with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength; and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself", (Luke 10:27). I think God delights in seeing the saints loving one another. It seems to me that if these things were recognised there would sure to be light. God's way is made clear.
W.K. Yes; by God's rights you mean what is due or becoming to render to Him.
J.T. Yes. God was never fully recognised in His rights until Christ became Man. The law was never really answered to until Christ became Man; and He not only recognised the law, but He magnified it and made it honourable..
J.S.A. God never gave up His rights, though He was denied them until the Lord came.
J.T. I think it is consequent upon that we have the opening up of the divine secret. It is evident, that God must be recognised in man before He begins to unfold what is in His mind. There must be the full answer in man to what is of God. Christ answers to all that; He answers to the tabernacle.
Ques. You referred to two passages in Psalm 77, "Thy way, O God, is in the sanctuary;" (Psalm 77:13) and, "Thy way is in the sea". (Psalm 77:19) What does the first of these convey to us?
J.T. The first conveys to my mind what was communicated to Moses on the mount. Every divine thought was to find its fulfilment in Christ. But I think that before that takes place there was in Christ a full answer to what man should be for God. The Lord becomes Man; takes up everything due to God, and recognises it.
Ques. Would you say that what is set forth in
the type of Exodus is really the unfolding of what Christ is as Man?
J.T. If you have a Man who answers in every way to God's requirements, God has His Vessel. We know that Christ was the divine Vessel. If you have God's will answered to in every way here, you have the ark of the covenant.
J.S.A. Until you have the perfect answer in Christ to what God looks for in man, you cannot have the gospel in its full sense. You must have the Man that answers to God before you can have God's thought about man.
Ques. Would you say here that God proposes to go on with Moses after the breakdown, really on the ground of what is set forth in Christ?
J.T. Yes. We get the idea of the Mediator prior to this. Moses says, "Peradventure I shall make an atonement for your sin", (Exodus 32:30) but we know he could not. Directly Christ becomes Man, God reveals His thoughts, and goes back to the beginning, what man should be first, what Adam should have been and then what Israel should be; all that must come before you could have the unfolding of God's thoughts to man.
Rem. It really needed Christ to come in, in that way, for God.
J.T. Yes; then Christ becomes the Vessel. God has His Vessel, so to speak; and having Christ, then all His thoughts become unfolded. I think the tabernacle is the unfolding in type of what God had in His mind for man. So that "Thy way is in the sanctuary" necessitates our inquiry as to all that is in the sanctuary, or the tabernacle.
J.S.A. I was thinking only this morning in reference to what you have just said, of the beginning of Hebrews 9, where, you get a list of the things seen in the holiest of all; they really referred to God's ways in bringing the people along; the manna, and
the rod; they were there for God; He saw Christ in them.
I think, referring to what you were saying just now, that it would be impossible for God to make any complete revelation of His testimony until there was a complete answer to what God was. He could not set it forth completely in testimony. It might be figurative, but not complete; and therefore it is of immense importance to see what Christ was here for God.
J.T. Think of such a scripture as this; He was "heard because of his piety!" (Hebrews 5:7)
Ques. How do you understand that?
J.T. He was heard on the ground of what He was as Man, and thus He was a pattern of the order of man that is pleasing to God.
Rem. "I knew that thou hearest me always", (John 11:42) and "I do always those things that please him", (John 8:29)
Rem. "He that doeth these things shall live by them". (Romans 10:5) That was only true of the Lord, but it was true of Him.
J.T. Then you have the unfolding of the mind of God, that all must be effected through death. So the Lord goes up to the mount of transfiguration, and there the idea of the tabernacle was suggested. Peter thought of three tabernacles, but the cloud overshadowed them and the voice said, "This is my beloved Son, hear him". (Luke 9:35) Now, Moses and Elias were there, and what they were speaking of was not what Moses had been hearing on mount Sinai. What they were speaking of was the means of accomplishing that, of effectuating it; that was His death. The mind of God was unfolded in the sanctuary, but how was that to be effectuated? What Moses and Elias were occupied with on the mount of glory was how it was to be effectuated; and that was by His decease. The Lord went down from the mount of
transfiguration to die, so that it all might be effectuated.
Rem. All that God was is declared in Christ now?
J.T. I think so. He went down to Jerusalem to die. They spake of His decease which He should accomplish at Jerusalem.
Rem. So that now it is not the same with us as it was with Moses; Moses only saw God's back parts.
J.T. Quite so; and that leads on to what I was speaking of as to the glory. We see the way that we shall reach the glory. The Lord went down! they marvelled, they wondered at Him; even His disciples wondered to see the deliberation with which He went down to die. If you follow that way in your soul you reach the glory; because that is the way the Lord went to glory.
J.S.A. Will you explain a little more what it is to reach the glory. Do you mean to reach it in our souls?
J.T. I was thinking of Stephen; he saw into glory. The Lord's footsteps were there and Stephen followed after the Lord, and the result is, he says, "I see the glory of God".
S.L. "Thy way is in the sea". (Psalm 77:19) Is that His death?
J.T. Yes, I think so. His path is in great waters; and I think Stephen went there; Stephen followed the Lord's footsteps.
Ques. Would you say that means that we must accept death for ourselves here, and in going that way morally we reach the glory?
J.T. Yes; and Stephen sees the glory of God in the face of Jesus. The question is, Who appreciates the glory? Only the man who accepts the will of God here.
Ques. In accepting the will of God do you mean
really accepting the One who has established the right to live here, and who has gone into death?
J.T. Yes; the apostle Paul says, "always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus"; (2 Corinthians 4:10) that is, the dying of that Man. He had been speaking of the glory, and he says he saw in it the face of Jesus; these were his thoughts, and then he says, "always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus". (2 Corinthians 4:10)
J.S.A. Would you say that you get His way in the Supper?
J.T. I think so. The bread is the symbol of the Lord's body. I never think of it thus without introducing into it the idea of God's will. He said, "Lo, I come to do thy will", (Hebrews 10:9) and "a body hast thou prepared me". (Hebrews 10:5) I do not see that the Supper could be enjoyed apart from that. The Lord's body is that in which God's will was carried out. Well, He died in that body,
Rem. It is a wonderful thought that the body of the believer can be presented as a living sacrifice. He carried out God's will here; and our bodies ought to be for the will of God too.
J.T. If that is so, there is room for the Spirit. The body of Christ is that in which you have the reproduction of Christ, and the idea of that reproduction is that there is that here which answers to God's mind.
Ques. Do we come into that here practically?
J.T. I think it is a great thing to accept it. I was thinking this morning that if you recognise the light you make room for the Spirit. Disregard your own feelings altogether; recognise the light. If you accept that as a principle, the next question is; are you going to be controlled by the light? If you are, you disallow your own will. We are one bread, for we are all made partakers of the same loaf.
Rem. It is not submission in a legal way; it is through the affections.
J.T. I think it is a great thing to recognise the light that is intended to govern any given position. If we recognise the light there is room made for the Spirit.
Ques. Does not light come to us in the gospel?.
Rem. God is light. If Christ is the revelation, if He is light and the light is the life of men, is not that the unfolding of what God is? The knowledge of God is light.
J.T. Yes, quite so. God was, so to say, placed under a necessity of removing lawlessness, and what gave the Lord peculiar pleasure was, that on the cross He removed the lawless man.
Ques. By the lawless man you mean the man who does his own will instead of the will of God.
J.T. Yes; "Lo, I come to do thy will". (Hebrews 10:9) There was not another to do it. "Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven". (Matthew 6:10) There was a Man here answering to God's will; and that Man removes the lawless man.
J.S.A. Mr. Raven made a very striking remark: he said, The lake of fire was a proof of the love of God. It means just that God being what He is. He must remove everything that is contrary to Himself.
Rem. The obedient Man comes in to remove the lawless man.
J.T. Therefore the lawless man cast out the only law-abiding Man that ever was on the earth. On the other hand, the Lord removed the lawless man vicariously. It was peculiarly delightful to Him that He was removing that which had so much grieved the heart of God.
J.S.A. It is not only the exposing of the lawless man, but the removal of him.
Rem. The Lord delighted to do God's will.
J.T. I think the body of Christ here is the answer to that. That Man is to be reproduced, and hence the bread in the Lord's supper represents the body of the Lord on the one hand, and on the other hand it is a symbol of our unity.
J.McF. This is certainly on a line with what was expressed at the beginning; that we should, in our affections, leave this world, and so to speak, enter into the blessedness of another world of which Christ is the centre, another order of things.
J.T. There has to be a recognition of the will of God before there is any movement on God's part. I think Saul of Tarsus represents the biggest man here on earth; in him there was the embodiment of the will of man acting against the will of God in testimony. God had been dealing patiently with Jerusalem, offering to send Christ back to them; but they refused this; and the Lord appears to Saul. Saul recognises Him, and he says, "Lord, what wilt thou have me do?" (Acts 9:6) There is the recognition of the Lord, and I think that necessarily preceded the new movement.
Ques. Did not God move in reaching Saul of Tarsus?
J.T. But there was no movement of the testimony until that man's will was broken. In a sense Saul represented the nation. They will be dealt with in the future as Saul was. Compare 1 Timothy 1:12 - 16.
Ques. Was it not indicated, that there was to be a movement of the testimony in what the Lord said to Saul, that he was to be a witness unto all men of what he had seen and heard.
Rem. One has to recognise the rights of God; and if you recognise the rights of God, then you are reckoned righteous.
J.S.A. Someone used to call them the primary
rights of God; and until they are acknowledged nothing can be right in you.
Ques. What is meant by "He that hath an ear let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches"? (Revelation 2:7)
J.T. I think on the one hand there is the Lord's authority; that is, He sent the messages to the churches; of necessity they carried with them the authority of the Lord. But then there was also what the Spirit said to the churches.
Ques. Is the testimony connected with The kingdom aspect of things?
J.T. I think the kingdom effects it; but the testimony involves all that is in God's mind.
J.S.A. The testimony really, as I understand it, is connected with the fulfilment of God's purpose.
J.T. Moses said, "show me thy glory", (Exodus 33:18) I think it is a wonderful desire to have, to see the glory.
Ques. What do you understand by "thy glory"?
J.T. I think Christ is the glory of God. Think of Christ as He is now before God! What shining of moral glory there is in Jesus!
Ques. What prompted Moses to ask that?
J.T. I think it was a very right desire. In the presence of the broken law, in the presence of the golden calf, where could the glory of God shine? It refers to the way God accomplishes His purpose. Moses saw it on the mount of transfiguration. Christ was going into death to carry out the will of God.
Ques. What do you mean by moral glory?
J.T. It is every attribute in God's nature and character being absolutely answered to; it has the full answer in Christ.
Rem. In Christ you have both the display and the response.
J.T. I think Christ is the glory of God. All that God is, found its answer there.
W.K. Yes, it shines forth there.
J.T. The psalmist says, "The heavens declare the glory of God;" (Psalm 19:1) he saw there perfect order; there was nothing to interfere with the will of God. Well, what is in Christ is that brought down to earth. There is one Man in whom every thought of God is centred; and that Man goes up there. So Stephen "saw the, glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God". (Acts 7:55)
In the next great rebellion of Israel the Lord says, "all the earth shall be filled with the glory of the Lord;" (Numbers 14:21) that is, that where the lawlessness of man was so manifested. His glory should be displayed. I think Moses would delight in that thought. In the next chapter, Numbers 15, you have the burnt offering. It is very encouraging to see that in the presence of the rebellion of the people, God introduces the burnt offering; and the heavenly colour -- "the ribband of blue;" showing how He accomplishes His thoughts in Christ.
Hebrews 13:10 - 16; Exodus 20:24 - 26
My thought is to call attention, to the position becoming to those who love Christ at the present moment. Our position is determined by the position of Christ. Our love to Christ is tested practically by whether we are willing to respond to His movements; our love is continually put to the test by His movements. The movements of the Lord bring out whether we are loyal to Him in every respect, whether we are willing to be in correspondence to Him in every move.
Ruth was tested by the movements of Naomi, but she refused to return from following her. She would be in correspondence to Naomi whatever the circumstances might be. She says to Naomi, "Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God: where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried". (Ruth 1:16,17) Now, as I understand it, genuine affection for Christ leads to complete correspondence to Christ whatever the circumstances may be. Our circumstances are such as put love to the test, as to whether it is Christ who is paramount with us or not. It is for this reason I desired to call attention to our position at the present time as determined by the position of Christ.
It is a very blessed thing, on the one hand, to know that God has determined our position in connection with His eternal purposes; it is all of God; we have had nothing to do with that. God has not allowed that to be left in our hands at all; it -is all of His eternal, sovereign decision. He has
determined, our position according to His eternal counsels, and He has determined it in relation to and in correspondence to Christ's position. It is a matter of His love, of course, but more important still, it is a question of His wisdom. Love is the spring of all with God, but wisdom is the handmaid of His love; so that in determining our position God has acted in wisdom as well as in love. Then, if God has acted in wisdom and love, He has acted rightly; all that God wills is infinitely right. God has given the assembly the most wonderful place conceivable, and that place, as determined by His wisdom, is infinitely right.
So it is a matter of God's wisdom, to have given us the place He has given us in His purpose in correspondence to Christ; and whatever He has done is done in love, but also in wisdom, and it is entirely right. If He has determined the place of the assembly as that which is to be united to Christ, as the companion of Christ in heavenly glory, it is right that it should be so, and right in God's sight. It has been determined in the wisdom of God that we should be the companions of Christ in heavenly glory, and that is according to His eternal purpose. If it had been left to men to choose their own portion, many believers might have preferred the millennial state of things for themselves. They might have preferred to have their portion on the renewed earth, with the pressure of death removed from their spirits, and surrounded with every blessing that earth could afford. But God has reserved some better things for us, beloved, in His wisdom, and because of His great love wherewith He loved us, He "even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ (by grace ye are saved), and hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: that in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches
of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus". (Ephesians 2:5 - 7)
God has a purpose in giving us this place of elevation, and it is right that we should have it; it is according to His wisdom and according to His love that we should be the companions of Christ for ever in heavenly glory. He has taken us into favour in the Beloved; it does not even say who the Beloved is, as if to show the unique place that Christ has in the affections of the Father.
Then another point is, God has power to do everything He pleases. Love is His motive spring, and wisdom is the agent of His love, but God has also power to effect every counsel of His will. In Ephesians everything is on the ground of excess; it is according to the exceeding greatness of His power, "which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places". (Ephesians 1:20) God has raised Him from the dead and set Him there according to the greatness of His power. The sense of this mighty power is so set before the soul of the apostle, that when he comes to speak of that power being towards us, he speaks of the purpose of God as already accomplished. What a solid basis we are on when we come to speak of the eternal purpose of God! It is outside of us; it is all of His mighty power.
But when we come to speak of our position in this world, that, is an entirely different matter; we have something to do with that. When the Lord came down to this earth He became the great regulator of everything; like the sun in the heavens, He became the controller of everything. He came into the midst of a world of lawlessness and departure from God, and He answered perfectly to God in every way. Every thought of God found an answer in Christ here as Man. That was not in heaven, but it was here. The great idea in testimony is to
bring out what is heavenly and to show its superiority over what is here. Christ is the ark of the testimony, and Moses got the light as to the ark on the mount; there was no contrariety up there; all was according to God there; and he received the tables of the testimony there. But Moses came down from the mount, and he brought with him the tables of the covenant; they were the record of the rights of God; they were the rights of God put into writing, but things had altered in the camp; a great change had come into the camp during the absence of Moses. Moses drew near to it, and he heard a sound of singing; there was a noise going up from the camp; the spirit of idolatry had laid hold of the camp. Now what will Moses do?
Moses had no power to bring that writing into the camp; there was no ark there to receive it, and he broke the tables there at the foot of the mount. It was his acknowledgment that he had no power to bring the tables of the covenant into the camp. Now think of Christ! What was it for Him to come into a scene like that; to come into a scene of lawlessness and idolatry, and to hold everything intact for God? What was it for Him to maintain everything for God; to maintain the law, and more, to magnify the law and make it honourable? He brought the law into the camp, and made it honourable there. That was the position of Christ here; in the midst of men the will of God was maintained intact, nothing was let go.
Now everything must be regulated by that; God's will has been perfectly expressed here among men, and the expression of that will here in a Man drew out every possible evidence of the hatred of men. Man -- the world, hates the expression of God's will; and the Lord Jesus met with opposition at every step of His path, but He maintained the divine will in every circumstance; He is the ark of the
covenant here. The ark of the covenant adjusts everything. Moses could not maintain the law in the face of what was there, he had to break the tables of the covenant; but the law is within the heart of Christ. Christ as Man here was the expression of God. Of course, He was "over all, God blessed forever", but I speak of Him as a Man here, and that Man was the perfect expression of the divine nature; there was the perfect answer to the will of God in a Man. Think of the moral power necessary in order that a Man should hold the position for God here, in the face of the opposition of the world and of men! Think of what it meant for Him to be here entirely for the will of God, and answering to God at every step of His path! But since that has been so, the ark of the covenant -- Christ in that character -- must regulate everything; He adjusts everything: we must follow the ark.
Moses took the tabernacle and pitched it afar off from the camp; that was a wonderful thing, a solemn thing for a man to do. Moses was a man of faith, and he acted for God, and when lawlessness and idolatry have come into the camp, he takes the tabernacle and pitches it without the camp, afar off from the camp. Now God honoured Moses in that act, and the cloudy pillar came down and stood at the door of the tabernacle, and Jehovah talked with Moses. The Lord spake "face to face with Moses, as a man speaketh to his friend". (Exodus 33:11) What an honour to confer on a man, beloved friends!
In Hebrews 13 we read that the Lord in order that He might sanctify the people with His own blood, suffered "without the gate"; He must go outside the camp. It is there, that we find Him. The action of Moses confirms the action of every one in the camp who loves God; "every one which sought the Lord went out unto the tabernacle of the congregation, which was without the camp", (Exodus 33:7)
There were some who worshipped in their tent doors, but a man's tent door is no place in which to worship God but those who sought Him went outside the camp. It was divine instinct in Moses which led him to pitch the tabernacle outside the camp, far off from the camp, and he gave it a name: he called it the "tent of meeting". What a provision for the people; what a provision for those who recognised the rights of Jehovah! Jehovah had a tent, and faith in Moses leads him to pitch it afar off from the idolatrous camp, and there it becomes the tent of meeting. Those who recognised God did not remain in their own tent doors, but they went forth to Jehovah.
There has been an action, for God of this character in our own day, and many have had their eyes opened to the divine movement in God's mercy. We have had to take account of the action of a man, or of men, as done in the recognition of what is due to God, and in following the divine movement, we have found that it means an immense increase of blessing for the people of God. In Moses' day the cloud of glory descended there, outside the camp, and the Lord spake with Moses, and Moses returns again into the camp. But there was one man who remained in the tabernacle; he departed not out of the tabernacle; he never left it. Moses was the one who set up the tent of meeting, but his servant Joshua, "a young man", departed not out of it. I think there you get the two offices of the Lord; He is both Apostle and Priest. We see the honour conferred on the Apostle, but there is the one, too, with power to lead the people in, and He never leaves the tabernacle. Thus we know Him spiritually today. I have no doubt we shall find both these things, if we are content to be led by the Lord.
Christ Himself deliberately suffered without the gate; the Lord did it that He might sanctify the
people with His own blood. He sets forth the path of sanctification for us. In His consideration for us, in His thoughts for us, He chooses to suffer in that way, outside the gate of Jerusalem. He was looking on to conditions such as we find at the present day; He knew what would come in, and He goes outside to suffer. God had no place in Israel; the death of Stephen proved that He had no place among them, and the Lord foresaw it, and He acted in view of it, and suffered without the gate, that the people might go outside to Him.
The atmosphere in the camp today is absolutely deadening; it is stifling to every spiritual instinct, and the Lord wants us outside; He died outside. There are conditions in the camp which are poisonous, and the Lord in His compassion for you would have you outside; outside with Him. The apostle calls upon us to go out to Him. "Let us go forth therefore unto him without the camp, bearing his reproach". (Hebrews 13:13) It cannot be anything but a condition of reproach in the eyes of the camp. Moses accepted the reproach, and more, he valued reproach; he had learnt to esteem the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures of Egypt, for he saw what was invisible. Reproach is not only a duty if we consider for God, but it is treasure. The Spirit of God gives the name to what Moses accepted and appreciated, He calls it the "reproach of Christ". The position involves the reproach of Christ, but that is treasure.
Well, the ark of the covenant must regulate everything, and the result is that we "go forth". The apostle here says, "Let us go forth therefore unto him without the camp". It is "unto him", as if the affections of the apostle were engaged with that One alone.
We might ask: How can we approach to God? What about the worship of God? How is it to be sustained? Is there not provision for the worship
of God in the camp? No; the camp does not truly afford the conditions for the worship of God now, since Jesus has died outside the gate. He could say, "The hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father". And again, "The hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth". (John 4:21,23) It is the sanctified ones, those separated from the world, who worship the Father today; and Christ is the measure of the sanctification. "For their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also may be sanctified through the truth". (John 17:19)
We need not fear, Christ is sufficient to maintain the worship of God; we have an altar. There has never yet been a time in the world when there was not an altar; the altar is the place of sacrifice. We are given an opportunity for sacrifice; that is the thought of an altar. There is a place where we can offer to God continually the sacrifice of praise, and where we can do good and communicate; these are sacrifices with which God is well pleased. It is well worth while, beloved friends, to please God; the great end in sacrifice is to please God. You might have very expensive things to offer, but the point is, do you seek to please God? The widow woman who cast two mites into the treasury was pleasing to God, for she cast in her all. So there is a place of sacrifice afforded to those who are apart from the camp, and their sacrifices are well-pleasing to God.
Now as to Exodus 20, the thought of blessing is intimately connected with the recognition of the Lord. The altar is alluded to, and it is to be made of earth. There is nothing very showy about it, it is not conspicuous, so that you do not assume anything. Then, a further thing, you are not to go up by steps to God's altar, "that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon". It is an awful thing to be
discovered to be naked in connection with the things of God. To be naked is that your flesh is disclosed as acting in connection with God's holy things. That is obnoxious to God; the altar would be polluted by man's tool upon it, but I do not speak of that, but of the blessing that God brings in in connection with the place of His name. He says, "in all places where I shall make my name to be remembered I will come unto thee, and bless thee". Where does He make His name to be remembered? In the hearts of His saints. We have to look at these thoughts spiritually, everything is spiritual in divine things. The absence of steps or of hewn stone must be taken up spiritually, and so here again, when it is a question of His remembrance, that also must be looked at spiritually, as setting forth the place He has in the affections of His saints.
Here it says, "in all places"; it is not here the thought of the one place to which all the males in Israel were to come three times in the year, but in all places where I record my name, "I will come unto thee, and I will bless thee". What a comfort to us! What a provision for us! Even now we can come into this blessing; it is the great end that God has before Him with regard to us; He will come to us, and there He will bless us, "there will I bless thee".
May the Lord bless His word to every one of us!
Exodus 25:10 - 16; Exodus 28:1 - 5; Isaiah 42:1 - 8; Hebrews 3:1
My thought is to show the connection between the ark and the high priest. I wish to dwell upon each separately, and in pointing out the contrast between them, to show also the connection that exists between them.
The ark, as most of us here know, has reference to Christ, and the high priest in Israel represented Christ. It is in that way that they become of such interest; indeed, it is thus that the Old Testament becomes of such interest to those who love Christ, I doubt whether any one reads the Scriptures with heart interest until he loves Christ; you may dwell upon the type, but your heart is engaged with the antitype, and I desire, beloved friends, that that may mark our meeting now; that whilst I seek to engage you for the moment with the types, your hearts, by the Spirit, may be engaged with the antitype; that is, with Christ. No type can exceed in interest the ark of the testimony, and in one point it is very like that of the high priest, for it represents Christ with something in His heart; the law of God; whereas that which the priest had in his heart was the saints. I wish you to bear this in mind for we have to take account of the Lord here in this world in connection with the will of God, and then we have to take account of Him in connection with the saints. The high priest had the saints in his heart; I refer to the breastplate as you will understand. That was one great feature of the high priest, that he represented Christ as having the saints' in His affections.
What I would point out as to the ark is that the
predominant feature of it is not exactly that it was heavenly; whereas the predominant feature of the priest was; the type suggests to us that the priest is heavenly. You will all remember that Exodus 28 is taken up almost entirely with the description of the dress of the high priest; the colours referred to, by the Spirit, in the description of the dress convey to us the characteristics of Christ, as Man, in relation to, and as having to say to God, as approaching God, and the predominant colour is blue. There are other colours mentioned which have reference to the earthly side of Christ's official glory, but the predominant colour in the dress of the high priest is blue.
Now when you come to the ark, you are struck immediately with the fact that there is nothing said about colour at all. The point in the ark is, that it was made of shittim wood and it was overlaid with gold, and it was to contain the tables of the covenant. Now that is what I want to dwell upon. By the Lord's help, I desire to show you, that the Lord has to be taken account of here in this world as appearing amongst men, and as the One capable of taking up the revealed will of God and carrying it into effect. I desire, that our hearts might ponder that. The great thing in view was that the divine glory might be sustained here, but evidently the shittim wood has to be taken account of. Primarily the great thing that God had in view was to have a Man here through whom He might carry out all His will. Adam had failed in that, but God would wait, and He did wait. He waited for that which the shittim wood represented. One loves to think of God waiting for that. I desire to enlist your sympathy in that respect as to God; He had His mind set upon man, but God could wait. One great attribute in God, one might say, is that He can wait. God will wait; He will wait for the suitable material for the
effectuation of His purposes. He waited after the fall of Adam; He waited for the Man. Christ Jesus. I think of God taking Moses up to the mount; the law in principle was given to the camp below. He takes Moses up to the mount Sinai, and the first thing He speaks to Moses about is that which was in His heart; the first thing He speaks about to His servant is the ark of the testimony. It was that, that He had in His heart. He looked on to a Man here upon the earth, moving under His eye; every motive of that Man was Godward; every aspiration had God as its object; every movement of His heart had reference to God; that was a delight to God to unfold to Moses the ark. He says, "make an ark of shittim wood" and He gives the dimensions. It was a delight to God to dwell upon those dimensions, to dwell upon that wood, as representing that Man whose every movement of heart had God as its object. God speaks to us later through the prophets and He says "Behold my servant whom I have chosen, my beloved, in whom my soul has found its delight", (Matthew 12:18). How do you take account of that? I take account of it as referring to Christ, and to what He was here for 30 years. That of which God had spoken to Moses, that material, those dimensions given in His instructions to Moses, all that, beloved friends, had taken form in a Man here on earth. Let us think of that. The wood of the ark speaks of the humanity of the Lord Jesus, and now God says "I will put my spirit upon him"; (Matthew 12:18). He can put the gold upon that vessel.
If ever I hear of a brother undertaking to serve Christ, to serve God, I want to know his past history. God always takes up a man in reference to his past history. Every servant of God is set apart from his birth, and all the divine dealings have reference to the gold. What God has in His mind is the gold. He intends to set the gold before men, but before
you have the gold you must have the wood. If you have not the wood the gold would be discredited. Paul says God set him apart even from his mother's womb, and called him by His grace. Every servant is taken account of by God from his birth, and before God, as it were, puts the gold upon the vessel, there must be the wood.
As we look at Christ, it is important that we dwell upon what He was personally. I believe it is of the Spirit that the deity of the Lord should be put into evidence in every bit of ministry. The cherubim of glory over the mercy seat suggests to our hearts that there must be a guarding of that Person. He is what He was and what He ever will be as to His Person, but let us think of the wood; think of that Man here in this world where all was opposed, where there was such absence of sympathy, even from those akin to Him in the flesh. Mary says "thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing"; (Luke 2:48) they had no idea who was there; but the Lord says, "wist ye not that I must be about my Father's business". (Luke 2:49) As Man here, He was personally equal to that which He was to sustain in testimony; He was to be covered with the gold. God was to set there the full weight of the divine glory, and that was to be displayed in that Man. What food there is for our souls in Christ viewed in that light here in this world; moving about in a scene that was contrary to Him, every movement of His heart had reference to God.
That is the idea I have of the ark of the covenant. It is Christ in this world where everything is contrary, sustaining the full weight of the divine glory. I have often thought that we too little consider what it was for Christ to take up God's law; what power was required for it. We do well to consider the conditions into which Christ came, every part of the world and its whole power turned against Him. Now I say consider the power that was necessary to stand
against that, yet, not one iota of the divine will was surrendered for a moment; it was in His heart, "Lo, I come to do thy will, O God!" (Hebrews 10:7) "I delight to do thy will O my God!" (Psalm 40:8) I say, what power was required. I have no doubt the wood, as typifying Christ's humanity, was divinely selected. It was most durable, and hence we have in it the suggestion of the power that was in Christ inherently in carrying out the will of God here upon the earth.
Well now, God says in the Prophet, "Behold my servant whom I uphold, mine elect in whom my soul delighteth", (Isaiah 42:1) I understand that to be the ark of the covenant; "my servant whom I uphold, mine elect in whom my soul delighteth". Now notice, He says, "I will put my spirit upon him". (Matthew 12:18) That is what I understand to be the gold. "I will put my spirit upon him". You can all recall the remarkable incident of the Lord's reception of the Spirit in the gospel of Luke. He appears in baptism, and He comes up out of the water, and He is praying. There He is; the Man who delighted in the will of God, and He is dependent upon God here. The Spirit came upon Him and Jehovah says, "I will put my Spirit upon him", and then God says, "he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles. He shall not strive nor cry; neither shall any man hear his voice in the streets", (Matthew 12:18,19) God puts His Spirit upon Christ, and then you have the unfolding, in testimony, of God.
Now what was the result of that, beloved friends? I appeal to you who know the Scriptures. It is of all moment to know the Scriptures. If you read this prophet Isaiah you will find the great controversy is between God and idolatry, and now that He has a Servant, now that He has a Vessel, He puts His Spirit upon Him, and the conflict is on. I want you to understand that the conflict continues.
There are two great forces in the world, one is lawlessness, and the other is idolatry; they are linked together, and in the ministry of Christ God has taken issue with the lawlessness of man, and the idolatry of man! I want you to consider that. God found His servant in whom His soul delighted, and He put His Spirit upon Him. "He shall not fail nor be discouraged"; that is the ark of the covenant. "He shall not fail nor be discouraged till he have set judgment in the earth", (Isaiah 42:4) that is Christ. God took public issue, in the ministry of Christ, with the lawlessness and the idolatry of man, and if you read the gospels in the light of these two thoughts, I think you will get great help from them. Then there is a third great issue which is obvious; and that is, the issue between life and death. That issue had been raised in the garden of Eden, the question of life. Is the question of life to be solved? I want you to bear in mind that God has found His vessel, and has put His Spirit upon Him, and that now the conflict is on. Think of Christ in that position; think of the tremendous power; the almighty power that was required to carry out the divine mind. Christ was anointed of the Spirit, and He is led of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil; that was in order that it might be brought into greater evidence who and what that Man was. He returned from the wilderness the victorious One. Think of the power of Christ here in subjection to God. He bound the strong man in the wilderness, and returned in that power, in that same Spirit into Galilee, and hence the glory is shown resplendently in that wonderful ministry before men; but the conflict was on. The question of God's rights in the heart of man had to be solved. He was the only God, the only object who deserved the adoration of man. The Lord undertook to make that evident. God had rights over man. He was the only true God. With
what delight the Lord Jesus brought that into evidence before men. Now, in this chapter God says "my glory will I not give to another", verse 8. You will have noticed the verse, "and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images". You remember when Moses came, down into the camp, the glory had been changed into the similitude of an ox that eateth grass, Psalm 106:20. Such is the heart of man.
The Lord Jesus undertook in His ministry here to establish in this world, in the power of the Spirit the testimony of the true God. God could not suffer, He will not suffer, His glory to be given to another. What a solemn consideration for Christians; that the spirit of idolatry may find a place in our hearts. What does that mean? That means that God is deprived of His glory, and He will not suffer it. The Lord Jesus came into this world to set that aside, and you may depend upon it, that God will not suffer it. He established too the principle of righteousness, He established it here in Himself as Man-before God; He loved righteousness; He fulfilled it as a Man before God. Where every other had failed, He established the principle of righteousness. Where these two things are found in man, the establishment of the rights and glory of the true God, and the full absolute recognition of the righteousness which goes with it, that man is entitled to live. So the Lord Jesus has, in this world established His title to live before God. As Man personally, in the place He took here in this world, He has established His title to live before God.
I just add another word to that and it is, that, on the ground of that He dies. The Lord, personally established His title to live in the presence of God, but He died so as to establish a title for others, for men. He has annulled death and brought life and incorruptibility to light in the gospel. The apostle
John in his writings insists uniformly upon the sonship of Christ, and that everything must depend on the Son. He says, "he that has the Son has life, and he that has not the Son of God has not life". (1 John 5:12) Now what I understand by that is that everything is in that Person. The point is not that the persons who have life are sons, for John does not develop sonship in regard to the saints, but he does insist uniformly upon the sonship of Christ, and that everything depends upon that Person and that without that Person there is no life; he that has that Person has life.
When you come to the high priest you find the Scriptures enlarge upon his dress. You will remember the idea of the wardrobe in Scripture; Huldah was the keeper of the wardrobe. The idea of dress is extremely important and the Scriptures emphasise it. Now in the matter of the dress we are wearing we have to be brought into accord with the ark of the covenant and the high priest, and if I understand the epistle to the Romans, the point is to bring the saints into accord with the ark of the covenant. I think it is evident that everything must be made to depend upon doing the will of God, I mean upon a Man doing the will of God. Apart from that it is impossible that you can have unfolded the heavenly side of the truth. Now, the epistle to the Romans sets forth how the saints are brought into accord with Christ viewed as the ark, and I think the epistle to the Hebrews shows us how we are brought into accord with the high priest. I would ask you to consider the dress of the priest. The apostle calls upon the Hebrew Christians to "consider the Apostle and High Priest"; to consider Him well. One feels that a great cause of weakness and want of apprehension of divine things amongst us is due to the want of considering things.
We are called upon to consider the High Priest
of our profession. Our title to divine things is not made dependent upon our state, but our enjoyment of them is entirely dependent upon our state. Paul says, "Wherefore holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling" that is the light in which we are viewed. We are entitled to take account of ourselves in that light, as holy brethren, and as partakers of the heavenly calling.
In the epistle to the Romans, the point in regard to our position on earth is that "the righteous requirements of the law should be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to flesh, but according to Spirit", (Romans 8:4). Now that is what I understand to correspond in the saints to the ark of the covenant. There is a great deal in that, a great deal more than you may think. The apostle speaking of himself, says, "I delight in the law of God after the inward man", (Romans 7:22). Now that is exactly what Christ said. He delighted in the law. He loved it. The apostle says, I delight in it after the inner man and when you come to chapter 8 he not only delights in it, after the inner man, but he has a power to correspond with it in his ways. He says, "the righteous requirements of the law should be fulfilled in us who walk not according to flesh, but according to Spirit". (Romans 8:4) That is for testimony here where the law was broken, but when you come to privilege, God would impress upon us that we have part in the heavenly calling. Look at the high priest, He wears the breast-plate. What do you understand by that? I understand by it that when Christ went into the presence of God, it was made evident, that He had the saints in His heart. He had the breastplate on. He had the saints in His affections. What did He do when He went to heaven? "Being by the right hand of God exalted and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this". (Acts 2:33). What did He receive
the promise of the Spirit for? Why did He ask for the Spirit? It was because of the place the saints had in His affections. What did He have down here on earth in His heart? What He had in His heart here had reference to God, the law was in His heart. Now what is in Christ's heart up there? Do you not know it, beloved brethren? Your names are in His heart. One cannot press it too much. Every believer's name is in the heart of Christ up there. When down here, God's law was in His heart and He maintained it where everybody was breaking it. That is, as I say, the ark of the covenant, but up there nobody breaks it. Well, what has Christ in His heart up there? He has the saints in His heart. What encouragement! He has gone in, and the breastplate is there as He enters into the presence of God, and He asks from the Father the greatest possible gift the Father can give. He asked for the Holy Spirit and He imparted the Spirit to the saints below. Now that is our High Priest; but then that is not all. We have to consider the wonderful garments that He wears; the wonderful garments of glory and beauty, and it is from these that what is heavenly shines out. In carrying out the divine will the heavenly breaks in, so to speak.
The carrying out of the divine will here involved the cross, the lifting up of the Son of man. In John 3 for instance, the blue shone; it came into evidence that the Man, who was all the time maintaining God's will, and delighting in it here, was heavenly. The light breaks in in the most marvellous way. Jesus said, "no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven", (John 3:13). What a shining of the blue that was. You recall there was a robe entirely of blue on the high priest, it was woven throughout, entirely of blue; presenting
to our hearts the heavenly character of Christ, the second Man out of heaven. As you proceed in the chapter, John the baptist recognises the blue. Nothing can exceed the moral greatness of John here; at no time does his moral greatness appear to such advantage as when He says, "He that cometh from above is above all", (John 3:31) "He must increase but I must decrease". (John 3:30) It is grand to see the man who was the greatest born of women, the greatest of the first order, disappear in the presence of the heavenly One.
Well, the Lord goes up, and He has the saints in His heart and He asks from the Father the promise of the Spirit, and He sheds it forth. The possession of the Holy Spirit by the saints constitutes them related to the High Priest, and if we are related to the High Priest the Lord can address us as His brethren. It is evident that to be consciously linked up with our High Priest, we must have the Spirit, and in the reception of the Spirit from a heavenly Christ we are constituted heavenly, no other family shall have the Spirit as we have Him. We have the Spirit in a peculiar way; the Spirit is given to us from the Christ in heaven, and the reception of the Spirit constitutes us members of the house of Aaron. We are thus clothed with garments of glory and beauty as Aaron's sons were. As I have already pointed out the greater part of Exodus 28 is occupied with the description of the dress of Aaron, but when you come to the close of the chapter the sons of Aaron are also clothed with garments of glory and beauty. Beloved brethren, we are linked up with the High Priest, and thus Paul says in the epistle of the Hebrews that the sum of all he had been saying was this, "We have such an High Priest ... minister of the sanctuary and the true tabernacle which the Lord pitched and not man". (Hebrews 8:1,2) The epistle of the Hebrews does not develop the priesthood in regard to us;
what it does develop is, the greatness and glory of our High Priest, in the strongest possible way, saying too, that "such an high priest became us, holy, harmless, undefiled, separated from sinners, and made higher than the heavens", (Hebrews 7:26).
We are called upon to consider that Person, and I would close beloved brethren, with an appeal that we should distinguish in our minds between Christ viewed here in this world as carrying out the will of God, and Christ viewed as the Leader of the heavenly host. They are two distinct thoughts, they are combined in Christ, but they are entirely distinct, and they have to be maintained distinctly in our souls, I believe where we are defective is in not considering, and as I said, I would appeal to you to consider the High Priest as He is presented to us in the Scriptures, and as we understand Christ, we shall understand the nature of our calling.
The Spirit of Christ gives character to the whole book of Psalms. You will find that the Psalms contain celebrations. A song is more strictly a celebration than a psalm. A psalm is usually the expression of experience, the medium through which the writer gives expression to experience, whereas a song is usually a celebration; in most cases songs are celebrations of victories. It occurs to me that each believer should have his own song, and each his own psalm; that is, on the one hand we ought to be able to celebrate what God has done for us, outside of ourselves, and also to give expression to what God has done in us. The former is a song, the latter a psalm. Perhaps among the people of God there is a great lack of songs and, psalms. An example of a song in Isaiah 26"In that day shall this song be sung in the land of Judah". What is the theme of it? "We have a strong city; salvation will God appoint for walls and bulwarks". (Isaiah 26:1) Now, there is a celebration. The singers shall be in the light of what God has accomplished for them. He has established a city for them, and that city has walls, and the walls are divinely appointed. They are salvation; that is, salvation composes the walls. I take that to be a sort of indication of what the people of God had at the outset of Christianity: they had a strong city, and God had appointed walls to it. They were not simply taking refuge in it, they were celebrating its existence. They recognise the city, and they recognise that the walls are salvation; they take account of the existence of these things. I take that to be what should mark us in the light of Christianity. We recognise what God has established here on earth. In other words,
the city is supported by the kingdom. I hope you understand that. A city is a sphere of rule and influence, but it requires protection, and God has appointed protection; He has appointed salvation for walls.
Now, where is salvation? I refer to this to indicate how Christianity stands. The gospel was set in relation to the assembly, and the enemy took account of this and set to work to attack the city, for in order that the gospel might be obliterated and effaced the church must be destroyed. The position and importance of the city came to light in connection with David. The enemy sought to attack it. What did the Lord do? Have you ever in your history been attacked by the devil? If you have not, I will tell you why. You have never raised your colours. What I mean by raising your colours is that you are true to your baptism. You did not baptise yourself, but you are responsible to be true to your baptism. You are baptised to the name of the Lord, and that is in the light of the kingdom. Now you have to be true to that, and if you are true to that you hoist your colours. You give public notice that you are on the side of the Lord. Now, if you do that, you will be attacked by the world. The standard has never been raised yet but what it has been attacked. And now, what? The Lord undertakes to defend the colours you raise. The Lord has charged Himself with the protection and support of His standard; to raise it is your salvation.
To come to the Acts: the assembly was attacked. The apostles and believers had raised their standard. There were no half measures in those days, they took sides with the rejected Nazarene. Look at Peter's testimony: "This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner". (Acts 4:11) What a courageous testimony! There the standard of Christ was raised up in presence
of the world, and the Lord defended that. The apostles were attacked mercilessly by the leaders of Israel. Saul came out boldly to attack every member of the assembly, to overthrow what God had established, but it was invulnerable. It seemed a critical moment; everything seemed to be going before the wind, but the Lord's voice is heard from heaven, and Saul is subdued. Have you ever been attacked? "Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be delivered". (Acts 2:21) There is no possibility of final defeat. There were many prayers in those days. In Acts 4 we are told that Peter and John, being let go, went to their own company. The whole world was against that tiny band, but they lifted up their voices with one accord to God, and the place was shaken. The power of God was there and surrounded them, so that they could not be crushed. So in chapter 9, when the very existence of the assembly and the gospel was threatened, the Lord's voice is heard out of heaven, and it brought down at one stroke the combined power of the world. That power, religiously and politically, was centred in Saul, but God had appointed salvation for walls, and He brought Saul down at one stroke. That ought to be the theme of our song. When attacked by the wicked one, how happy to turn to the Lord.
You remember how Paul speaks of the name of the Lord, saying, "If thou shalt confess with thy mouth Jesus as Lord", (Romans 10:9). See how the apostle looks at things: "If thou shalt confess with thy mouth". Do you do that? In your business place, and in every circle outside of the sphere where the Spirit of God is, the influences are against you; now what are you to do as to these influences? Are you to succumb, and be quiet, or are you to speak? The elders of Israel commanded the apostles not to speak at all nor teach in the name of Jesus. They did not enjoin them not to believe,
but not to speak or preach. Satan will let you alone if you keep your mouth closed. "If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus"; (Romans 10:9) that is raising the divine standard. When you confess Jesus as Lord you give notice to the world that power belongs to that Man. You give public notice that government is in the hands of Christ. What will happen? You set your face against the world, and there is conflict at once. Well, that is your moment of triumph. It is then you realise that the kingdom is not a myth, it is a reality. I beg of you to try it; put to the proof that Christ is Lord by giving forth that you are on His side. You shall be attacked, but you realise that the Lord is for you, and who can stand before Him, who brought down Saul, that man of power, at a stroke? As the result of his overthrow the assembly had rest; rest is secured behind those walls strong and high. The saints recognised the One who had power, and were edified and multiplied, Acts 9:31. It was due to the Lord that they should sing this song: "In that day shall this song be sung in the land of Judah: We have a strong city; salvation will God appoint for walls and bulwarks". (Isaiah 26:1)
The occasion of the singing in Psalm 113, is not the city but "the name of the Lord". The Lord is not here on earth, but His name is here, and the psalmist is engaged with the name of the Lord. It is a great thing to get hold of the Lord's name; it represents His authority, everything done now by intelligent Christians is done in the name of the Lord. Now the Lord is in an official place, as the king is, and everything done in His interests here is done in His name, and this secures His support. Hence the preaching of the gospel is carried on in the Lord's name, and salvation is in His name. But now the psalmist is engaged with the name for its own sake. Do you cherish the name of the Lord?
When I think of it I think of the four gospels. I think of that marvellous pathway of Jesus, His many mighty works of power, His affection for His people, His unswerving devotion to the will of God. Put all these things together, as they are blended together by the Spirit of God, and you get the name of the Lord. It is fragrant; it is to be praised from the rising of the sun to the going down of the same; the whole sphere is to be filled with that glorious name. How do you regard that worthy name which is called upon you? Is it with you the occasion of praise?
I want to show a little what marked the Lord. Verse 4: "He is high above all nations". This is a great day for nations. It is not a day of universal empire, as in ancient times, but a day of great and mighty nations, possessing wealth and power, and vieing with each other. The Lord is above all, and more, His glory is above the heavens. Who is like unto the Lord who dwelleth on high? His glory is above the heavens. His name is to be praised from the rising of the sun unto the going down of the same, and He has title to exalt Himself to dwell on high. He humbleth Himself to behold the things that are in heaven and in the earth. You may think yourself a tiny mite in the world, but the Lord humbleth Himself that He may behold you. Think of Him in the gospels. What minuteness of detail we get! The Lord takes account of poor needy ones. Think of Him taking account of Peter. He had humbled Himself to the position of a fisherman. He descended to that position; He did not come in connection with great wealth and renown; He came in connection with the lowest of people. He humbled Himself to be there. Ah! beloved friends, He did. He was near enough to that fisherman to ask him for his boat. He who could exalt Himself to dwell on high, whose glory is above the heavens,
He said to Peter: 'Simon, let me have your boat'. He would be near to Simon. Why did He want Simon's boat? The cattle of a thousand hills, and all the boats and the timber of them were His, but He wanted Simon. He humbled Himself to discover Himself to Simon. I cannot go into it, but the details are most interesting. "Let down your nets for a draught", He says. There was an immense draught of fishes; the nets brake, but the work was done. The Lord has accomplished His design. Peter says, "Depart from me, for I am a sinful man, O Lord".
Now note this. The recognition of the Lord in your soul is the beginning of the end; you shall never be right with God nor with men until you recognise the Lord. It is the primary element in the soul of man. "Lord, what wilt thou have me to do?" Paul said. It is an age of lawlessness; young people are drawn into the sphere of lawlessness. "Depart from me", Peter said, "for I am a sinful man, O Lord". I say, how perfectly the Lord accomplished His design. Peter fell down at Jesus' knees. The Lord descends into Peter's boat, to become attractive to Peter. Peter recognises his sinful condition and the next character that appears is a leper. Peter was the leper. The Lord discovers Himself to Peter, and Peter is repentant, and as such is in the position of the leper; and the judgment that attaches to the leper is that he had no place in the camp; he is outside; but the Lord touches the leper, and he is cleansed.
This only serves as an illustration of how the Lord humbled Himself to behold the things in heaven and in the earth. "He raiseth up the poor out of the dust". That is where we are; man is in the dust. See His wonderful work, in other instances, in the gospels. "He raiseth up the poor out of the dust", and what does He do? He is waiting on you
to take you up out of the dust and give you a place among princes. It is a great thing to be illuminated in that way. He only can do that. He only can put you in the society of true nobility. I do not know how you take account of nobility, but there is no nobility on earth now, in God's account, that is not after the pattern of Christ. Nobility in God's account is seen in Christ; to be noble is to do the will of God, and he who does the will of God is signalised in some way by God. God ennobles you, God will never confer on us, in any official way, what we are not equal to morally. Christ was anointed, but He was equal to the anointing in His Person, He had proved Himself equal to it. He was entitled to it, entitled to the Messiahship on the ground of what He was personally. What the Lord proposes to do is to take you out of the dust and to ennoble you. Man is degraded to the dust on account of losing his position in regard to the will of God. The Lord removed vicariously all that lay on you in judgment; He removed it through His death, and what more? He intends to ennoble you. How is man ennobled. Jacob was ennobled. "Thy name shall be called no more, Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed". (Genesis 32:28) In other words, Jacob was already a prince morally, and God changes his name; that is, God formally recognises what you are; "by the grace of God, I am what I am", (1 Corinthians 15:10) said the apostle. Whatever you are, you are that by the grace of God, but God gives you credit for it, and ennobles you formally. He makes you a prince. Every Christian has the spirit of a prince. What a thing to be among princes! You are a prince, and you have ample means, and a heart to dispense them. You have all the wealth of God and ability to dispense it. Have you appreciation of this great dignity? There are many claimants of your soul. The world claims it
and the devil. There are many bidders: the Lord bids for it, and He has paid a price. He shows that He values it. "He raiseth up the poor out of the dust and lifteth the needy out of the dunghill; that he may set him with princes, even with the princes of his people". What a thing to be numbered among the princes of God!.
Then "He maketh the barren woman to keep house, and to be a joyful mother of children". I believe the housekeeping spirit is very little known among the people of God. There are many phases of the Christian position in the world, warrior, priest, Levite, and so forth, but one thing God looks for; and a thing that every right minded man looks for in his wife, is the housekeeping spirit. God has a house down here. The Lord is the Man of the house. The Lord is in heaven, and what He looks for in us down here is the housekeeping spirit. We are set here in relation to one another. The greatest test to a man's faithfulness is to serve in the house of God, and the testimony in regard to Moses is, that he was faithful in all God's house. Moses possessed in a remarkable degree the spirit of the house-keeper. He was faithful in all God's house. Now, if you are a believer in Christ, you find how He acts for you; He raises you up from the dunghill, and sets you among princes; endows you in every possible way; gives you His Spirit; puts dignity on you, but the question arises, What are you to do? You are not taken up to heaven at once; if you obey your parents, and there is submission, you have the promise of long life here; you have the honour of being left here to carry on the testimony in Christ's absence. Well, the Lord sets you to housekeeping. That is a test to your spirit. To keep house, you have to set yourself in relation to the saints. You have to see that the saints are in order. And what is the stand-by? Love is the great stand-by. What a
thing for Christ to look down and see the reflection of Himself in our affection for one another! There is no possibility of going on in the light of the house apart from mutual affection.
Then you get multiplication: "to be a joyful mother of children". If there is affection and the housekeeping spirit, you are multiplied. If there are great additions, and large numbers of people brought in, and not a housekeeping spirit, what happens? You feel sad to see a large family without a housekeeping spirit. A disorderly family, and that a large family, is a moral blot; so, in the psalm, the housekeeping spirit is put before children. If there is not a housekeeping spirit, great additions are simply weakness and a moral blot. See the great additions in Christendom, but where is the housekeeping spirit? The idea of housekeeping precedes multiplication; but how happy where love is active, and then you get increase. In Acts 2 you get one hundred and twenty together; there is, as yet, no multiplication, but there was loyalty of heart to Christ, and then children were added, three thousand of them. They were brought to a warm place, to a sphere of affection. The Lord had made the barren woman to bear children.
I trust the Lord will use the word to make us desire a housekeeping spirit that there may be multiplication.
Acts 13:1 - 3
I call attention to this scripture, beloved friends, desiring to give you my thoughts upon it, especially because it shows how the Christian economy shook itself clear of what one may call the legal trammels that held it within abnormal or restricted bounds at the outset. It is important to see that in the ordinary course of the development of the testimony there was a gradual cutting loose from earthly moorings, until it is seen enshrined in that which is living and abiding. The apostle, in writing to the Hebrews, refers to something similar in speaking of the purification of their consciences, that they might serve the living God; and the service of the living God necessarily implies a living order of things. Until it found itself, as it were, enshrined in that order, of things, there was movement. Movement always implies that the testimony had not found a resting place, so that there was gradual movement until the service of God, the living God, could find itself in connection with others who were sympathetic with it; and, as you can see, the assembly at Antioch was in sympathy with it. There the ministry of the Lord went on, as it says, they ministered to the Lord.
Now, beloved brethren, it is my thought and desire to dwell upon that. I wish to impress upon each one in a simple way, that that is what each of us is called to. The great thought that God has in leaving us here, instead of taking us to heaven, is that there might be a continuance of His service. It is a wonderful thing for God to establish that in which His service is protected, while the world power remains untouched. Now I say, that that is the great end God has in view in calling us out of the world,
leaving us actually in it, but free from it morally, so that there may be a continuance of divine service.
You will recall how, in addressing Pharaoh, the Lord habitually, in each message, reminds him that the object He had in view in delivering His people was, that they might serve Him. In fact, going back earlier in their history, you will remember that Moses received his commission at mount Horeb, and the Lord told him that the token of their deliverance should be that His people should serve Him there. They should serve Him at mount Horeb. Now mount Horeb is not in Canaan, as you know; mount Horeb is in the wilderness.
As far as I can remember, Pharaoh was not reminded of Canaan. He had nothing to do with that. He had to let the people go three days' journey into the wilderness. There was to be something established this side of Canaan. God spoke to them of the service which should have its commencement and its existence at mount Horeb. I want you to take note of that, beloved friends. I call attention to it because of this, that the thought of God is to establish His service here as a testimony, and to support it with a power adequate to maintain it as a witness in the eyes of the world. If He can establish the testimony here. He is sufficient to protect it; and, that testimony and power being established, He can formulate the law that governs the system; and if He can organise the system, He can both obtain the servants and the service in the presence of the world. That is a wonderful thing.
Now, in order that the service should be introduced, it was essential that the apostle and the high priest should be brought to light. We have to learn everything from the apostle. He brings out thoughts and develops them before us by the Spirit and enables us to understand them. Now in the book of Exodus, in chapter 6, you find that the
Spirit of God gives a list of the heads of the fathers of the tribes of Israel. That was what God had in His mind. He had the tribes in His mind. They were to be, as far as the mind and purpose of God then went, set up in Canaan. Each tribe was to have its own, place in the land that was promised to Abraham. In token of the fulfilment of His promises, He reveals Himself to Moses and the people by His new name of Jehovah, which signified that He was undertaking to fulfil His promises.
Well, now, the Spirit of God goes on to give the list of the fathers; and what you find is, that when He comes to Levi He stops. One would like to stop there. There are such things in the Scriptures as divine interruptions, but, as a rule, indeed always, they are pleasing to God. God stops, as you may remember, in giving the generations of Jacob earlier in the book of Genesis. "These are the generations of Jacob -- Joseph", (Genesis 37:2), and no other generation is given. It is only when Jacob and his sons and their household are on the way to Egypt to see Joseph that the other generations are taken account of. In an earlier chapter you will find the generations of Esau, and there is no interruption. The course of the man of the flesh is pursued to its end. God allows the man of the flesh to pursue an uninterrupted course in this world, until he attains to the highest position. There were kings of the line of Esau before there were any kings of Israel.
Well, now, when you come to the heads of the fathers in Exodus 6, you find that Levi is the great terminus. The families of Levi are given, and then we have, "These are that Moses and Aaron, to whom the Lord said", (Exodus 6:26). The Spirit of God brings into prominence the apostle and the high priest. Having the apostle and the high priest, you have a guarantee for the deliverance of the people and the establishment of what was in God's
mind, and that is service. Now one can well understand the apostle saying to the Hebrew Christians, "Consider the apostle and high priest", (Hebrews 3:1) as though we are to await the accomplishment of the promises to the fathers. In the meantime we are to consider the apostle and high priest of our confession, and I want you to consider the great High Priest, to consider Christ, dear friends. He has brought in a new system. See how the apostle puts it. He has come "by a greater and more perfect tabernacle", (Hebrews 9:11). He has come in in connection with a divine tabernacle, and that is not of this creation, and it is in connection with that which is introduced that we get the service of God.
Next I want to show you, if I can, how the wisdom of the Lord influenced those who came under His teaching. You will remember that Moses received on the mount this communication about the building of the tabernacle, but he did not build it. He was not the constructor; he did not actually make the things. He received the pattern of the things, but there were two wise men in Israel, divinely endowed with wisdom, who put the tabernacle together.
When we come to the gospels, what I understand by them is this: they present to us Christ, who in divine dignity has come out from God to show us divine thoughts. All the divine thoughts are there, and they are unfolded in divine wisdom. Love lay behind everything that the Lord did, and all was in divine wisdom. What I understand by wisdom is that it is the handmaid of love. Love lay behind all the Lord's movements, and so we see divine wisdom. You can add nothing to it, and you can subtract nothing from it; everything is just as it ought to be -- it is divinely perfect. That is what I see in the gospels. Those who came under the Lord's influence received the spirit of the Lord's ministry, so that what you find is, that their movements
are generally in accord with it. In the Acts, whilst there is a full recognition of the Lord's authority, the Spirit of God presents their actions as they took place.
Now you are not to misunderstand me; the Lord's authority is fully recognised. God allows you to do things, and what you do proves just where you are spiritually, as He gives you light. Now, the proof of your soul being in the good of the light, is in your movements after you receive it. If you take the Lord's wonderful ministry, those who came under it were affected by it. You remember the Lord's word. He said, "Wisdom is justified of all her children", (Luke 7:35). Not of one, but of all. Take the book of Acts. The gospels present to us the ministry of Christ. It is all wisdom. There is the love of God behind it, there is wisdom in the expression of it, and there is power in the fulfilment of it. The Acts present the same things that come out in Christ in the gospels. In other words, the book of the Acts is the justification of the gospels, because the Acts present the children of wisdom. The gospels present wisdom in a Person. The gospels present a Man, the Acts present the woman, the assembly. But it is the same thing. "Wisdom is justified of all her children". (Luke 7:35) There is not a child of wisdom anywhere who does not justify wisdom. How do we justify wisdom? We justify it by movement in accordance with it.
Take the earlier chapters of the Acts. The Spirit of God presents to us what the disciples did. Not what the Lord told them to do, but what they did. It is a most interesting and extensive theme; I can only touch upon it. They were together with one accord in chapter one. They recognised the authority of the Scriptures. That was wise; the Lord recognised that too. They were in accord with the Lord. That was well; they had gathered that
from the Lord. And so with everything. They were in prayer. The Lord taught them that. They were found together; they had one mind. Well, the Lord brought that in. You know the great basis of unity is the unity between divine Persons. "I and my Father are one". (John 10:30) The Lord introduced that, and they were one. They had learnt that from the Lord. They were morally according to wisdom. They were the justification of the gospels. They were the justification of the ministry of Christ. Was His ministry a failure? There was the justification of it. His mission was no failure; it was justified by these people. They justified what Christ did. What He introduced they justified.
There are many other things that one might mention. As you remember, they did not break bread during the time that the Lord was with them. They did not take the Lord's supper, so far as we know; but directly the Lord went to heaven they did. That was right. Nothing is said about the Lord's supper during the forty days of the Lord's sojourn amongst them.
The Spirit tells us that "they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread and in prayers" (Acts 2:42). Now that is remarkable. It reminds one of what you get in the last two chapters of Proverbs; there are weak things, but they are wise, and they know what to do. The children of wisdom recognised existing conditions. They took account of the fact that the whole world was lawless. There was one Man in whom God had vested authority -- Christ. That Man was no longer here, He was in Heaven, but He had delegated His authority to the apostles. They recognised that. We have not the apostles now, but we have the authority of their teaching. Now they recognise that, and it says that they continued in it, in the recognition of it. These are
very practical things. They continued in these things; they were essential to their safety. There was the lawless world around them, and they recognised that God had vested authority in a Man, and that Man had delegated His authority to twelve men. The teaching was continued by them. They were teachers divinely accredited by Christ, and all outside was lawless. These men regarded anything that was outside the teaching of the twelve apostles as positively lawless. The early disciples saw that. They recognised the apostles' teaching and fellowship. They recognised that which their hearts really cherished, and they had the breaking of bread, that which would sustain their hearts and remind them of their absent Lord in the scene of His rejection. And they recognised prayer. Now I refer to all these things especially to point out that they are the evidences of the children of wisdom, and that they are the justification of wisdom.
There is one thing said in Acts 2, and that is, that they broke bread in the house instead of in the temple, which, to my mind, is a very touching allusion to their appreciation of the Lord's supper. However much they recognised the temple they did not break bread there. They broke bread at home. It is a touching allusion to the place the Supper had with them. They loved the Lord and they loved the Supper, because it was that which brought vividly before them the affection which was in the heart of the blessed Lord on the night of His betrayal.
Well, now, what I would like to point out is this, that as the testimony developed, the children of wisdom were equal to it. They were equal to the circumstances. And when we come to chapter 20 we find ourselves in a Gentile town, and there are disciples there. And we are told what they did, not what they were told to do, but what they did. And what they did was right. What did they do? They
came together to break bread. Now in the second chapter it does not say they came together to do it; they did it in the house. But in the twentieth chapter they came together.
What I understand by that is, that they see that the temple is superseded. You may say "they came to break bread". But it does not say just that. You may say you come to break bread on Lord's day morning. That is not right; you should come together first. You may say that is only a matter of a word, but I think I can show you, beloved friends, that the word involves a principle. The fact is this: that the word together involves the displacement of the whole Jewish economy. The coming together of the saints involves that they know nothing outside of that, no religious ceremonies or furniture of any kind. The temple necessitated a huge system of ceremonies, garments, and so on, but the coming together displaces all that. Do you not understand that that little word together delivers you altogether from the system of religion, the Babylonish system that exists around us today? It is not easy to be delivered from these things if once you have been entangled with them.
You come together because your heart is filled with the love of Christ, and you want the company of the saints. You cannot get the company of the saints in the humanly organised systems; it is impossible that you should. You have something in your heart that must be reciprocated in a heart like to yours. Well, that is a heart under the influence of the love of Christ. Men and women are brought under the influence of the love of Christ, and the effect of that is, that they come together. They love one another, because they love Christ. It is what, as I understand it, answers at the moment to the greater and more perfect tabernacle. It is a moral idea. It is something that is for God. It is
similar to what the Lord said to the Samaritan woman. "The hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth". (John 4:23,24)
Now I would like to say this: you will never understand Christianity until you see how the early Christians acted. They came as it were fresh from the effect of the ministry of Christ, and they came together to break bread. I only refer to it, I cannot dwell upon it any longer. You have in the coming together of those who love Christ, the greater and more perfect tabernacle. That is the antitype of what Moses effected. Moses led the people out of Egypt to serve God; but they were to serve Him as knowing His heart. You never serve God if you do not know His heart. They knew His heart by His covenant.
Now in 1 Corinthians you have the terms of the covenant. The second epistle presents to us the man who is formed by the spirit of the covenant. In the first epistle the apostle presents to us the Spirit, and the Spirit presents the terms of the covenant. The second epistle gives you the spirit of the thing. Paul is the man who is formed by the Spirit. You remember it says, "the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life", (2 Corinthians 3:6). Paul was in the spirit of the covenant; he was formed by it. Well, it is the people that are formed by the spirit of the covenant that serve God.
Well, now, you see these people here. In Hebrews the apostle says, "How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God", (Hebrews 9:14). I do not know if you have taken it into account, but I think that the idea of the living God
is most prominent in the Scriptures that have reference to Jewish believers, because they were accustomed to a dead system. They were to see that the new order had reference to a God that was living and revealed to be such in the resurrection of Christ from among the dead. There is a beautiful passage in Hosea: "After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight", (Hosea 6:2). That means that you are raised up in the power of God and made to live in His sight. The word live refers really to the quickening power of God; you are made to live, you serve the living God. That is the divine thought, and that is what I had in my mind to present to you.
I read that passage in Acts 13 to show you how the testimony had freed itself from the Jewish setting, and breathed the atmosphere of liberty. Outside of Jewish territory or Jewish setting there is the service of God. No longer in Jerusalem, no longer in the temple, but established in living men in the Gentile world. That was a great triumph for God. They had the ministry of the Lord, and they were equal to it as regards themselves, for they fasted. If we are to be equal to the heritage that our fathers have handed down to us, we must be prepared for it. Are we equal to it? What is required is fasting. They ministered to the Lord and they fasted. That is how the thing is continued. You may depend upon it, that if we do not fast, there will be no continuance with us. As I understand it, fasting is a complete deliverance from fleshly desires. "We are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh", (Philippians 3:3). That is Christianity. It answers to the Lord's remark that the hour had come when the true worshippers should worship the Father in spirit and in truth.
May the Lord grant that these simple thoughts may affect us, that he affections of the saints should be gathered in Christ. That is the idea, I think that there may be such an appeal to our hearts that there may be an answer in the assembly; in he book of Revelation she invites Him to come. "The Spirit and the bride say, Come". (Revelation 22:17) "Even so, come, Lord Jesus". (Revelation 22:20)
What I have to say stands in connection with the three lines spoken of in this verse. I have before me to show the different testimonies for God, and, to call attention to the intent of each. And when I speak of the different testimonies I speak in a very general way, embracing under the first line the law and the prophets, and under the second line Christ down here in the flesh, and under the third line Christ in resurrection.
You will understand that in using a scripture in this way from the Old Testament it is not to present it in a dogmatic sense. I think we are allowed by the Lord great latitude in ministry, in the use of the Scriptures. They are said to be "profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness", (2 Timothy 3:16); and I think a minister is given, as it were, certain latitude, by the Spirit, in his use of them. They are said to be profitable; that is to say, they help in the ministry of the truth, they help in the way of showing how it is set, its bearing; and I would say in that connection that the Old Testament is as much for us as the New. We read: "Whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning", (Romans 15:4). So that you will understand, that in using these Scriptures, I do it to endeavour to make the truth clear to you.
This verse is found in a peculiar connection. In the previous verse David is seen smiting the Philistines and taking out of their hands Metheg-ammah, which, as you may know, is the bridle of the Mother (city); it was the capital. What a thing it is to see the power taken out of the hands of the enemy and placed in the hands of Christ! Before David's day the people were dominated by the Philistines.
That marked, the situation, and Saul failed utterly to cope with this. We are told that he was to "come to the hill of God, where is the garrison of the Philistines", (1 Samuel 10:5). It was a serious matter, that the hill of God was in possession of the hostile power. Well, that was a reminder to Saul of what he had to do; he was to understand that that evil power must be dislodged. He never really answered to the charge, hence it remained for David to face the situation and overthrow the Philistine.
We are all held under some influence. I know the influence that God intends should affect us, and it is the duty of the preacher to make that clear, but you may be certain that you are under some influence. What we see here is that David takes that which dominated the situation. He smote the Philistines and subdued them, and took Metheg-ammah. I wish to show you the setting of the passage. David takes out of the Philistine's hands the bridle. Now, apply that to Christ; power is in His hands now, instead of in the hands of the enemy. Let me ask you whether you are really, in subjection to Christ? He has power whereby "he is able even to subdue all things to himself", (Philippians 3:21). To-day He is bringing souls into subjection, having gone on high, as we have been noting. You will remember how David referred to the sword of Goliath. He said, "there is none like that". (1 Samuel 21:9) It was the means in the hands of David of overthrowing the Philistine's power. The Lord took that which was the great weapon in the hands of the enemy in holding His people in terror and in bondage, that was death. What souls require is light. You want to see the full bearing of the death of Christ. The full bearing of it in this respect is, that He has wrested death out of the hands of the enemy, and having done it, He has gone up to heaven with the symbol of His triumph.
You will remember that David took the head of the giant to Jerusalem; he took there the testimony of his triumph. So Christ has gone into heaven. It is in this way that we are to understand the bearing and power of the kingdom of God. And in connection with this there is the purification of the conscience. A good conscience is by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, for He died for our sins, and was raised for our justification, 1 Peter 3:21; Romans 4:25. Before you can have a good conscience you must have a bad one. The effect of the light of God thrown into the soul is to produce a bad one; and this leads to exercise which is met by the gospel. The gospel is the power of God, because therein is the righteousness of God revealed, Romans 1:16. The righteousness of God is seen in the death and resurrection of Christ, and by this the believer has a purged conscience. But you want more than a purged conscience; you want Christ in heaven, and so the apostle goes on to say, "who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him", (1 Peter 3:22). All power is in the hand of Christ. What a great thing then the kingdom is! The Lord Jesus Christ has wrested the power from the enemy, and He wields it in heaven, and He intends that it shall exercise sway in your heart. That is the setting of this verse.
We come to Moab now. Philistine power is the religious power by which people are held in bondage; religion may be used to hold your soul. When you come to Moab you come to man as he is; man as he is is very proud. You remember what is said about Moab. "We have heard the pride of Moab (he is exceeding proud) his loftiness, and his arrogancy, and his pride, and the haughtiness of his heart", (Jeremiah 48:29). Now, there are two lines for death. You may wonder how it is that God should
have a testimony for death, but I think we can understand it if we understand what Moab represents. There are two lines for death and one full line for life.
I think you will find that wherever three, things are put together on the part of God, they refer to what may be termed complete testimony. If you get two things put together on the part of God you have adequate testimony. When you come to the complete testimony on the part of God, you have the means whereby God secures His end. The third full line has reference to God's end for man. This is eternal life. It is a most interesting subject. I was speaking this afternoon to some of you as to what the Spirit of the remnant in the day of Hosea said: "Come, and let us return to the Lord: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up. After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight", (Hosea 6:1, 2). They knew that God would do these things on account of light afforded them. God had rendered light and their faith was based on this. They did not stop with being bound up, if God creates a wound He will bind it up; they say, "After two days he will revive us". (Hosea 6:2) That involves waiting, patience, but there is the testimony, which they understood. The third day is the day in which He secures His great end for Israel and for man, and it answers really to this third line, "one full line to keep alive".
Now I take the first line to be the law and the prophets; that is, classifying them together, which I think Scripture supports: the Lord says, "The law and the prophets were until John, since that time the kingdom of God is preached", (Luke 16:16). The kingdom of God was distinct from the law and the prophets. In rendering the testimony of the kingdom, in His ministry here on earth, the Lord
was "the glory of God". What must the glory do? The law effected death, clearly, and the glory of God, coming in as testimony, can only convict man of his state, even more surely. There can be no question that the law is the first great line for death. It was holy, just and good. It was ordained for life, but in result, it was found to be for death. It asserted God's authority over man, but this only brought to light that man was utterly lawless, and so under the penalty of death. The apostle says, "I was alive without the law once", (Romans 7:9). I do not say he was alive to God, he was alive to himself, his conscience did not smite him; "But when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died". (Romans 7:9) That is what I understand to be the first line of death. It was ordained for life, but it brought in death.
Has that testimony any weight with you? You must not think that it is not intended for you. I take the law to be intended for us in that respect. The law is a divine testimony, and has many bearings; by law is the knowledge of sin. Now one inquires as to whether it has rendered that service to all present? We have very little knowledge of ourselves. The apostle says, "I was alive without the law once" (Romans 7:9); his conscience was in the dark. How many young men and young women walk about on this earth as if they were entitled to live, and without any conscience of their state before God, without any sense of their sinfulness? The apostle says, "When the commandment came, sin revived, and I died" (Romans 7:9); the effect is to smite you in your conscience, so that you are utterly without standing in the presence of God.
Now there was the second line, which had the same effect exactly; the second line is the glory of God presented in Christ here in the flesh. The apostle says, "All have sinned and come short of the glory of God". (Romans 3:23) Sinning refers to transgression,
and without law there is no transgression; sins are put to account where there is law. Then there is the additional thought of the glory which shows how utterly wanting men are. The glory is what Christ was here in the flesh. The Psalmist says, "He delivered his strength into captivity, and his glory into the enemy's hand", (Psalm 78:61). That was an allusion to Christ as here in obedience. Wonderful testimony on the part of God! He said, "Lo, I come to do thy will, O my God". (Hebrews 10:7) These were the words He uttered as He came into the world. There was not only the thought of carrying out the divine counsels from eternity, but He was taking up a position as Man; He was entering into man's estate; He was entering into every detail of man's circumstances on earth; and in every detail there was the presentation of God, and the shining out of the glory. It was what man should be for God. Would that our souls could lay hold of that.
God said, "I am the God of Abraham". (Genesis 26:24) What that meant was, that He was the God of that kind of man. As a man of faith, Abraham was, in God's account, after the order of Christ. Think of what Christ was here; God is God of that One. Do you understand what I mean? God does not commit Himself to all; He is God to that One; and what I say to Christians is this; Christ has brought us into His own position Godward. He said to His disciples, "My God, and your God". (John 20:17) But in the gospels God was God to the Man who moved for Him here; every pulsation and every movement of His life was to answer to God; He was the Man that God's heart had set itself on. That is the idea of the glory. Adam was but a figure of Him that was to come. Christ is the One that was to come, and has come into human circumstances, and as here He was God's glory, God's glory is the measure for every man.
The application of the measure only shows how utterly short man has come of it, and hence his case is altogether hopeless if left to himself. He is appointed for death. God has no pleasure in literal death; He has no pleasure in the dissolution of His creature; but He does desire to bring the element of death into your conscience, so as to lead to exercise. This is by the law. The other testimony I spoke of was even a greater one, more comprehensive. That is Christ as God's glory. "All have sinned and come short of the glory of God". (Romans 3:23) There is the standard, and God brought in a perfect standard, and that is the glory. Whilst, on the one hand, you are made to realise that you must be shut out for ever from that glory as on the ground of the flesh, on the other the gospel shows, that it is God's thought that man should be at home in the presence of it, and that He can accomplish this consistently through the death of Christ.
I want to go on to the third line. The third line is called the full line. I connect it with Romans 5. I take that chapter to be the full life line. God has found the means of purifying man's conscience. The blood of Christ on the mercy-seat does this, as we learn in Romans 3. In the light of this you are no longer under death in your conscience. Paul says, "I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth ... for therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith", (Romans 1:16). As I understand it, it is the power of God in the first instance, as affording a good conscience. A good conscience is moral power. It is not the Spirit's power here. A good conscience is moral power: "The righteous are bold as a lion". (Proverbs 28:1) Has everybody here a good conscience? If you have never had a bad one, you have not a good one. The Holy Spirit is also power in the believer, of course, but that is
another matter. A good conscience and the power of the Spirit go together. A good conscience is by the blood of Christ.
Having a good conscience - justification -- the believer is prepared to apprehend God's purpose for men, which is eternal life, and I connect this, as I have said, with the "full line for life". God had devised that man, that order of being, should be preserved. Man was wisdom's ideal, Proverbs 8, and so he must be made to live. I desire to say a word about that in closing. Man must be made to live. Hence there is one full line for life, and that is through Christ in resurrection. How great is God's victory in Christ's resurrection! Man has brought us life! Read Romans 5, from verse 12 to the end. There is the abounding of things through Christ, and all in the line of the accomplishment of God's great purpose of blessing for man. "That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord". (Romans 5:21) The whole passage taken together is to emphasise the magnitude of the present position of grace in regard to the race of Adam. Grace is on the throne. What a happy thought that is for a purged conscience. You have to do with grace. The idea of a throne is that it is absolute. The throne in Scripture is in no sense modified, it is absolute. If you put grace on such a throne as that, what an economy that is! Absolutely nothing but grace for the soul. The law came in by Moses, grace and truth have their subsistence in Christ. Grace establishes your heart in confidence in God. To give you an example of the reign of grace, I would refer you to the Lord's instruction to the apostles to begin at Jerusalem the preaching of repentance and remission of sins in His name, Luke 24:47. Where sin had been at its highest, there forgiveness is preached.
In Romans 5, the blessing is through Christ. That word. through, therefore, directs your heart to Christ. If you have righteousness and life, it is through Christ Jesus. It is intended to have a moral effect in your soul. He has a claim upon you. In the sixth chapter the expression changes; it is in Christ Jesus, verse 11. The apostle treats in these six chapters of the question of man's relationship with God in righteousness and life here on earth; and he shows that through Christ Jesus our Lord man is brought into life, and that that life is in Christ Jesus our Lord. In other words, chapter 5 shows that you are indebted to Christ for eternal life, and chapter 6 shows that it is an "act of favour of God" for you in Christ Jesus. Christ acquires a place in your soul, on the one hand, and all your hopes and desires are centred in Christ on the other. That is the effect of the gospel. I do not think it is fully effective in us until every thought and every affection converge on Christ. The gift of eternal life is in Him, and it is in Him for all men, but only possessed by those who believe.
May God help us to understand the full bearing of the gospel, as that in which life and incorruptibility are brought to light.
2 Corinthians 5:13 - 18
The thought in my mind was to seek to show how we are led on to the side of divine purpose, and I ventured to read this scripture because it sets forth the judgment formed by one who knew what it was to be there. I like to refer to this epistle because it shows us the spirit of Christianity; not exactly as it was seen in Christ, but as it was seen in a man of like passions as ourselves; that is the apostle Paul, and in that way it is brought nearer to us. I do not deny that it was brought near to man in Christ; this is seen in Elihu, who said to Job: "I am as thou ... my terror shall not make thee afraid". (Job 33:6,7) Christ drew near to men as Man, so that the things of God, and God Himself, might be understood; that is what the gospels present to us; they present to us what Christ was as a Man come near to men. He was in that estate in lowly grace in order that God might be known. The epistles show us that that was effective, that what Christ was here among men was reflected in others, and particularly in Paul. This is seen in a very marked way in the second epistle to the Corinthians. It shows us the spirit in which we have to say to God and to one another, and in which we move toward the land of Canaan.
Now I desire to enlarge on these points as I am enabled of the Lord, because it is of great moment that we should enter into the divine side of things, into the purpose of God; and, as I said, it begins with a right judgment being formed. One would question one's own soul and others as to what kind of judgment we have about things. I refer to the judgment we have formed as the result of the gospel
that has come to us. If you have not come to form a judgment as to things here, it is not likely that you will ever give them up. You will accept them as a matter of course and go on in them, such as the political system under which you have been born, the social conditions, the commercial relations, and the ordinary family relations, with the duties attendant upon them. All these things are accepted as a matter of course. We have very little thought about them, except that we go on in them. The thought of God is to set our hearts and minds in movement in regard to all this. The gospel comes to us, as light on the part of God, and it is intended to set our hearts and minds in movement, and if they are thus affected the result is that we begin to form a judgment about things around us. People who have no definite judgment as to conditions in the world are unreliable as to the testimony. The apostle says, "we thus judge". He had formed a judgment about one thing, and that was that if One died for all, then all were dead. You may say that man goes on the same after the cross as before; that he is not any more dead now than before the cross. The fact is, he was dead before it as much as after it. You may say, I do not understand that; people seem to be alive. How many years will they live? It is a matter of a few years, and all will have left this scene that we know now, and if it is a matter of forty or fifty years until death actually occurs, that does not set the fact aside that all are dead. God speaks of things that be not as though they were. If you are to die next year, you are as good as dead. Death is on all as a divine penalty. The apostle's judgment is right; he did not judge by outward appearances merely, he judged from the moral side: "If one died for all, then were all dead". It is useless to establish anything on the fact that man lives for a few years, for that is merely a matter of God'sTHE TESTIMONY (NO. 2)
BAPTISM AND FELLOWSHIP
THE SPIRIT AS POWER IN THE BELIEVER
THE BREAD OF LIFE
GOD'S WAY LEADS TO THE GLORY
OUTSIDE THE CAMP
THE ARK AND THE HIGH PRIEST
THE NAME OF THE LORD
"THEY MINISTERED TO THE LORD"
THE LIFE LINE
ENTRANCE INTO THE PURPOSE OF GOD